View Poll Results: street driving w/out front sway bar?
yes I do it-not that dangerous
260
57.65%
no-I like corner carving-it's too dangerous
191
42.35%
Voters: 451. You may not vote on this poll
street driving w/out front swaybar?
04-26-2008, 11:39 AM
#221
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Wow, what a thread. I came here because my car will be without front bar while I'm having it and a 3rd Gen IROC/GTA type 24mm bar powder coated. I just wanted to see what to expect if I drive it. It's seems like some who should know better think I'll die a fiery death when I take my first curve. Funny thing is that when I searched the 3rd Gen big rear bar topic many had the same opinion about installing one with a factory 4th gen front bar, that it'll be an uncontrollable mess and it'll crash. People over estimate the importance of these bars for traveling at street speeds.
Installing a smaller front anti-sway bar, like from a base model, along with slightly longer than normal end links is a good inexpensive compromise. This may be a route some should take for a dual purpose street and strip car. It's not as ideal as disconnecting the bar at the track but it is easier and safer than going without one on the street. Controll is an illusion that nobody ever has, you do what you can with what you have and hope for the best. This concludes my facts portion contribution.
Here's some of my opinions, just because one modifies a car for increased performance in one area that decreases it in another does not make that person a moron. Not everybody has the same performance goals or drives the same way on the street in spite of thier mods. I'd say morons will cause a crash no matter what they do to it. Put one in Sam's car in Houston and watch it happen. It's not relavent to their intelligence level that someone who knows what they are doing has made their car less stable and yet relatively contollable and drives in public. The driver is the most important safety and controll element. Suspension and brakes while important, still fall behind operator input. IMHO anyone who degrades others so strongly just for doing something so minor in signifigance is out of line.
Also IMHO from personal experience it is better to hit someone who pulls out in front of you if all will survive the impact unless you are completely sure you will not suffer any consequinces by swerving away. In Texas if you are in an accident caused by avoiding someone else doing something wrong you are at fault 100% for anything you incurr afterwards unless you in some way collide with the offending vehicle FIRST no matter how minor the contact. I once had to swerve around a SUV full of teen agers U-turning across an intersection against a red light, I was traveling at the speed limit, laid on the horn and started braking full ABS as soon as he started darting, but we were too close to avoid a collision. I swerved around them. The kid stopped just in time and we missed by inches but left me with a sidewalk and telephone pole to deal with. I jumped the curb and grazed the pole with my RF fender and wheel. They ran so I tried to chase for a block but the car was too hard to steer with a bent spindle and tie-rod and they were SUVing WOT through a parking lot full of pedestrians. I had two people that were just behind me stop and give their witness information, also I went back to the corner station and found another eyewitness. They all agreed the kid was at fault and verified my story, wished me luck etc. The police caught them within an hour near-by and I got all thier insurance info. In the end, I was at fault for my own collision because I didn't hit them first. It's a damn good thing I didn't kill any innocent by-standers because of me being good enough driver to avoid a moron, as it would have been my fault had I mowed down anyone standing there. Next time this happens to me unless there's nothing I can loose by going around the idiot I'm going to center punch them (well at least knock a mirror off). If my bad *** car can't be fixed then insurance will buy me another one and I won't have an at fault collison on my driving record and some punk azz kids laughing at me for causing it. Hopefully a moron will learn something from it but I have no control over that. And if they get hurt, better them than me or someone else who doesn't deserve it.
Vernon
Installing a smaller front anti-sway bar, like from a base model, along with slightly longer than normal end links is a good inexpensive compromise. This may be a route some should take for a dual purpose street and strip car. It's not as ideal as disconnecting the bar at the track but it is easier and safer than going without one on the street. Controll is an illusion that nobody ever has, you do what you can with what you have and hope for the best. This concludes my facts portion contribution.
Here's some of my opinions, just because one modifies a car for increased performance in one area that decreases it in another does not make that person a moron. Not everybody has the same performance goals or drives the same way on the street in spite of thier mods. I'd say morons will cause a crash no matter what they do to it. Put one in Sam's car in Houston and watch it happen. It's not relavent to their intelligence level that someone who knows what they are doing has made their car less stable and yet relatively contollable and drives in public. The driver is the most important safety and controll element. Suspension and brakes while important, still fall behind operator input. IMHO anyone who degrades others so strongly just for doing something so minor in signifigance is out of line.
Also IMHO from personal experience it is better to hit someone who pulls out in front of you if all will survive the impact unless you are completely sure you will not suffer any consequinces by swerving away. In Texas if you are in an accident caused by avoiding someone else doing something wrong you are at fault 100% for anything you incurr afterwards unless you in some way collide with the offending vehicle FIRST no matter how minor the contact. I once had to swerve around a SUV full of teen agers U-turning across an intersection against a red light, I was traveling at the speed limit, laid on the horn and started braking full ABS as soon as he started darting, but we were too close to avoid a collision. I swerved around them. The kid stopped just in time and we missed by inches but left me with a sidewalk and telephone pole to deal with. I jumped the curb and grazed the pole with my RF fender and wheel. They ran so I tried to chase for a block but the car was too hard to steer with a bent spindle and tie-rod and they were SUVing WOT through a parking lot full of pedestrians. I had two people that were just behind me stop and give their witness information, also I went back to the corner station and found another eyewitness. They all agreed the kid was at fault and verified my story, wished me luck etc. The police caught them within an hour near-by and I got all thier insurance info. In the end, I was at fault for my own collision because I didn't hit them first. It's a damn good thing I didn't kill any innocent by-standers because of me being good enough driver to avoid a moron, as it would have been my fault had I mowed down anyone standing there. Next time this happens to me unless there's nothing I can loose by going around the idiot I'm going to center punch them (well at least knock a mirror off). If my bad *** car can't be fixed then insurance will buy me another one and I won't have an at fault collison on my driving record and some punk azz kids laughing at me for causing it. Hopefully a moron will learn something from it but I have no control over that. And if they get hurt, better them than me or someone else who doesn't deserve it.
Vernon
Last edited by Manic Mechanic; 04-26-2008 at 03:00 PM.
04-30-2008, 09:28 PM
#223
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I dunno, i'm thining about removing mine, but if i have an encounter like i did last year with a semi (moving into my lane while i was next to it), using my horn without a front swaybar might result in my car desintigrating.... 
04-30-2008, 09:48 PM
#224
i've had my sway bar back on for about 2 weeks now and am finding that i'm pushing the car more than i should in regular daily driving because it feels like i have more control due to less dippiing. pretty much unnecessary moves on the road because i think i can doesn't mean i should. i think that's what a lot of people are doing then wreck their cars.
04-30-2008, 10:25 PM
#226
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Gotta keep this thread going
05-02-2008, 05:14 AM
#228
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I took mine off about a year ago. A noticable difference in the way the front dipped and tilted in a turn. Since my car is not a DD and it helped a LOT at the track, I left it off. I've since added a Spohn drag bar, at a 35mph test speed, it has eliminated the dip and tilt. Not saying the drag bar is the answer or an acceptable replacement for the front bar but it does put more control back in the car. I'm keeping the front off 
Unless I take a trip to the mountains!!
Unless I take a trip to the mountains!!
05-02-2008, 06:35 AM
#229
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I drove mine to church Sunday without the front bar installed as it's at the powder coaters still. I did a few manuvers to see how the car would react and while the front end was moving around it never went out of control. What I realized is that in order for this imbalance to become a real problem you will have to be conering fast enough to break traction in the first place. Most people, especially those whose chassis is set up for drag racing, don't push cars that fast on the street. With 275mm low profile rubber and an relatively light wieght car you have to be pushing it beyond reason to slide it, and therefore deserve what you get if your back end slides out first and you can't control it.
Vernon
Vernon
05-02-2008, 10:04 AM
#230
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I drove mine to church Sunday without the front bar installed as it's at the powder coaters still. I did a few manuvers to see how the car would react and while the front end was moving around it never went out of control. What I realized is that in order for this imbalance to become a real problem you will have to be conering fast enough to break traction in the first place. Most people, especially those whose chassis is set up for drag racing, don't push cars that fast on the street. With 275mm low profile rubber and an relatively light wieght car you have to be pushing it beyond reason to slide it, and therefore deserve what you get if your back end slides out first and you can't control it.
Vernon
Vernon
Though I think that say if there was something in the road that fell off a truck and you swerving left and then right back into your lane might be a better example. That sort of mimics what you do in a slalom. I'm assuming this problem happens when the suspension snaps from one bumpstop to the other. If it gets to that point, I would say good luck trying to regain control.
Since most people who have their fsb disconnected most likely are running crap skinny front tires and wide r compound rear tires which would induce understeer, I'm assuming this kind of acts like a bandaid. You can't really make an extreme maneuver because the front tires probably don't turn enough to force the rear tires to move enough to lose traction.
05-02-2008, 10:19 AM
#231
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I pulled some weight outta my front end yesterday, one of them was the swaybar. Took to car out to a drive to the parts store to see how it drove. Some of the comments in here got my a little on the nervous side, since I'm out right now in more of the "mountain" part of the state, where its about 88% curved roads.
I took the first 2 corners at the speed limit and really didnt notice anything. Don't know if it felt any different, it may have been the fact that I was expecting something and assumed the car was rolling. So I went into the next corner, just past half way I let the car drift to the middle of the road then yanked it back, definitely saw the front end sway a good bit. Also nailed the brakes later to see how much it dove down.
After driving it about a 6 miles there in back from the parts store, I just drove it like I usually do and didnt notice, if at all, any real change. Now if I was someone who hot rodded their car around corners, or goofed off, yeah, I'd see the change. Mine goes to the dragstrip often and I get my rush there, for the most part i just cruise around, maybe 5 over and take it easy on the streats.
So in all, if your into going straight and have self control and want the added weight transfer, then pull it. If ya like going straight and road/auto cross, or you rarely go to the strip, pull a link. If you go to the strip once or twice, ever, forget about it.
I took the first 2 corners at the speed limit and really didnt notice anything. Don't know if it felt any different, it may have been the fact that I was expecting something and assumed the car was rolling. So I went into the next corner, just past half way I let the car drift to the middle of the road then yanked it back, definitely saw the front end sway a good bit. Also nailed the brakes later to see how much it dove down.
After driving it about a 6 miles there in back from the parts store, I just drove it like I usually do and didnt notice, if at all, any real change. Now if I was someone who hot rodded their car around corners, or goofed off, yeah, I'd see the change. Mine goes to the dragstrip often and I get my rush there, for the most part i just cruise around, maybe 5 over and take it easy on the streats.
So in all, if your into going straight and have self control and want the added weight transfer, then pull it. If ya like going straight and road/auto cross, or you rarely go to the strip, pull a link. If you go to the strip once or twice, ever, forget about it.
05-02-2008, 10:53 AM
#232
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Like what was said, given that you are just cruising around then you will notice the front end sways a lot more and the steering response isn't as good... that's all. You're not necessarily making any sudden snap maneuvers that way. Pretty much most people never have to make sudden maneuvers anyway unless they are avoiding hitting something or driving like an idiot on the street.
05-08-2008, 02:41 PM
#233
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Well, I guess you are very drag oriented in the US, I´m pretty sure nobody her in Europa would ever consider removing parts from the suspension. More the opposite, we like to ad bar 
05-14-2008, 03:24 AM
#240
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No rock crawling. I have a Burkhart anti roll bar on the rear end, I just have not taken the time to weld the brackets on. So it has no front bar and the rear anti roll bar is not hooked up. It drives fine in a straight line and thats what I built it for. 1.75 sixty foot and the car goes straight out of the hole so its no big deal. When I put the new motor in I will need the rear bar.