Let's assume that I have the best parts available in my 4L60E. My raceweight is just over 3,500#, and I would expect 400-410 RWHP with an unlocked converter if I add a nice set of heads (currently 361 RWHP unlocked, 380 RWHP locked). I'm at the ET and power level right now that will let the trans and stock 10-bolt live for quite a while (knock on wood). I'm very apprehensive to add a set of heads because I don't want to end up chasing my tail with another f-body. My T/A became a major problem child, and that's one of the reasons I got rid of it. I know that it's only a matter of time before I have to upgrade to a built 4L60E, but how long do you think it will live running LOW 11's with my raceweight and power level? I would LOVE to shoot for 10's this fall with heads/cam, but I'm not so bent on the idea that I'm wanting to give up the reliability that I have now. I'd like to hear from other heads/cam A4 guys. I went through quite a few trannies in my T/A, and I'm NOT looking to do that again. 10's would be fun, but I'm not willing to give up everything else to give it a shot. thoughts???

 

Usually when you step up to heads/cam you should rebuild it...my friend kept his temp under 200 easily running around on heads/cam for awhile, but eventually it will fail...

Its just another mod you need to do I guess if you want to run some good #'s...

I would suggest getting a trans temp gauge and check the fluid a lot, maybe get a deep pan?

 

Brian,

Yeah, I know that a built 4L60E will be mandatory. What I'm asking is how long will the BUILT 4L60E last with the criteria listed above? The majority of the guys running some great ET's with heads/cam have a pretty light car (3,300# or less). The lowest my raceweight will ever get will be just under 3,500#. I'm not going to gut the car to achieve an ET. We all know how much RWTQ can be produced upon launch from a nice heads/cam setup and a 4,400 stall! Add in the 3,500# weight, and that becomes a BIG strain.

<small>[ June 06, 2002, 09:04 AM: Message edited by: Trevor D ]</small>

 

Trevor, with a big converter, cam, and TM deleted, you are probably over the line now. Within 2 years, your clutch packs will be toast. If you are willing to accept every 2 years that the tranny will need freshening, adding heads will be fine.

Seems like around 400 rwhp is the limit before big problems set in.

 

Joel - I'd be ecstatic if I could go two full seasons w/ no problems. I have no doubt that I'm over the line now w/ a stock trans. More power is fun, but it's also more problems. I don't know if I want to make that jump again. I'll then be holding my breath with the 10-bolt, moreso than I already am. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> Nobody said it was cheap!

 

It depends on a lot Trev.

Just_Me aka Steve Harmon aka www.tech-ls1.com ran for what, 4 years with nitrous and then a Vortech on his stock 4L60E. He had a rather unconventional setup.

J.

 

Yeah, that's the hard part about this game. Everything is dependent upon the setup and a certain amount of luck. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> Tom The Roofer also comes to mind on being able to punish a stock trans without problems. Even when he pulled his stock 4L60E out for the 3-speed conversion, it was performing great. Granted, this was in a light car, but 11.1's N/A and mid-10's on the bottle is hard on the trans, no matter the weight. I'm just afraid of screwing up a good thing for the sake of a lower ET.

 

So far, I've been running the stock 4L60E running in the low 11s, and even made a 10.98 pass at 126 MPH! I even shift way above the stock red-line... 6300 to 6500 RPMs, <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="gr_eek2.gif" />

I'm probably on borrowed time, but so far it hasn't given up the ghost.

 

Trevor, if you believe that adding the heads to the car is going to wear out your transmission sooner, then why mess with a good thing. Your current setup seems to be dialed quite well. I know you are a good driver and have a good car for what you have. Sometimes if it aint broke- dont touch it. It is hard for me to say, I have tons of money in my car and I am sometimes frustrated at my ET. I like to chase ET, but yet have a car I can drive too. Yes, it is a very expensive game to drag race, but yet it is alot of fun and we meet lots of nice folks who have the same hobby as us. I was out at the track Friday and started wandering why do I treat my car this way. But I likes to drag race and thats the only reason I could come up with. Compare to me I know you are a professional driver--but if you get heads, want have to readjust your car at the track and retuned suspension, takeoff, tire pressure and all that jazz. The point is, if the car is dialed in, sometimes it is better to leave it alone. I know I have done this more than once. I am striving for 11.50 and have not achieve it yet in almost street like form--maybe I will or want. I know from reading this board--Your car is faster and I congratulate you--You have done a fine job. I am sure you can tweak and adjust your car some more with your own knowledge and friends you have to maximize what you got and get a little more and keep the car dialed in for the track and yet still have some ET and not the additional costs of them heads.. Just a thought on a Saturday morning and I appreciate your HELP very much from the past of this board. Good luck in your decision.

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by kent:
<strong>Sometimes if it aint broke- dont touch it.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Thanks for the advice Kent. I am feeling the same way right now: why wreck a good thing? I have what I want from the car, so I don't think I'm going to get in a hurry to spend more money and break more parts. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> Maybe I'll try out a different cam down the road to see how it compares to my current one. I'd like to hit some solid 11.40's with stock heads.

 

Trev, are you running a stock MAF or what? Positive manifold pressure via boost is better on the tranny than the huge suction from a mean *** cam. Remember that MAP and line pressure are intertwined. Steve seemed to think his 2.73s helped tranny life a lot to as it didn't "wind up" as fast.

I saw you go Vortech, we've got some strong running ATI cars and you've done the n/a boogie <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="gr_tounge.gif" /> I think 11.40s would be reasonable with your setup and a Vortech <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

J.

<small>[ June 11, 2002, 01:42 PM: Message edited by: Crazyquik ]</small>

 

LMAO! I'm thinking a Vortech would stress the trans just a little. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> I've often thought of forced induction, but one of my big problems would be trying to bracket race the car. Blowers don't make for consistent racers. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="gr_tounge.gif" /> It would be damn fun, though! <img border="0" alt="[Burnout]" title="" src="graemlins/burnout.gif" />

 

i was under the impression that Trevors programming linked line pressure to TPS % only. no MAP.

Steve H. has done some really cool mods. for a while he added a set of switches to run the trans completely independent of the PCM. 100% line pressure. When he'd move the shifter down to 1, it would throw all the switches in one position to emliminate PCM control. As he moved the shifter to 2 and 3, individual switches activate the shift solenoids and effectivly make the trans a manual valvebody minus PCM. VERY COOL.

i think making the trans last is a high wire act. with out the PCM you are on borrowed time with the hardware which CAN last provided you DO NOT SHOCK the trans. No 1.5 60's. I know that sucks ***, but while we bring up Steve, we need to remember he was using a SMALL converter and little 2.73's. And goosing the peddle out of the hole with the blower is way easier than launching it NA. Now how he got the thing to shift on the hose is beyond me. He also had a progessive controller when he ran N2O. I think Steve ran high 1.8 60's with the blower and BFG's and maybe 1.7's on the juice (i may be wrong there).

Ryan

 

I dunno about all this.

My Yank 4L60E is still going strong. The shifts are like new and no leaks.

I love this thing.

Since your stalling up the verter and that puts a load on it at the line. I dont believe the 60's are affecting it at all. (shock wise) I would say high RPM's could hurt it (7000 plus).
But since I dont go that high, it hasnt been a prob for me.
Light weight, keep the heat down, dont be flooring it in OD and you could have a long lived 10 sec A4.
"Could" is the operative word here...

Good luck.

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Ryan:
<strong>i was under the impression that Trevors programming linked line pressure to TPS % only. no MAP.
Ryan</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">(in best Ed McMahon voice) You are correct sir. Yeah, I know that Steve was a big Vig 2800/2.73 guy. If I can't have my 1.5 60' times, then I may have to go to counseling. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> He's definitely doing something right to get a 4L60E to last as long as he did, particularly on the bottle!

John - How many miles have you put on your trans? The biggest factor for me is weight. You're considerably lighter than I am, and those few hundred pounds make a big difference. You mention not flooring it in OD. Are you saying that allowing it to kick out of OD if you go WOT is bad on it? Could you elaborate?

 

Stock A4 with 13,000 miles here. The 4L60E seems to be hit and miss. Some live, some don't. The ones that don't live won't live with a rebuild either.

When mine goes I'll try a cheap rebuild, but for now it works great!

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> Light weight, keep the heat down, dont be flooring it in OD and you could have a long lived 10 sec A4. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Mike has told me it is better to floor in OD and let the PCM handle the shift rather than manually downshift it because the PCM can control the pressure when it handles the down shift.

 

Jantzer is on the stock tranny too isn't he? Steve's combo with the Vig 2800 stalled a lot higher with the power adders/home ported heads/HOT cam though.

J.

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Crazyquik:
<strong>Jantzer is on the stock tranny too isn't he? Steve's combo with the Vig 2800 stalled a lot higher with the power adders/home ported heads/HOT cam though.

J.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">true...but my point was the smooth transfer of power. and no PCM control.