Official ZL1 Power Figure and Other Details Released
09-14-2011, 09:24 PM
#101
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09-14-2011, 10:52 PM
#102
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Thats not saying a whole lot considering the extreme limitations GM has put on the previous Camaros. The 5th gen could be a much better performer if it dropped some weight.
With a watts link and the ZL1's tires I would bet that a 4th gen 1LE camaro (koni equipped) would out handle a 5th gen ZL1, it would almost be 1000lbs lighter...
Also some food for thought, 5th gens compete in the same Auto-x class as 4th gens (fstock) and are not even remotely competitive with them, the weight and the over sized wheels kill the car.
With a watts link and the ZL1's tires I would bet that a 4th gen 1LE camaro (koni equipped) would out handle a 5th gen ZL1, it would almost be 1000lbs lighter...
Also some food for thought, 5th gens compete in the same Auto-x class as 4th gens (fstock) and are not even remotely competitive with them, the weight and the over sized wheels kill the car.
Those who really want to track a 5th gen can strip all the heavy items off of it like the SSX track show car GM Racing produced.
09-14-2011, 11:17 PM
#103
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09-15-2011, 01:56 PM
#104
Yo forgot to say PLEASE, sister! Regardless, you can' have mine no matter how small you feel yours is...
You're sure of too many things which aren't important. Camaros may have been successful enough in your limited scope, but GM doesn't offer vehicles intending them to merely sell. They have a name and a reputation to concern themselves with as well.
Of course it will get many of the same parts, like the entire body structure. It will have additional things too, which is why the cost will be higher than the SS. There's no "correct pricing" for a car like this. It is intended to be a limited production model, better than the others and at a higher price. 50K for any pony car is as close to "correct" as they can get. That's still pricey, but it will sell. That doesn't mean GM won't take any hit on production costs.
Nobody is claiming the ZL1 will hurt the success of the Camaro. It should enhance success, but at a cost. The only question was, will it cause GM a lower profit margin.
I care. This is THE main reason I will no longer purchase a new GM vehicle. Without question, I'm not the only one who feels this way. I wanted to buy a new ZO6 just this year, but my concern for the way GM has been run for the past few decades caused me to step away. On a brighter note: I decided not to buy any vehicle for now. I'm hoping GM will change its ways so I can go forward with my purchase. Until I think that's happening, it's on hold.
Contrary to your obvious opinion, yours is NOT the one that matters most. Your thoughts about GM will never sway the purchase of most people.
You're sure of too many things which aren't important. Camaros may have been successful enough in your limited scope, but GM doesn't offer vehicles intending them to merely sell. They have a name and a reputation to concern themselves with as well.
Of course it will get many of the same parts, like the entire body structure. It will have additional things too, which is why the cost will be higher than the SS. There's no "correct pricing" for a car like this. It is intended to be a limited production model, better than the others and at a higher price. 50K for any pony car is as close to "correct" as they can get. That's still pricey, but it will sell. That doesn't mean GM won't take any hit on production costs.
Nobody is claiming the ZL1 will hurt the success of the Camaro. It should enhance success, but at a cost. The only question was, will it cause GM a lower profit margin.
I care. This is THE main reason I will no longer purchase a new GM vehicle. Without question, I'm not the only one who feels this way. I wanted to buy a new ZO6 just this year, but my concern for the way GM has been run for the past few decades caused me to step away. On a brighter note: I decided not to buy any vehicle for now. I'm hoping GM will change its ways so I can go forward with my purchase. Until I think that's happening, it's on hold.
Contrary to your obvious opinion, yours is NOT the one that matters most. Your thoughts about GM will never sway the purchase of most people.
your first sentence shows what a retard you are so the rest of your BS means nothing.
as i said. 5th gens are selling well and this zl1 is only going to help not hurt its image and negatively affect sales. even if it is a low profit margin car its lineup overall is successful and will continue that way. bet on it.
this is one of the few cars GM got right. if youre waiting for the big three(namely GM) to turn things around to where they should be youll be long gone.
ive bought GM because i like them for a specific reason. i no longer think their vehicles are the best in the industry. i figured that out a long time ago.
09-15-2011, 05:45 PM
#108
I believe that they've gotten quite few vehicles right actually. 
But yes, the new Camaro overall might even qualify as exceptionally well executed.
Currently, I think that a few of their vehicles might actually be among the best in the industry, some probably even exceeding the best (within their specific class).
Remember, no car is perfect.
But yes, the new Camaro overall might even qualify as exceptionally well executed.
Remember, no car is perfect.
09-15-2011, 06:30 PM
#109
I believe that they've gotten quite few vehicles right actually.
But yes, the new Camaro overall might even qualify as exceptionally well executed.
Currently, I think that a few of their vehicles might actually be among the best in the industry, some probably even exceeding the best (within their specific class).
Remember, no car is perfect.
But yes, the new Camaro overall might even qualify as exceptionally well executed.
Currently, I think that a few of their vehicles might actually be among the best in the industry, some probably even exceeding the best (within their specific class).
Remember, no car is perfect.
thing is while GM makes some good cars they make some subpar cars also.
http://news.consumerreports.org/cars...best-cars.html
as you know ive always been a GM supporter. but im frustrated with the domestic auto industry as a whole and i really cant blindly defend them any longer.
while ill never own a foreign(gto lol its a GM) car ive known many many people that were let down by domestics and i cant blame them for buying a toyota or honda.
its really hard to deny the numerous failures by the american auto industry and their refusal to recognize and correct it.
sadly theyve lost customers theyll never get back and sometimes i consider being one of them.
09-15-2011, 09:17 PM
#110
And they have (finally) recognized and corrected much of it, in my opinion. But yes, it just might not be quite enough to satisfy the average new car buyer.
09-15-2011, 10:29 PM
#111
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I believe that they've gotten quite few vehicles right actually.
But yes, the new Camaro overall might even qualify as exceptionally well executed.
Currently, I think that a few of their vehicles might actually be among the best in the industry, some probably even exceeding the best (within their specific class).
Remember, no car is perfect.
But yes, the new Camaro overall might even qualify as exceptionally well executed.
Currently, I think that a few of their vehicles might actually be among the best in the industry, some probably even exceeding the best (within their specific class).
Remember, no car is perfect.
09-15-2011, 10:49 PM
#112
Corvette
CTS
SRX
Regal (maybe)
LaCrosse
Cruze
Equinox (can't even keep them on the lot)
Escalade/Tahoe/Yukon
2500/3500 diesel pick ups (Ford still might be better)
Upcoming Malibu looks very promising but isn't current of course.
CTS
SRX
Regal (maybe)
LaCrosse
Cruze
Equinox (can't even keep them on the lot)
Escalade/Tahoe/Yukon
2500/3500 diesel pick ups (Ford still might be better)
Upcoming Malibu looks very promising but isn't current of course.
09-15-2011, 11:01 PM
#113
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The only ones on that list that I could say anything about would be the Regal and the Cruze. From comparisons I have read, it is a solid car, but not much more than average.
09-16-2011, 05:44 AM
#114
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I have owned Ford and GM for all my vehicles. I have never been much of a fan of Japanese imports. There is the odd car here and there that I think look nice, but for the most part almost all the Asian (I say Asian to include Korea, etc) manufacturers look like cookie cutter type cars.
It's a vicious circle. People think Japanese cars are more dependable and last longer so they are worth more even used which keeps resale value high which keeps people buying Japanes cars which....
Despite the fact that the US went through decades of "crappy" cars you still see more 70s and 80s US cars on the road than you do Japanese. And honestly, to me they still look better (see the thread on 3rd Gens here on LS1Tech) than any of the new stuff Japan is putting out.
All that being said, back to the topic: this car is awesome. Wish someone would give it to me (but I would probably sell it). Would not buy it (even if I could afford it, unless I had stupid money). Wish it was lighter (and wish it LOOKED lighter). Think I would steer towards a CTS-V or Corvette before this if I was in that spending range.
It's a vicious circle. People think Japanese cars are more dependable and last longer so they are worth more even used which keeps resale value high which keeps people buying Japanes cars which....
Despite the fact that the US went through decades of "crappy" cars you still see more 70s and 80s US cars on the road than you do Japanese. And honestly, to me they still look better (see the thread on 3rd Gens here on LS1Tech) than any of the new stuff Japan is putting out.
All that being said, back to the topic: this car is awesome. Wish someone would give it to me (but I would probably sell it). Would not buy it (even if I could afford it, unless I had stupid money). Wish it was lighter (and wish it LOOKED lighter). Think I would steer towards a CTS-V or Corvette before this if I was in that spending range.
09-17-2011, 02:44 AM
#115
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"Chevrolet has announced that its upcoming 2012 Camaro ZL1 will come packing 580 hp under the hood when it goes on sale early next year, which would make it the most powerful muscle car in America and a good deal more potent than the current top of the line Camaro SS with its 426 hp V8."
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/leisure/2011/...#ixzz1XUUIOHXR
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/leisure/2011/...#ixzz1XUUIOHXR
09-17-2011, 10:32 AM
#116
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09-17-2011, 11:22 PM
#120
