New BS law about dropping classes?
08-06-2008, 09:25 AM
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New BS law about dropping classes? What the heck is up, was going to look and see what class or classes I might be able to take this semester & noticed this:
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I've had to struggle with school on several occasions because of my work schedule and having a boss that would say he'd work around my schedule...then not...or I'd have to work a lot of OT on a project & need to drop a class. It shouldn't matter if you have to drop a class...if you PAY for the class, what's the problem?
My coworker can't get his Mechanical Engineering degree over some bull **** policy at UofH where you only get 2 attempts at this particular class that is mandatory for his degree. Not only have I heard from him, but other people that the professors there are craptacular.....he was telling me about this one teacher he has that's from China & all he talks about is how they do things in China....news flash, he's not in China anymore, if he wants to do it that way, he can take his *** back to China. He also never tested over totally random stuff, and never anything he lectured over. Why the hell lecture on stuff that isn't important....why the hell test on stuff if it's not important.
Schools have lost site of the fact that students are customers. College seems like such a damn sham. I especially hate those profs that require you to buy a book that they wrote....damn asshats.
TEC 51.907 San Jacinto College Six-Drop Limit Policy
A new law provides that undergraduate students enrolling as first-time freshmen at a public institution of higher education in Texas in Fall 2007 or thereafter will be limited to a total of six dropped courses during their entire undergraduate career.
INSTITUTIONS AFFECTED
Texas public community colleges, technical institutes/colleges, health science institutions offering undergraduate course work, and universities must comply with the legislation of TEC 51.907.
STUDENTS AFFECTED
Students who enroll as entering freshmen or first-time in college students in undergraduate courses offered through an affected institution of higher education for the first time during the Fall 2007 semester or any subsequent semester are subject to the course drop limit restrictions. Students who started college anywhere Fall 2007 or thereafter and then transfer to San Jacinto College are affected by the six-drop limit.
COURSE DROP DEFINITION
A course drop, which will be recorded on the transcript, is defined as an affected credit course not completed by an undergraduate student who:
1. Is enrolled in the course at the official census date*, and
2. Will receive a non-punitive grade of WL.
A new law provides that undergraduate students enrolling as first-time freshmen at a public institution of higher education in Texas in Fall 2007 or thereafter will be limited to a total of six dropped courses during their entire undergraduate career.
INSTITUTIONS AFFECTED
Texas public community colleges, technical institutes/colleges, health science institutions offering undergraduate course work, and universities must comply with the legislation of TEC 51.907.
STUDENTS AFFECTED
Students who enroll as entering freshmen or first-time in college students in undergraduate courses offered through an affected institution of higher education for the first time during the Fall 2007 semester or any subsequent semester are subject to the course drop limit restrictions. Students who started college anywhere Fall 2007 or thereafter and then transfer to San Jacinto College are affected by the six-drop limit.
COURSE DROP DEFINITION
A course drop, which will be recorded on the transcript, is defined as an affected credit course not completed by an undergraduate student who:
1. Is enrolled in the course at the official census date*, and
2. Will receive a non-punitive grade of WL.
I've had to struggle with school on several occasions because of my work schedule and having a boss that would say he'd work around my schedule...then not...or I'd have to work a lot of OT on a project & need to drop a class. It shouldn't matter if you have to drop a class...if you PAY for the class, what's the problem?
My coworker can't get his Mechanical Engineering degree over some bull **** policy at UofH where you only get 2 attempts at this particular class that is mandatory for his degree. Not only have I heard from him, but other people that the professors there are craptacular.....he was telling me about this one teacher he has that's from China & all he talks about is how they do things in China....news flash, he's not in China anymore, if he wants to do it that way, he can take his *** back to China. He also never tested over totally random stuff, and never anything he lectured over. Why the hell lecture on stuff that isn't important....why the hell test on stuff if it's not important.
Schools have lost site of the fact that students are customers. College seems like such a damn sham. I especially hate those profs that require you to buy a book that they wrote....damn asshats.
08-06-2008, 09:30 AM
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Yea, but that piece of paper will give me a nice increase in pay at this point in my career. I am a mechanical designer, I already do the same stuff an engineer does, I just don't get paid as much. Although I could go to some other companies & make more than an engineer if I wanted to be a slave to over time, but I rather enjoy being salary here & doing my 40 & going home.
08-06-2008, 09:46 AM
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Oh, I hear you. Believe me, not finishing college is one of my biggest regrets, and I do still want to go back and get my degree. I just got tired of the little games colleges play.
For example, when I took calculus at UT, it was two semesters and four credit hours each. So, I took Math 408C and 408D, then went on in the sequence and took Matrices, and Differential Equations. A few years later, I transferred to UH, where they had calculus split into three 3 credit hour classes. So the admissions lady told me I only had Calc I and Calc II, but needed to take Calc III. I explained that calculus is a two semester course at UT, so I didn't need to take Calc III. She said, "Yes, you do. You can't take any higher-level math classes without Calc III."
I said, "Ma'am, I've already taken Matrices and Differential Equations. Calculus is a pre-requisite for both of those classes. UT wouldn't have let me take them had I not fulfilled my calculus requirement."
She said, "UT does things differently than we do. You have to take Calc III."
"Ma'am, it has been FOUR YEARS since I took calculus, so this is setting me up for failure. Is there something else I can take that will fulfill my math requirement?"
"Let me check...yes! You can take College Algebra!"
"OK, so my options are calculus or ALGEBRA?!?!"
So I took algebra, got an easy A, and moved on with my life. Still, the whole situation was just absurd.
-Mike
For example, when I took calculus at UT, it was two semesters and four credit hours each. So, I took Math 408C and 408D, then went on in the sequence and took Matrices, and Differential Equations. A few years later, I transferred to UH, where they had calculus split into three 3 credit hour classes. So the admissions lady told me I only had Calc I and Calc II, but needed to take Calc III. I explained that calculus is a two semester course at UT, so I didn't need to take Calc III. She said, "Yes, you do. You can't take any higher-level math classes without Calc III."
I said, "Ma'am, I've already taken Matrices and Differential Equations. Calculus is a pre-requisite for both of those classes. UT wouldn't have let me take them had I not fulfilled my calculus requirement."
She said, "UT does things differently than we do. You have to take Calc III."
"Ma'am, it has been FOUR YEARS since I took calculus, so this is setting me up for failure. Is there something else I can take that will fulfill my math requirement?"
"Let me check...yes! You can take College Algebra!"
"OK, so my options are calculus or ALGEBRA?!?!"
So I took algebra, got an easy A, and moved on with my life. Still, the whole situation was just absurd.
-Mike
08-06-2008, 10:14 AM
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What the heck is up, was going to look and see what class or classes I might be able to take this semester & noticed this:
Source
I've had to struggle with school on several occasions because of my work schedule and having a boss that would say he'd work around my schedule...then not...or I'd have to work a lot of OT on a project & need to drop a class. It shouldn't matter if you have to drop a class...if you PAY for the class, what's the problem?
My coworker can't get his Mechanical Engineering degree over some bull **** policy at UofH where you only get 2 attempts at this particular class that is mandatory for his degree. Not only have I heard from him, but other people that the professors there are craptacular.....he was telling me about this one teacher he has that's from China & all he talks about is how they do things in China....news flash, he's not in China anymore, if he wants to do it that way, he can take his *** back to China. He also never tested over totally random stuff, and never anything he lectured over. Why the hell lecture on stuff that isn't important....why the hell test on stuff if it's not important.
Schools have lost site of the fact that students are customers. College seems like such a damn sham. I especially hate those profs that require you to buy a book that they wrote....damn asshats.
Source
I've had to struggle with school on several occasions because of my work schedule and having a boss that would say he'd work around my schedule...then not...or I'd have to work a lot of OT on a project & need to drop a class. It shouldn't matter if you have to drop a class...if you PAY for the class, what's the problem?
My coworker can't get his Mechanical Engineering degree over some bull **** policy at UofH where you only get 2 attempts at this particular class that is mandatory for his degree. Not only have I heard from him, but other people that the professors there are craptacular.....he was telling me about this one teacher he has that's from China & all he talks about is how they do things in China....news flash, he's not in China anymore, if he wants to do it that way, he can take his *** back to China. He also never tested over totally random stuff, and never anything he lectured over. Why the hell lecture on stuff that isn't important....why the hell test on stuff if it's not important.
Schools have lost site of the fact that students are customers. College seems like such a damn sham. I especially hate those profs that require you to buy a book that they wrote....damn asshats.
If you have taken classes before then or have registered with SanJac before Fall 2007 then you are exempt from that rule. Thats what I get from that.
So have you taken clases before Fall of 2007? Double check and call one of the advisors @ SanJac. Although you probably wont get much help from them, I never do.
The 6 drop limit applies to me. It sucks but keeps me focused on school a lot more.
Jon
Last edited by ProjecT 9; 08-06-2008 at 04:27 PM.
08-06-2008, 10:16 AM
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I just spoke with my coworker that is going to UofH & he said it pretty much applies to everyone, the only thing is, if you were already a student before then, they just don't count any of your past dropped classes, but you can only drop 6 from the inception of this law forward.
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08-06-2008, 10:20 AM
#8
Oh, I hear you. Believe me, not finishing college is one of my biggest regrets, and I do still want to go back and get my degree. I just got tired of the little games colleges play.
For example, when I took calculus at UT, it was two semesters and four credit hours each. So, I took Math 408C and 408D, then went on in the sequence and took Matrices, and Differential Equations. A few years later, I transferred to UH, where they had calculus split into three 3 credit hour classes. So the admissions lady told me I only had Calc I and Calc II, but needed to take Calc III. I explained that calculus is a two semester course at UT, so I didn't need to take Calc III. She said, "Yes, you do. You can't take any higher-level math classes without Calc III."
I said, "Ma'am, I've already taken Matrices and Differential Equations. Calculus is a pre-requisite for both of those classes. UT wouldn't have let me take them had I not fulfilled my calculus requirement."
She said, "UT does things differently than we do. You have to take Calc III."
"Ma'am, it has been FOUR YEARS since I took calculus, so this is setting me up for failure. Is there something else I can take that will fulfill my math requirement?"
"Let me check...yes! You can take College Algebra!"
"OK, so my options are calculus or ALGEBRA?!?!"
So I took algebra, got an easy A, and moved on with my life. Still, the whole situation was just absurd.
-Mike
For example, when I took calculus at UT, it was two semesters and four credit hours each. So, I took Math 408C and 408D, then went on in the sequence and took Matrices, and Differential Equations. A few years later, I transferred to UH, where they had calculus split into three 3 credit hour classes. So the admissions lady told me I only had Calc I and Calc II, but needed to take Calc III. I explained that calculus is a two semester course at UT, so I didn't need to take Calc III. She said, "Yes, you do. You can't take any higher-level math classes without Calc III."
I said, "Ma'am, I've already taken Matrices and Differential Equations. Calculus is a pre-requisite for both of those classes. UT wouldn't have let me take them had I not fulfilled my calculus requirement."
She said, "UT does things differently than we do. You have to take Calc III."
"Ma'am, it has been FOUR YEARS since I took calculus, so this is setting me up for failure. Is there something else I can take that will fulfill my math requirement?"
"Let me check...yes! You can take College Algebra!"
"OK, so my options are calculus or ALGEBRA?!?!"
So I took algebra, got an easy A, and moved on with my life. Still, the whole situation was just absurd.
-Mike
You should have told them the admissions department there needs to take "Common Sense 101".
Last edited by -Ross-; 08-06-2008 at 11:16 AM.
08-06-2008, 10:22 AM
#9
I just spoke with my coworker that is going to UofH & he said it pretty much applies to everyone, the only thing is, if you were already a student before then, they just don't count any of your past dropped classes, but you can only drop 6 from the inception of this law forward.
Students who enroll as entering freshmen or first-time in college students in undergraduate courses offered through an affected institution of higher educationfor the first time
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08-06-2008, 10:56 AM
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I hope he's wrong & that is the case. I like having the freedom to drop a class if life gets in the way of school. It's my damn money....I read up on why the state is doing this, it's because they provide funding for the schools based on the initial students/credit hours....well, if they are providing funding, why the f**k is school so f**king ridiculously expensive? If you have to take one or two classes at a time it's really expensive with all the retarded fees & crap you have to pay....the actual credit hour cost isn't the killer....
08-06-2008, 11:56 AM
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Here's why the rule came about:
When you pay your $200 to take a class at the community college, the $200 is NOT what it REALLY costs for you to take that class - the state kicks in a chunk of money to the college - I don't know how much, bit it's a decent sized chunk - equal or more than what you paid, I'm sure.
So, when we drop classes it's not only our own money but state (taxpayer) money that can be considered "wasted".
I think what happens is that after so many drops you have to pay out of state tuition rates...but I'm not positive on that.
When you pay your $200 to take a class at the community college, the $200 is NOT what it REALLY costs for you to take that class - the state kicks in a chunk of money to the college - I don't know how much, bit it's a decent sized chunk - equal or more than what you paid, I'm sure.
So, when we drop classes it's not only our own money but state (taxpayer) money that can be considered "wasted".
I think what happens is that after so many drops you have to pay out of state tuition rates...but I'm not positive on that.
08-06-2008, 12:21 PM
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Here's why the rule came about:
When you pay your $200 to take a class at the community college, the $200 is NOT what it REALLY costs for you to take that class - the state kicks in a chunk of money to the college - I don't know how much, bit it's a decent sized chunk - equal or more than what you paid, I'm sure.
So, when we drop classes it's not only our own money but state (taxpayer) money that can be considered "wasted".
I think what happens is that after so many drops you have to pay out of state tuition rates...but I'm not positive on that.
When you pay your $200 to take a class at the community college, the $200 is NOT what it REALLY costs for you to take that class - the state kicks in a chunk of money to the college - I don't know how much, bit it's a decent sized chunk - equal or more than what you paid, I'm sure.
So, when we drop classes it's not only our own money but state (taxpayer) money that can be considered "wasted".
I think what happens is that after so many drops you have to pay out of state tuition rates...but I'm not positive on that.
08-06-2008, 02:32 PM
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As much as that sucks for your situation I still think the 2 chance thing is a good policy for engineering. It motivates people not to dick around and maintains credibility in the college. I knew somone who was granted permission from the dean to take a class for a third time, so your friend should plead his case at U of H.
I've come across maybe 2 teachers during college that I would consider worthless to the university. The rest all genuinely cared about the progress of the students and had worked in industry for several years before becoming teachers. Our profs wrote a majority of our ChE books (prob 90%), but they were all very good books that from what I heard were also used in other schools around the state / nation. Don't condem college in general
.
I've come across maybe 2 teachers during college that I would consider worthless to the university. The rest all genuinely cared about the progress of the students and had worked in industry for several years before becoming teachers. Our profs wrote a majority of our ChE books (prob 90%), but they were all very good books that from what I heard were also used in other schools around the state / nation. Don't condem college in general
.
08-06-2008, 02:36 PM
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Yeah that only applies to new enrollers. That was passed late 07 if i remember. I think it sucks for new students, some people struggle with classes and have to drop. Crappy law IMO.
08-06-2008, 02:42 PM
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Yea, sounds to me like the logical choice is to provide funding for the amount of students that finish classes so there is more incentive to teach the students & help them pass.
I've heard some pretty good horror stories about UH, so until I hear some good ones, I'll keep my current dismal outlook until I can go there & see for myself once I get my core classes completed.
I've heard some pretty good horror stories about UH, so until I hear some good ones, I'll keep my current dismal outlook until I can go there & see for myself once I get my core classes completed.
08-06-2008, 02:44 PM
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Yea, sounds to me like the logical choice is to provide funding for the amount of students that finish classes so there is more incentive to teach the students & help them pass.
I've heard some pretty good horror stories about UH, so until I hear some good ones, I'll keep my current dismal outlook until I can go there & see for myself once I get my core classes completed.
I've heard some pretty good horror stories about UH, so until I hear some good ones, I'll keep my current dismal outlook until I can go there & see for myself once I get my core classes completed.
08-06-2008, 02:50 PM
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Have you been to college? While most professors are ethical, there are quite a few that have very unethical testing methods...and the whole curve thing is just bullshit. Most classes I have been in that graded on a curve were the same classes with shady *** testing methods. Meaning testing over stuff that was never mentioned in home work, lectures, or by the professor at all. That's just some sketchy B.S. and when I say help them pass, I don't mean hand holding, I mean having realistic expectations & communication of what you need to learn & a realistic idea of what you are tested over....even if it means that test questions can come from ANYTHING in the book. At least then you know to read the book. I guess some folks get lucky & don't get these sketchy teachers, hell I don't know.
08-06-2008, 02:55 PM
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Have you been to college? While most professors are ethical, there are quite a few that have very unethical testing methods...and the whole curve thing is just bullshit. Most classes I have been in that graded on a curve were the same classes with shady *** testing methods. Meaning testing over stuff that was never mentioned in home work, lectures, or by the professor at all. That's just some sketchy B.S. and when I say help them pass, I don't mean hand holding, I mean having realistic expectations & communication of what you need to learn & a realistic idea of what you are tested over....even if it means that test questions can come from ANYTHING in the book. At least then you know to read the book. I guess some folks get lucky & don't get these sketchy teachers, hell I don't know.
If you do the homework, read the book and take good notes in class. Than an A is always attainable and there is no excuse for getting less than a B.
College takes time and initiative. You don't see the people who get As complaining about the teacher....
08-06-2008, 04:03 PM
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Last fall when that law was put into place my professors all said that if you have taken any college classes in the state of Texas, no matter how long ago, that you would be exempt from this policy. It only applied to first time students starting in Fall '07.
I take all night classes so the student base is almost all people who are all older and are going back to school, so a lot of them were glad to hear this new law didn't impact them since they had taken classes many years ago.
It's a good rule though, IMO.
I take all night classes so the student base is almost all people who are all older and are going back to school, so a lot of them were glad to hear this new law didn't impact them since they had taken classes many years ago.
It's a good rule though, IMO.