View Poll Results: Hot or Cols formed sway bars?
Voters: 3. You may not vote on this poll
Cold or hot formed sway bars?
08-14-2008, 09:26 AM
#3
TECH Enthusiast
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: New Orleans, LA
Posts: 556
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hot formed, then quenched with an oil bath is best. The oil bath will harden the exterior of the metal, making it more resistant to bending. This allows you to have a smaller bar with the roll stiffness of a larger one.
BTW, Spohn isn't the only one. Hellwig makes a 3/4" and 7/8" bar that is adjustable to be stiffer than a 1" non-adjustable bar. It doesn't "mount in the stock locations", but it uses existing holes and hardware. If you can switch out a regular swaybar, then you can put this in.
I use it for autox and road racing. But, I'd imagine this will be a killer setup for the strip. After all, how many street-friendly, stock-ish rear bars allow you fine tune your roll stiffness at the track?
Here are some pics:
BTW, Spohn isn't the only one. Hellwig makes a 3/4" and 7/8" bar that is adjustable to be stiffer than a 1" non-adjustable bar. It doesn't "mount in the stock locations", but it uses existing holes and hardware. If you can switch out a regular swaybar, then you can put this in.
I use it for autox and road racing. But, I'd imagine this will be a killer setup for the strip. After all, how many street-friendly, stock-ish rear bars allow you fine tune your roll stiffness at the track?
Here are some pics:
08-14-2008, 11:01 AM
#4
First off, we sell 1" rear bars.... and you can even get them in hollow versions.
Second, the hot vs. cold bent.... The only reason some "hot" bend bars is due to material. Chrome-Moly is more brittle than mild steel and needs to be heated to bend. And fwiw, all steel is heated. Our material is heat treated when it's made, not when the bar is bent. And becaue we use mild steel we don't need to re-heat it.
Second, the hot vs. cold bent.... The only reason some "hot" bend bars is due to material. Chrome-Moly is more brittle than mild steel and needs to be heated to bend. And fwiw, all steel is heated. Our material is heat treated when it's made, not when the bar is bent. And becaue we use mild steel we don't need to re-heat it.
__________________
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
18 SCCA National Championships in house, many more for our customers prove we know our stuff.Talk is cheap, results matter.
Check out our KONI prices, our Master Cylinder Brace, and new Xtracker Hub/wheel bearing upgrade kits!
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
18 SCCA National Championships in house, many more for our customers prove we know our stuff.Talk is cheap, results matter.
Check out our KONI prices, our Master Cylinder Brace, and new Xtracker Hub/wheel bearing upgrade kits!
08-14-2008, 02:30 PM
#6
TECH Enthusiast
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: New Orleans, LA
Posts: 556
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
They are $259 plus shipping, I think. You can PM Trackbird to see about ordering one.
As for setup and adjustment, it's very easy. You simply remove the bolt on the arm, move it forward/back and reattach.
As for the why, I can only respond from a road race/autox perspective - I'll let a drag racer respond from that perspective. Let's say you want to dial out a tight condition. I had this recently on a track that was green (just been rained on). The rear of my car hs both mechanical grip (from the tires and weight of the car) and aero grip (from the wing). The front of my car just has mechanical grip.
Because the track was less-than-grippy, I lost some mechanical grip both front and back. For the sake of arguement, let's say I lost 10% of my mechanical grip. On the front, I lost 10% of overall grip. But, on the back, since I have aero grip also, I may have only lost 5% of overall grip. This means that I now have more grip in the back than the front.
So, I wanted to loosen the car up. To loosen the car up, you want a stiffer rear bar. There's a very technical explanation why, but I usually get confused when explaining it, so I try not to! To stiffen up this bar, you simply shorten it by moving the bolts one hole in.
When I did this on the track, I then had a neutral car again to go qualify. Plus, once some rubber had been laid down by the afternoon race, I was able to readjust the rear bar again to tighten it up so that my car wasn't too loose during the race.
As for setup and adjustment, it's very easy. You simply remove the bolt on the arm, move it forward/back and reattach.
As for the why, I can only respond from a road race/autox perspective - I'll let a drag racer respond from that perspective. Let's say you want to dial out a tight condition. I had this recently on a track that was green (just been rained on). The rear of my car hs both mechanical grip (from the tires and weight of the car) and aero grip (from the wing). The front of my car just has mechanical grip.
Because the track was less-than-grippy, I lost some mechanical grip both front and back. For the sake of arguement, let's say I lost 10% of my mechanical grip. On the front, I lost 10% of overall grip. But, on the back, since I have aero grip also, I may have only lost 5% of overall grip. This means that I now have more grip in the back than the front.
So, I wanted to loosen the car up. To loosen the car up, you want a stiffer rear bar. There's a very technical explanation why, but I usually get confused when explaining it, so I try not to! To stiffen up this bar, you simply shorten it by moving the bolts one hole in.
When I did this on the track, I then had a neutral car again to go qualify. Plus, once some rubber had been laid down by the afternoon race, I was able to readjust the rear bar again to tighten it up so that my car wasn't too loose during the race.
Trending Topics
08-15-2008, 08:43 AM
#9
TECH Enthusiast
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: New Orleans, LA
Posts: 556
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I see no reason why it wouldn't hold up just fine. The bar itself is just as strong or stronger than any other bar. The brackets holding it to the axle are very beefy, as are the U-bolts. The bolts that are in shear configuration (chassis mount and the adjustable bolt on the bar) are 5/8" Grade 8 bolts, if I remember correctly. Those are the same size as the ones that hold in most aftermarket LCAs (Madman, Spohn, BMR), and larger than the bolts that hold the shocks.
BTW, Hellwig is the supplier for all Border Patrol 4x4 vehicles. They utilize the same production techniques on a bar for our cars as they do for those vehicles. I can't imagine that we put more stress on a swaybar than some 4x4 jumping dunes in New Mexico.
BTW, Hellwig is the supplier for all Border Patrol 4x4 vehicles. They utilize the same production techniques on a bar for our cars as they do for those vehicles. I can't imagine that we put more stress on a swaybar than some 4x4 jumping dunes in New Mexico.
