FranksCustomTrans

While I have put many in trans for people . I have yet to drive a car with it. Reviews from customers have ranged from its awesome to couldnt tell much difference.
Thought about them with the Impala but then thought since keeping the 3.08 gears in rear the stock ratio would probably be better.

(IMO if its round or spherical and orbits the sun its a planet )

vorteciroc

Regardless of the Pinion Count, the Sonnax Planet is a very nice/ high quality Component.

The change in Gear Ratio, is really only pronounced enough with Lower Numerical Size Ring and Pinion Sets...
Such as the: 2.73:1/ 2.77:1 - 3.23:1/ 3.27:1 Ratios.
However not very discernible with 3.42:1/ 3.45:1 Ratios.

The 3.73:1/ 3.70:1 - 4.10:1/ 4.11:1 and Higher Ratio Gear Sets make the Sonnax Planet completely indiscernible from the OEM Ratio Planet...
And I see NO reason to bother with it!


Instead...
Spend your Hard earned Money at a Specialist whom is Hydraulically Fluent in 4L60E Family Valve-Bodies!!!


It is a far better investment for your Money!

vorteciroc

Pluto is not going anywhere that it has not been before...
So it should still be part of our System.

67LSX454

Easier said than done when working on a local (to me) level.
My transmission is still on the bench and yet to be disassembled. There's still a few months of winter weather in this part of the country so my outdoor working space isn't entirely habitable at the moment. Any sense of urgency hasn't peaked yet.

67LSX454

Long live Pluto. (And I'm glad we're not talking about Uranus!)

FranksCustomTrans

Not really a tip or trick but Of interest, A few months back I decided to make a change in the way I clean parts. Setting up a water based system rather than mineral spirits.
Well been using a few months and am very pleased for many reasons, one being much better for you and two very functional and less messy not to mention cost effective.
Its a 30 gallon parts washer from Harbor Freight with 1 gallon of a product called rustlick in it and 1 gallon of simple green, I must say I am very pleased with the outcome. I also added a heating element to make it warm.
Results cleans parts very well.
Easier on hands and no stains.
0 rust issues even after parts setting on bench for a couple months in my not so climate controlled garage.
Basically just wash parts like you would in any hand parts washer then blow dry. I do not wash electronic componenets or planets in it however I did immerse a planet in it for a week then its been setting on bench for over a month with 0 issues, But everything else I do and the rustlic seems to prevent aluminum corrosion too even though it is not listed to do that.
Its been in operation a couple months cleaned many parts, Clean up is easy I just use the shop vac ocassionally to syphon oil and clutch debris off top which accumulate there as they float, Actual solution stays clean as picture shows. A few magnets in bottom collect metal.





Just note for anyone looking for a less toxic cleaning method

tayto

how much is it compared to mineral spirits? when i was at my last shop i probably spent $160 (canadian) on 10 gals of paint thinner. when I moved I donated it to a friend. Will be setting a shop up in a seacan and it would be great if it wasn't smelly. We use simple green exclusively as our cleaner at my job, so that is no problem to obtain for cheap.

FranksCustomTrans

Well tjhe rustlick gallon is about 25 dollars so water, simple green , rustlick. maybe 40 dollars all in, Not including parts washer. as for last I dont know yet but in a couple months and maybe 15 trans so far still clean as I said just sypoon debris and oil off top. Comparitivley mineral spirits aboutt 8 dollars a gallon x 30 gallons,, Oil and and debris become mixed in . I would say water system much more cost effective IMO and no odor or fire risk

tayto

how much is it compared to mineral spirits? when i was at my last shop i probably spent $160 (canadian) on 10 gals of paint thinner. when I moved I donated it to a friend. Will be setting a shop up in a seacan and it would be great if it wasn't smelly. We use simple green exclusively as our cleaner at my job, so that is no problem to obtain for cheap.

FranksCustomTrans

I would have to do a longer term use to make a good comparison but so far cleans better, protects against rust, easy on hands, no harsh smells and has lasted though about 15 trans no ssues and still clen as you can see from stream. Intital set up is certainly less expensive .

reubone

Super scary drilling into a case like this but I gave it a whirl. Only bits I could find local were #60 bit size. Looks like it may be .040 or equivalent. Would this be too big or should the pump provide enough flow to over come this leak? Also, do you worry about the angle very much? I drilled three cases and tried my best to duplicate the starting and end points. However, one ended up on the radius of the transition between the thick and thin parts of the case. Airflow test says the end result should still bias toward the correct band gap but still would like to know your thoughts.

FranksCustomTrans

Yes that size is fine I have found #58 IS THE SMALLEST I have ever managed to make it through with and that takes a steady hand. And no issues with volume to fwd clutch done this many times. I ussually do enlarge fwd feed aboutt 1 bit size over whatever stock is I would say a particular size but have found it varies to the plate oddly but that is because I also use the FWD oil for the the FT overun clutch mod. And yes I try and angle best i can to spray in the gap. It actually the easiest on the 700R4 as it a straight in drill with those the angle of the 4l60e makes them a bit more tedious. Idealy smalest hole you can make.
The factory also sprays one from pump but that avenue closes off the second the band starts apply and the other from servo bore but it only happens when in 3rd and 4th gear though the hole in band but only hits very center , This mode drenches the whole area of the drum in all gears via the split and to me keeping that drum cool is very important to keep it straight particulary with the wide band cause once is concaves just a little thats quick trouble and I have noted over the years of doing restores that even with brand new drums and wide band when restore / refresh time came always saw burn marks at outer edges of drum where nothing sprays it.
Always thought a better design would be a steel bar width of band with three contact points like some chrysler and ford units have would have been a better idea to make apply force more equal instead of just center which makes for excessive high presure on drum in middle.

reubone

Awesome Thank you and yes I have found that some hole sizes vary inexplicably from plate to plate. Maybe there is a correlation but I have not put it together yet. Could it be fluid boring out the hole after so many years of flow maybe? I have seen pitting and erosion on other parts of the plate so I guess it could be.

FranksCustomTrans

Its possible but I use mostly new bonded plates and they vary in application, but does not matter to much for my builds and have noted in the new plates from application and year to year hole sizes vary from the fwd to second and 3th feeds and accum feeds. Since I change them all anyway its of no concern to me but seems for factory uses it does matter which plate you use.
I use the new bonded plates because well they are only 12 to 14 dollars and to me get a new plate, no cleaning or fixing holes etc well worth it.
Even figured out easiest way to block the holes for the FT OVERUN MOD 3/16th rod from hardware store. Aluminum or brass cut little slugs , then place them in hole and hit with hammer till tight fit from each side easy peasy. Aluminum easiest but brass works well too. Wish they made them in copper would be even better as softer or could find a sore of 3/16th lead or silver rod no flux would be even better.

reubone

Even the new ones fluctuate, wow good to know. What do you think about two part epoxy sticks like quick steel? I have a bunch of that already lying around.

FranksCustomTrans

be afraid of its to seal a hole under presure ,

chris99gmc

Some good info here. I had a 60e built by Frank a number of years ago for a customer. It works great.

I’d like to add my .02 from what I gathered with years of tuning these things:

this is based on HPTuners software, but the concepts should be relatively the same for this transmission across different tuning software. I suggest NOT using these methods for different model transmissions ie 4L80e platform. What I’ve found to work best for the two transmissions are entirely different..


-Shift Speed vs. Shift Pressure-

I don’t know what the tab is called on the OS you’re working on, but on a Gen 3 OS, (just to make things simple), there’s a tab under transmission that has shift Speeds (or shift time). This is were it’s referencing to the amount of time(in seconds or milliseconds) that each gear shift is set to command the shift. (Not to be mistaken with the MPH shift speed tables.) No matter how much you change the shift pressures on the pressure tab, the pcm/tcm will use the Adaptive learning to try to modify the transmission pressures(by sending different amount of current to the EPC solenoid) based on the difference of the commanded shift time and the actual shift time. You can log both commanded shift time and actual shift time in the scanner to watch if the adaptives are actually making changes when the set shift pressures are all out of whack.
For the 4l60e, 65e and 70e transmissions, the safest and easiest way to change the shift firmness(essentially raising the pressure) is to decrease the upshift shift time tables, while leaving the adaptives alone. This will let the computer still work it’s magic and work the way it’s designed to, while allowing the tuner to reach their goal of making the trans shift faster and firmer to handle increased power.

Changing the shift pressures without turning off the adaptives or changing the shift speeds(time) will essentially do absolutely nothing at the end of the day. Obviously you will notice increased pressure right after you upload the tune and clear the adaptives. But the computer will eventually get the shifts back to square one, in one way or another, because it will attempt to match the actual shift time with whatever is on that table in the tune.

The way to get rid of the adaptives if there isn’t a drop down radio box in the OS to enable or disable them, is to change all the shift speed(time) to less than 0.100 seconds. Or all to 0.000 seconds across the board. I wouldn’t recommend doing this to a novice tuner, especially with a 4l60e transmission. The transmission is simply too weak and temperamental to go off drastically making pressure changes in these heavy vehicles. It’s pretty much a guarantee that once you add a cam or a power adder to a truck with a stock spec 60e and they disable the TQ management and KR settings that the transmission will be done in less than a year with a heavy foot. Once you go about changing the pressure tables not knowing exactly what you’re doing, it’s all over(ask me how I know).. With a 4L80e transmission and a segment swap, it’s an entirely different story. Plus it’s a much much stronger and more forgiving transmission. The values in a 4l80e based OS are often not very tailored for a performance application either. That’s why most guys who do 80e swaps turn off the adaptives and tune the shifts by changing the pressure tables(contrary to the 60e, etc). If you turn off your adaptives with a 80e, it will give you full control over your shifts. If you turn them off by changing to “disable” in the tune, it may or may not work due to the amount of tables that are inaccessible in the tuning software. make sure to reset your adaptives right after you flash the tune. Sometimes you have to do this twice on a newer truck just to be sure. Just be expected to spend some time adjusting the shift pressures in all your upshifts.

let me end by saying that I do not consider myself a “Pro” tuner by any means. But with over 15 years under my belt, this is just some of what i’ve picked up over the years. Feel free to correct me if you feel that anything I’ve mentioned is incorrect or you disagree with.

FranksCustomTrans

Yes I have tried to explain this to a few people. Of course I have OBD1 1995 Impala SS but when I was first tuning it with cats tuner I would notice that I could raise the line and the shift at first would be firmer but then revert back to similar to what it was after a few drives , Then I found that table, OBD1 has lots and lots of tables and I 0.00 all of those and then my changes would stay , But Im not sure if its not available in HP or just in some versions but many times when I explain this they cannot seem to find the table. And being that I dont use HP and am unfamilar I cannot really be of much help.

But yes wither mechanical changes or line tuning changes these adaptives can and will try and undo your alterations as best it can.
Once I 0.00 that table I had to go back and lower the line as the shift got insanely harsh.

Also at least in Cats another table exist that actually pulls back line during shifts at various throttle positions like my 2-3 factory at about 1/2 throttle had a negative 24 in it so was pulling line back during the 2-3 shift I would assume to avoid the clunky feel of the 60e on this shift,
So great notation and contribution to the thread thanks and glad your trans still going strong .

FranksCustomTrans

The best way IMO to remove an input shaft from a 4L60E/700R4 input drum.
Some just press them out, I feel this is a bad idea bacause of the risk of furtehr damage to the splines in the drum.
I have tried various methods and the best I have found is heat the DRUM not the shaft on an electric stove top by placing the drum physically on it makes for more even heat . Ideally with an Iron bar stock large enough for the center to sit on (not required but quicker) then heat till drum center through side hole hits 285f give or take this will not reduce temper in any sigificant way from all my reading but no longer as the goal is to not heat the shaft anymore than nessesary, I have found that by doing this many times the shaft will just come out literally so be careful picking it up by the shaft At most however a few very light taps on the shaft will pop it right out no damage to drum at all.

Reinstallation ideally again heat the drum but not as hot arround 150f is fine and a room temp or cooler shaft , Put whatever sealer you choose I use a combination of two red locktight and yes crazy as it sounds super glue gel and press in but quicky should go in really easy and shaft will start to heat and glue dry quickly with hot drum, Then imediatly blow through holes to clear any excess should not be much as most gets wiped when installing then clean at shaft drum surface where bearing washer sits allow to cool to room temp ready to go.

Doing this with multiple test over the years has resulted in virtually every time a solid seal and the best test was taking it out again an hour later just to see,
With this process and sealer method even when heated as before to remove , The result was it was very diffcult to remove and even brought alumunum still stuck to shaft out with it, Drum of course ruined but proved it is a solid way to make sure shaft stays stationary and sealed.

My reasoning for using the sealer combination is this, Locktite does not harden well in the presence of air which may be the case with the drum and at room temps but the super glue will and in combination I get best of both worlds .

For those who would laugh at the super glue it is the same compound used for loctite just designed to cure quicky in the presence of air even at room temperature. The reason for the gel over regular is I found it remains somewhat pliable even when totally dry meaning it can staNd stress without breaking up which is better for sealing,
I realise they actually make spline/ shaft sealer but when i played with it alone I did not get the pulls aluminum out with shaft experience and it seems to take consdierable drying time and heat seems to determine more how long it takes which if not dry by use time the worry is the presure will push it out before it can cure.

Not here to argue best way this is just my way I am sure others have thier own and success also, But that is what this thread is for to share our various ways of doing things and compare them and even consider alternative methods.

(SPECIAL NOTE .........WHEN HEATING THE DRUM THE ENCAPSULATED CHECKBALL RELEASE MAY FALL OUT AND NEED TO BE REINSTALLED OR OPTIONALLY REPLACED)

(Please moderators if you see a grammerly issue with my post feel free to correct, It seems from taking an online test I know not professional I have some degree of deslexia at least that what the online test showe me, So even though I do proof read I still miss stuff )

FranksCustomTrans

MADE YA video this is the mod functionally working, Bear in mind this is spraying WD40 through it which is much thinner the hole in this case is wire size 60 , with trans fluid its thicker but it also at much higher presure but this will show what it looks like real world with band and drum all in place ,Note I had the opuritunity to see a real world result on band/drum cooling, We had one where the guy had installed wrong filter to short and it fell out causing areation and slipping it fried the 3-4 and even burned the forward , rev and low reverse some but amazingly the band and drum were still perfect like new. to me this is important as when the band gets hot not only does the band burn annd drum cave also it can flare out, so keeping it cool as possible is great. I have this mod on my own car. 25k miles since build so far. in fact mine was the very first .

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