suprastars

What difference does it make if its a shop car? All the parts are available from part vendors like GTM.

There are quite a few 350z exceeding 1089rwhp with twin 35r's, some with 37r's.

mzoomora

iTrader: (36)

I wouldnt agree that they are for the "well-to-do" depending on your definition, but they are definitely for the upper middle class or better. Or for people who spend too much of their money on their cars. The car market in general is just expensive now.
Just look at the price of a 350Z-

http://autos.yahoo.com/newcars/model...3?modelId=5266

That is the same basic market as a new Camaro. There arent many sporty new coupes out there, and the ones that do exist arent cheap. You can get a base Mustang GT for $25k but the new Z28 will probably kill it in power. The new G8 GT is $29,995 for a more powerful, better equipped car than the Mustang. Different target markets, but the pricing is competitive.

I dont consider myself well to do, but I do make decent money. I try to be financially responsible as far as saving, retirement, college funds, etc. I could buy a C6 Z06, but I wouldnt commit that much of my income to a car. The money that I expect the new Camaro to cost is well within what I am willing to spend and probably wont be much more than the sticker price of my truck or my wifes car.

mzoomora

iTrader: (36)

Are you serious? A shop car gets a lot more tuning time, build time and specialty parts as well as a "no cost spared" budget. Comparing a shop car to all but the most expensive customer cars is ridiculous, so I kind of expect it from you.

And there are plenty of Gen III's surpassing 1000rwhp, I would bet many times more than there are 350Z's.

But you go ahead and compare a supercharged off the shelf car to a shop built, custom parts, race gas, twin turbo car.

The Manalishi

iTrader: (3)

Sounds good.

The Manalishi

iTrader: (3)

Most shop cars I have seen take a back seat to their customers if the shop is worth a damn. I have never been to a reputable shop that even worked on their car during the normal business day. They may have some access to parts a normal customer doesn't but they are typical experimental parts that are still being tested not of the shelf proven parts. Thats just been my experience but if a shop places their own car over mine they won't have my business.

jwindbigler

iTrader: (20)

OK, I will. It was pretty hard to believe that a civic beat a camaro when the camaro had a STS kit on it.

jwindbigler

iTrader: (20)

The vette is making 400TQ 1000 RPM higher than the 350Z. Why wouldnt the vette be faster. They both peak at about the same power. They weigh about the same, but the vette has a much better curve than the 350. The 350's heads probably do flow better than the LS6 style. But you are comparing pushrods to OHC engines. I bet you that in a head to head race, that vette will beat the 350 in every category. Especially the one I care about most. The sound. Nothing can top the roar of a V8.

The Manalishi

iTrader: (3)

I can show you several Honda's that would monkeystomp a Camaro with an STS kit. You can't use what one car has to decide who will win a race. Anything can be made fast it all depends on how dedicated the owner is and how deep his pockets are. Doesn't mean you can't go fast cheaply but it is a lot harder than people think.

jwindbigler

iTrader: (20)

Thats funny. I bet that the 350 would still fall short to the vette.

DrkPhynx

Why is he still not banned? (suprastars)

Funny how steadfastly he ignores simple logic and fact (like P:W is what matters and that more displacement always allows for more power, all else being equal). He even admitted to being a troll and still isn't banned.

He should build a 1 cyl lawn mower engine swapped into a Japanese car pushing 1000rwhp and smoking Z06's.

.....or, just admit he's wrong and

jwindbigler

iTrader: (20)

True. With enough money you can make a 1000HP kia. Why someone would do it is beyond me. But you can. Im not saying that there arent civics out there that can beat a STS camaro. Im just saying that MOST cant. MOST cant beat them when the camaro is stock...lol.

jwindbigler

iTrader: (20)

ROFL!!! I mean, just look at his name...suprastars. Thats not rice.

davidadavila

dude this is so ******* irritating.....this thread should of died ten years ago the fact that it comes down to simple ******* math......

you boost 2.0 of engine you get x amount of horepower
you boost 5.7 you get more as easy as that........

...going back to the subject..im sure there going to have a regular 5.7 version of the challenger and a 6 .....they just have to.....that hemi engine is awsome i love it...those dodge guys sure have and exellent powerplant...they just needed a car to put it in....challenger is cool but that quarter panel is so ugly nothing like the concept

jwindbigler

iTrader: (20)

I dont know if I really like them anymore. I sure as heck dont like the 37K MSRP. You can get a pretty good vette for that. Dont get me wrong, the car is very sexy. It will definately turn a lot of heads, and will be wickedly fast once they get some good parts for it. I think that they need to lower the price on it to take some of the mustang sales. The cheap *** stang is killing the muscle car industry. Mustang GT's are women muscle cars. (just my opinion). The Cobras arent much better. (extept the 03-04's) and the SALEENS look cool, but thats about it. Like I said my opinion.

mzoomora

iTrader: (36)

Most high profile shops use their shop cars as a showcase. It a moving, driving ad for them, it is their name on the line. And if it isnt the shops car it is usually teh shop owners car. Look at AMS and their shop EVO. Just read the thread link, they spent all night tuning an the car. Most shops are not going to stay over night to work on a customers car.

How many customer cars do you think get countless dyno pulls, a 24 hour tuning session, etc. Many shop cars get multiple cams, different cylinder heads, misc parts looking for that next 10 hp.

suprastars

If you have a reputable tuning/performance shop, then yes I would expect them to take their time on something so important as tuning.

Look at the company for instance. They produce their on rods(GTM rods) there are able to support 2000hp for 6cyl motors. They have all the equipment to manufactor their on cams. They install all their pistons/rods, sleeving, etc... in house. These arent a fly by night performance shop. They tuned my car for 5 hours and had countless runs.

On another note, that is a customers car who drives it on a daily basis.

mzoomora

iTrader: (36)

Thats funny, because he said it was the shop car. And they also tuned on it for much more than 5 hours, or from what he said a 24 hour session. At the shop rate that is probably close to a $3000 tune or more.

suprastars

That car is much more extensive than my setup. All you need is a base map to work off of and the tuning will come much cheaper.

Your acting as if taking a long time to tune a negative. I wish more companies would provide extensive tuning efforts to please their customers. I couldnt tell you how many graphs Ive seen where the A/F ratio's where off the charts, timing was to high etc....

There is a reason why they are the largest 350z/g35 performance shop. I would rather have someone who took their time tuning, than someone who's rushing just to make more money!

mzoomora

iTrader: (36)

I never acted like taking a long time to tune is a negative, but very few customers are going to spend thousands on a tune and dyno time. That is the difference between a customer car and a shop car- the shop is doing everything at cost. Stop trying to turn my words into something else. You asked what difference it makes that it is a shop car, and that is a big difference. Tuning, dyno time, parts, labor, etc. are all done at cost and with no cost spared really. Many parts are probably even sponsored or donated for testing. Any down time the shop has can be spent on the car with no real cost.

One of the reasons they are the largest G35/350Z shop is that people see what their shop cars does and it builds confidence, that is the purpose of the shop car and why it gets top notch parts and so much time invested. And again, this wasnt done to a customers car because very few are going to be willing to pay for that type of labor, and the shop isnt going to spend that kind of time on a $500 customer tune.

Keep trying to put a spin on it all you want. First you are comparing a STS to a conventional turbo, and a STS is a less that ideal setup for all out power and response. Then you are comparing a supercharged, stock cammed, pump gas customers car to a custom built, custom cammed, turbo shop car on race gas. But you dont want to give all the real info because then people would know how full of **** you are.

I tell you what, supras may be fast, but how many how gone mid 4's at 330mph? Because Hemi's do that **** all the time and I can get one in the new Challenger or Charger, that makes domestics better and Supras pieces of **** because they cant hang.

Sounds like one of your completely off topic, totally useless and utterly ridiculous comparisons.

mzoomora

iTrader: (36)

http://www.my350z.com/forum/showthre...33#post3335620

Sounds like a shop car to me.