New Kit for the Birds
02-21-2011, 02:40 AM
#161
I changed my dims and fogs. I went with 4500k because I just cant seem to get with the blue tint on our cars. I think its cool on imports, rockets, and BMW's and such, just not TA's and Camaro's. Just my 2 cents but anyways, I wish they were whiter. I still see quite a bit of bluish purple. I went with the LMC housings and the Raptor HID kit from DDM. I love the light though. I have never been able to see better. I dont even need the fogs or the brights. Personally I think coverting the fogs to HID was a waste in my case. I almost think they put out less light than before (I'm sure it's the crappy housing and lens from the factory, not the new bulbs).
BUT... My biggest concern is the fact that I get bright lighted A LOT!! I dont run with the fogs on, just the 2 dims. I have driven in another car towards my TA and I dont think they are that bad. It seems to only happen when there are no street lights around or just 2 lane blacktops. I think people just arent used to the type of lighting. Any thoughts? I really dont want to aim them any lower. As far as I'm concerned they are perfect with the exception to the color. Has anyone else had any of these issues or are you running a lower temp bulb that looks whiter?
One last things and I'll stop blabbing, DDM's Raptor kits are on backorder with no current ETA, they have a few left but I would recommend calling ahead before you order.
BUT... My biggest concern is the fact that I get bright lighted A LOT!! I dont run with the fogs on, just the 2 dims. I have driven in another car towards my TA and I dont think they are that bad. It seems to only happen when there are no street lights around or just 2 lane blacktops. I think people just arent used to the type of lighting. Any thoughts? I really dont want to aim them any lower. As far as I'm concerned they are perfect with the exception to the color. Has anyone else had any of these issues or are you running a lower temp bulb that looks whiter?
One last things and I'll stop blabbing, DDM's Raptor kits are on backorder with no current ETA, they have a few left but I would recommend calling ahead before you order.
02-22-2011, 09:15 AM
#164
BUT... My biggest concern is the fact that I get bright lighted A LOT!! I dont run with the fogs on, just the 2 dims. I have driven in another car towards my TA and I dont think they are that bad. It seems to only happen when there are no street lights around or just 2 lane blacktops. I think people just arent used to the type of lighting. Any thoughts? I really dont want to aim them any lower. As far as I'm concerned they are perfect with the exception to the color. Has anyone else had any of these issues or are you running a lower temp bulb that looks whiter?
No matter what any vendor tells you, installing HID capsules in halogen bulb reflectors is both illegal and dangerous. The reason is that the optics of the reflector are designed for a particular shape of light source in a particular position relative to the reflector. Halogen bulbs produce an oval light source in line with the axis of the bulb (the filament). HID capsules produce a curved light source (the arc) that rises above the axis of the capsule because of its own heat. This puts the light source as much as a centimeter away from where it should be. That may not sound like a lot but it's huge in terms of optics - think about how out of focus a camera lens becomes by moving it as little as a centimeter or less. With headlights, that out of focus situation causes unnecessary glare and light scatter. I won't even mention fog lights because putting HID capsules in fog lights expecting to get better illumination is just plain foolish.
Aiming your lights "down a tad" does not solve the problem. To properly prevent glare you would have to aim your lights down enough that they wouldn't be any more effective than the original halogen bulbs. And that still leaves the distracting light scatter caused by the improperly focused light source.
There is a similar problem with the light temperature. The best (most effective) light output is from 4300K bulbs which is why that is the color temperature used in OEM HID setups (it is the closest to daylight color). 6000K is a little whiter and still quite effective (about 10% less effective than 4300K). By the time you get to 8000K you've lost 28% of the light output compared to 4300K. Beyond 8000K you lose so much light output that you might as well have stayed with halogen bulbs. Higher temperatures also contribute to increased glare because the human eye isn't good at processing light in the blue/violet range.
If you want HID lighting, do a proper projector retrofit so that you're not a danger to other drivers. That way you won't have everybody muttering "what an *******" when you they see your lights.
02-23-2011, 02:22 AM
#165
Well I dont think I've been spanked that hard since the last time my dad took his belt off and whipped me. 
Thanks for the education. I didnt know any of that. I wish I had before I made the purchase because now I dont want to give up the new found light source and I dont want to aim them down either. I've never been able to see this well, ever.
I seem to be taking steps backwards in modifying my car. I've had the SLP LM exhaust on my car for over 3 years now and I drive much calmer than I ever used to and yet for some reason I cant seem to make it 15 miles w/o getting pulled over for it being too loud.
And now I have a set of headlights that are illegal as well. Not only do they **** the cops off but everyone else too.
I think I give up. I'm buying an electric car.
Thanks for the education. I didnt know any of that. I wish I had before I made the purchase because now I dont want to give up the new found light source and I dont want to aim them down either. I've never been able to see this well, ever.
I seem to be taking steps backwards in modifying my car. I've had the SLP LM exhaust on my car for over 3 years now and I drive much calmer than I ever used to and yet for some reason I cant seem to make it 15 miles w/o getting pulled over for it being too loud.
And now I have a set of headlights that are illegal as well. Not only do they **** the cops off but everyone else too.
I think I give up. I'm buying an electric car.
02-25-2011, 11:31 PM
#168
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I've let this thread continue for a long time without commenting but this really needs to be covered.
No matter what any vendor tells you, installing HID capsules in halogen bulb reflectors is both illegal and dangerous. The reason is that the optics of the reflector are designed for a particular shape of light source in a particular position relative to the reflector. Halogen bulbs produce an oval light source in line with the axis of the bulb (the filament). HID capsules produce a curved light source (the arc) that rises above the axis of the capsule because of its own heat. This puts the light source as much as a centimeter away from where it should be. That may not sound like a lot but it's huge in terms of optics - think about how out of focus a camera lens becomes by moving it as little as a centimeter or less. With headlights, that out of focus situation causes unnecessary glare and light scatter. I won't even mention fog lights because putting HID capsules in fog lights expecting to get better illumination is just plain foolish.
Aiming your lights "down a tad" does not solve the problem. To properly prevent glare you would have to aim your lights down enough that they wouldn't be any more effective than the original halogen bulbs. And that still leaves the distracting light scatter caused by the improperly focused light source.
There is a similar problem with the light temperature. The best (most effective) light output is from 4300K bulbs which is why that is the color temperature used in OEM HID setups (it is the closest to daylight color). 6000K is a little whiter and still quite effective (about 10% less effective than 4300K). By the time you get to 8000K you've lost 28% of the light output compared to 4300K. Beyond 8000K you lose so much light output that you might as well have stayed with halogen bulbs. Higher temperatures also contribute to increased glare because the human eye isn't good at processing light in the blue/violet range.
If you want HID lighting, do a proper projector retrofit so that you're not a danger to other drivers. That way you won't have everybody muttering "what an *******" when you they see your lights.
No matter what any vendor tells you, installing HID capsules in halogen bulb reflectors is both illegal and dangerous. The reason is that the optics of the reflector are designed for a particular shape of light source in a particular position relative to the reflector. Halogen bulbs produce an oval light source in line with the axis of the bulb (the filament). HID capsules produce a curved light source (the arc) that rises above the axis of the capsule because of its own heat. This puts the light source as much as a centimeter away from where it should be. That may not sound like a lot but it's huge in terms of optics - think about how out of focus a camera lens becomes by moving it as little as a centimeter or less. With headlights, that out of focus situation causes unnecessary glare and light scatter. I won't even mention fog lights because putting HID capsules in fog lights expecting to get better illumination is just plain foolish.
Aiming your lights "down a tad" does not solve the problem. To properly prevent glare you would have to aim your lights down enough that they wouldn't be any more effective than the original halogen bulbs. And that still leaves the distracting light scatter caused by the improperly focused light source.
There is a similar problem with the light temperature. The best (most effective) light output is from 4300K bulbs which is why that is the color temperature used in OEM HID setups (it is the closest to daylight color). 6000K is a little whiter and still quite effective (about 10% less effective than 4300K). By the time you get to 8000K you've lost 28% of the light output compared to 4300K. Beyond 8000K you lose so much light output that you might as well have stayed with halogen bulbs. Higher temperatures also contribute to increased glare because the human eye isn't good at processing light in the blue/violet range.
If you want HID lighting, do a proper projector retrofit so that you're not a danger to other drivers. That way you won't have everybody muttering "what an *******" when you they see your lights.
Well since you mentioned illegal, I will say that I am a former FBI investigator and now am head of a task force for the Local Police Department here in Tulsa Oklahoma and can say that we are behind on laws and HID lights are not illegal here. some are glaring and damn near blinding but here in Oklahoma we don't even have emissions testing so if you want a loud car with blinding light, come on down to TULSA OKLAHOMA!!! They are all over this city! haha I even have one now!
02-26-2011, 07:30 AM
#169
Hmmm,
Well since you mentioned illegal, I will say that I am a former FBI investigator and now am head of a task force for the Local Police Department here in Tulsa Oklahoma and can say that we are behind on laws and HID lights are not illegal here. some are glaring and damn near blinding but here in Oklahoma we don't even have emissions testing so if you want a loud car with blinding light, come on down to TULSA OKLAHOMA!!! They are all over this city! haha I even have one now!
Well since you mentioned illegal, I will say that I am a former FBI investigator and now am head of a task force for the Local Police Department here in Tulsa Oklahoma and can say that we are behind on laws and HID lights are not illegal here. some are glaring and damn near blinding but here in Oklahoma we don't even have emissions testing so if you want a loud car with blinding light, come on down to TULSA OKLAHOMA!!! They are all over this city! haha I even have one now!
03-14-2011, 08:25 PM
#172
Hmmm,
Well since you mentioned illegal, I will say that I am a former FBI investigator and now am head of a task force for the Local Police Department here in Tulsa Oklahoma and can say that we are behind on laws and HID lights are not illegal here. some are glaring and damn near blinding but here in Oklahoma we don't even have emissions testing so if you want a loud car with blinding light, come on down to TULSA OKLAHOMA!!! They are all over this city! haha I even have one now!
Well since you mentioned illegal, I will say that I am a former FBI investigator and now am head of a task force for the Local Police Department here in Tulsa Oklahoma and can say that we are behind on laws and HID lights are not illegal here. some are glaring and damn near blinding but here in Oklahoma we don't even have emissions testing so if you want a loud car with blinding light, come on down to TULSA OKLAHOMA!!! They are all over this city! haha I even have one now!
Retrofit
04-16-2011, 02:16 AM
#174
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I know it's illegal but I can also remember how bad my lights were before I purchased them...wet roads in town were terrible at night. My low's aren't bad but my fog lights are very blinding so I keep them off.
Are you really suggesting that we sacrifice our safety and ability to see the environment around us at night...pedestrians, animals, debris, etc. Hell maybe since you can not purchase a decent headlight for our cars we should just park before it gets dark. It's common to see 15 deer on the way home from work in a 10 mile stretch.
I purchased my HID's for MY safety, I've only been bright lighted once and that was with my fogs on. It's funny how HID's are always a touchy subject and safety is thrown into the mix but nobody says a damn thing whenever someone has a video of a street race doubling the speed limit with traffic visible. If safety is your goal maybe you should take your word into the multimedia section.
Are you really suggesting that we sacrifice our safety and ability to see the environment around us at night...pedestrians, animals, debris, etc. Hell maybe since you can not purchase a decent headlight for our cars we should just park before it gets dark. It's common to see 15 deer on the way home from work in a 10 mile stretch.
I purchased my HID's for MY safety, I've only been bright lighted once and that was with my fogs on. It's funny how HID's are always a touchy subject and safety is thrown into the mix but nobody says a damn thing whenever someone has a video of a street race doubling the speed limit with traffic visible. If safety is your goal maybe you should take your word into the multimedia section.
04-16-2011, 08:34 AM
#175
Wow....this was a great read....thanks for the info and links....I had changed my lights out in my 87 TA Italia mod last year to the 6k HID setup. I love it over the stock garbage that they put in cars. I also installed Hella fogs and they are quite impressive to. I am concerned about saftey and visibility of others so that is always on my mind whenever I do something to my car. Thanks for the link to lmctruck, I want to remove my stk amber/clear lights and replace them with something more current. I will be calling them next. Great posts everyone.
I just called LMCTruck and there is no one that has knowledge there with regards to lights, they just take orders. Does anyone here know what housing that I can use to replace my stk amber/clear lights in my car. The openings that I need to fill is 7"Hx6"W so any fixture be it 3"Hx6"W will also work since they can be stacked. Does anyone here know the dimensions of their kits? Thanks
http://www.lmctruck.com/icatalog/cd/full.aspx?Page=65
I just called LMCTruck and there is no one that has knowledge there with regards to lights, they just take orders. Does anyone here know what housing that I can use to replace my stk amber/clear lights in my car. The openings that I need to fill is 7"Hx6"W so any fixture be it 3"Hx6"W will also work since they can be stacked. Does anyone here know the dimensions of their kits? Thanks
http://www.lmctruck.com/icatalog/cd/full.aspx?Page=65
Last edited by mrrman; 04-16-2011 at 08:47 AM.
04-16-2011, 10:20 PM
#176
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Well here is a comparison.
The first pics are the stock halogens, second set of pics is the halogen/prism style housing w/HID's, and third set is the new LMC housing w/HID's
Stock w/fogs
Halogen/prism style housing w/HID's
LMC housing w/HID's
LMC w/fogs
LMC HID's w/LMC highs
UPDATE 5-27-14
Recently installed the BBL HID's
HID's
HID's with Fogs
HID's with Highs
The first pics are the stock halogens, second set of pics is the halogen/prism style housing w/HID's, and third set is the new LMC housing w/HID's
Stock w/fogs
Halogen/prism style housing w/HID's
LMC housing w/HID's
LMC w/fogs
LMC HID's w/LMC highs
UPDATE 5-27-14
Recently installed the BBL HID's
HID's
HID's with Fogs
HID's with Highs
Last edited by No Juice; 05-27-2014 at 08:23 AM.
04-17-2011, 10:05 AM
#177
I know it's illegal but I can also remember how bad my lights were before I purchased them...wet roads in town were terrible at night. My low's aren't bad but my fog lights are very blinding so I keep them off.
Are you really suggesting that we sacrifice our safety and ability to see the environment around us at night...pedestrians, animals, debris, etc. Hell maybe since you can not purchase a decent headlight for our cars we should just park before it gets dark. It's common to see 15 deer on the way home from work in a 10 mile stretch.
I purchased my HID's for MY safety, I've only been bright lighted once and that was with my fogs on. It's funny how HID's are always a touchy subject and safety is thrown into the mix but nobody says a damn thing whenever someone has a video of a street race doubling the speed limit with traffic visible. If safety is your goal maybe you should take your word into the multimedia section.
Are you really suggesting that we sacrifice our safety and ability to see the environment around us at night...pedestrians, animals, debris, etc. Hell maybe since you can not purchase a decent headlight for our cars we should just park before it gets dark. It's common to see 15 deer on the way home from work in a 10 mile stretch.
I purchased my HID's for MY safety, I've only been bright lighted once and that was with my fogs on. It's funny how HID's are always a touchy subject and safety is thrown into the mix but nobody says a damn thing whenever someone has a video of a street race doubling the speed limit with traffic visible. If safety is your goal maybe you should take your word into the multimedia section.
There are always multiple solutions to any problem. Rather than HID's - a few thoughts:
- We should all eat more deer. (Every season should be deer season.)
- Hopefully soon, all cars will have infrared night vision systems like you see on luxury cars.
04-17-2011, 10:07 AM
#178
I know it's illegal but I can also remember how bad my lights were before I purchased them...wet roads in town were terrible at night. My low's aren't bad but my fog lights are very blinding so I keep them off.
Are you really suggesting that we sacrifice our safety and ability to see the environment around us at night...pedestrians, animals, debris, etc. Hell maybe since you can not purchase a decent headlight for our cars we should just park before it gets dark. It's common to see 15 deer on the way home from work in a 10 mile stretch.
I purchased my HID's for MY safety, I've only been bright lighted once and that was with my fogs on. It's funny how HID's are always a touchy subject and safety is thrown into the mix but nobody says a damn thing whenever someone has a video of a street race doubling the speed limit with traffic visible. If safety is your goal maybe you should take your word into the multimedia section.
Are you really suggesting that we sacrifice our safety and ability to see the environment around us at night...pedestrians, animals, debris, etc. Hell maybe since you can not purchase a decent headlight for our cars we should just park before it gets dark. It's common to see 15 deer on the way home from work in a 10 mile stretch.
I purchased my HID's for MY safety, I've only been bright lighted once and that was with my fogs on. It's funny how HID's are always a touchy subject and safety is thrown into the mix but nobody says a damn thing whenever someone has a video of a street race doubling the speed limit with traffic visible. If safety is your goal maybe you should take your word into the multimedia section.
Last edited by WhiteBird00; 04-17-2011 at 11:02 AM.
04-17-2011, 10:13 AM
#179
This is what a proper HID patter should look like:
Notice the distinct, stepped cutoff at the top and the lack of hotspots in the light pattern.
Last edited by WhiteBird00; 04-18-2011 at 11:44 AM.