tommycompton

iTrader: (1)

Here are the codes I'm pulling
I have all there meanings, but wondering if it points to a tune problem?
It starts to fire but won't stay running.
P0689 -- Engine Controls Ignition Relay Feedback Circuit Low Voltage
P1516 -- Throttle Actuator Control (TAC) Module Actuator Position Performance
• P1682 -- Ignition 1 Switch Circuit 2
P2176 -- Minimum Throttle Position Not Learned
The above DTCs may have set under a low battery voltage condition during or prior to vehicle cranking, then starting.

And finally
p2101 Throttle Actuator "A" Control Motor Circuit Range/Performance



Any insight?

cts-vls6

iTrader: (7)

ck the throttle body connection and the pins at the throttle body,or u can diag.

DTC P1516, P2101, P2119, or P2176
Diagnostic Instructions
• Perform the Diagnostic System Check - Vehicle prior to using this diagnostic procedure.

• Review Strategy Based Diagnosis for an overview of the diagnostic approach.

• Diagnostic Procedure Instructions provides an overview of each diagnostic category.

DTC Descriptors
DTC P1516: Throttle Actuator Control (TAC) Module Throttle Actuator Position Performance

DTC P2101: Throttle Actuator Position Performance

DTC P2119: Throttle Closed Position Performance

DTC P2176: Minimum Throttle Position Not Learned

Diagnostic Fault Information
Circuit
Short to Ground
High Resistance
Open
Short to Voltage
Signal Performance

Motor Control 1
P1516, P2101, P2176
P1516, P2101, P2176
P1516, P2101, P2176
P1516, P2101, P2176
P1516, P2101, P2176

Motor Control 2
P1516, P2101, P2176
P1516, P2101, P2176
P1516, P2101, P2176
P1516, P2101, P2176
P1516, P2101, P2176

Circuit/System Description
The engine control module (ECM) is the control center for the throttle actuator control (TAC) system. The ECM determines the drivers intent and then calculates the appropriate throttle response. The ECM achieves throttle positioning by providing a pulse width modulated voltage to the TAC motor. The TAC system uses the following circuits:

• Motor control 1

• Motor control 2

Two processors are also used to monitor the TAC system data. Both processors are located within the ECM. Both processors monitor each other's data to verify that the indicated throttle position is correct.

Conditions for Running the DTC
P1516 and P2101
• The ignition is ON.

• The ignition voltage is more than 8 volts.

• The system is not in the Battery Save mode.

• The engine is running.

• DTC P0068 is not set.

• DTCs P1516 and P2101 run continuously when the above conditions are met.

P2119
• The ignition is ON.

• The ignition voltage is more than 8 volts.

• The system is in the Battery Save mode.

• DTC P2119 runs continuously when the above conditions are met.

P2176
• The ignition is ON.

• The ignition voltage is more than 8 volts.

• The system is not in the Battery Save mode.

• The engine is running.

• DTCs P0068, P0120, P0122, P0123, P0220, P0222, P0223 are not set.

• DTC P2176 runs continuously when the above conditions are met.

Conditions for Setting the DTC
P1516
The indicated throttle position does not match the predicted throttle position for more than 0.5 second.

P2101
The indicated throttle position does not match the predicted throttle position for more than 0.3 second.

P2119
The ECM determines that the throttle blade did not return to the rest position within 720 milliseconds.

P2176
The difference between the predicted and the actual throttle position is more than a calibrated amount for more than 1.5 seconds.

Action Taken When the DTC Sets
• DTCs P1516, P2101, and P2176 are Type A DTCs.

• DTC P2119 is a Type C DTC.

Conditions for Clearing the MIL/DTC
• DTCs P1516, P2101, and P2176 are Type A DTCs.

• DTC P2119 is a Type C DTC.

Reference Information
Schematic Reference
Engine Controls Schematics

Description and Operation
Throttle Actuator Control (TAC) System Description

Connector End View Reference

• Engine Controls Connector End Views

• Engine Control Module Connector End Views


Electrical Information Reference

• Circuit Testing

• Connector Repairs

• Testing for Intermittent Conditions and Poor Connections

• Wiring Repairs


DTC Type Reference
Powertrain Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) Type Definitions

Scan Tool Reference

• Scan Tool Data List

• Scan Tool Data Definitions


Circuit/System Verification
Ignition ON, engine OFF, use a scan tool to observe the throttle position (TP) sensor 1 indicated position. Throttle position should increase as pedal is applied and decrease as pedal is released. When no accelerator pedal activity is detected, the throttle position will return to the spring loaded default position.

Circuit/System Testing
Caution: Turn OFF the ignition before inserting fingers into the throttle bore. Unexpected movement of the throttle blade could cause personal injury.

•Inspect the throttle body for the following conditions:
• A throttle blade that is NOT in the rest position

• A throttle valve that is binding open or closed

• A throttle blade that is free to move open or closed WITHOUT spring pressure

⇒ If a condition is found, replace the throttle body assembly.

Important: Disconnecting the throttle body harness connector causes additional DTCs to set.

•Ignition OFF, disconnect the harness connector at the throttle body.
•Ignition ON, verify that a test lamp does not illuminate between motor control 1 circuit terminal A and ground.
⇒ If test lamp illuminates, test the motor control circuit for a short to voltage. If the circuit tests normal, replace the ECM.

•Ignition ON, verify that a test lamp does not illuminate between motor control 2 circuit terminal B and ground.
⇒ If the test lamp illuminates, test the motor control circuit for a short to voltage. If the circuit tests normal, replace the ECM.

•Ignition ON, verify that a test lamp does not illuminate between motor control 1 circuit terminal A and B+.
⇒ If the test lamp illuminates, test the motor control circuit for a short to ground. If the circuit tests normal, replace the ECM.

•Ignition ON, verify that a test lamp does not illuminate between motor control 2 circuit terminal B and B+.
⇒ If the test lamp illuminates, test the motor control circuit for a short to ground. If the circuit tests normal, replace the ECM.

•Ignition OFF, allow sufficient time for the ECM to completely power down. Connect a DMM between the motor control 1 circuit terminal A and ground.
Important: When measuring peak voltage, ensure that the DMM is on the proper voltage scale and that the response time is set to 1 ms.

•Measure for B+ on the motor control 1 circuit terminal A as the ignition is turned ON.
⇒ If the peak voltage is not within 1 volt of B+, test the circuit for an open/high resistance. If the circuit tests normal, replace the ECM.

•Ignition OFF, allow sufficient time for the ECM to completely power down.
•Measure for B+ on the motor control 2 circuit terminal B as the ignition is turned ON.
⇒ If the peak voltage is not within 1 volt of B+, test the circuit for an open/high resistance. If the circuit tests normal, replace the ECM.

•If all circuits test normal, replace the throttle body.

cts-vls6

iTrader: (7)

Throttle Body



Connector Part Information
•OEM: 15355297
•Service: 88988106
•Description: 6-Way F GT 150 Series Sealed (BK)

Terminal Part Information
•Terminal/Tray: 12191819/8
•Core/Insulation Crimp: E/A
•Release Tool/Test Probe: 15315247/J-35616-2A (GY)

Throttle Body Pin
Wire Color
Circuit No.
Function

A
BN
582
TAC Motor Control - 2

B
YE
581
TAC Motor Control - 1

C
TN/WH
1704
Low Reference

D
D-GN
485
TP Sensor 1 Signal

E
L-BU/BK
1688
5-Volt Reference

F
PU
486
TP Sensor 2 Signal

tommycompton

iTrader: (1)

Wiring isn't my strong point.
I can't really see it being the throttle body itself unless it's just fluke it went out. However maybe the wiring to the throttle body from the ECM, with all the cutting and splicing I had to do, or it's the ECM itself. I have another ECM I could try swap out mind you the car may not run much with 65lb injectors and no tune in the spare. But if I pull the same codes I could atleast deduct that from being a culprit.
I'm hoping its not wiring under the blower itself getting pinched but mind you I had to move the TPS wire from that over the intake harness. I was very carefull in doing so.
I don't have access to a tech II, so i'll be wire testing with a multimeter.

punishmentcycle

iTrader: (6)

go over all your connections and splices.. doesnt sound tune related, more like a splice that doesnt have a good contact

tommycompton

iTrader: (1)

Yeah I'm hoping it's an easy find.

serik21

could be dead battery caused the ecm to forgot throttle position, press gas pedal all the way to the floor put key in, try to start for about 15 sec, turn off release gas pedal and try to start it normally see if that helps

tommycompton

iTrader: (1)

^^^ tried that no dice. Had my battery die too though.

punishmentcycle

iTrader: (6)

this car gave me a bunch of codes and problems one time when the original battery died on me.. but its prolly in the wiring somewhere,... and make sure all ur harnesses are tied off away from moving parts.. i went to chage my oil last night and found that my harness had somehow moved down enough to hit the rear belt on my maggie.. caught it just in time! and i had everything tied up pretty good and tight and it still moved..

tommycompton

iTrader: (1)

Well Both ECM's throw the same codes so I'm assuming it's not that.
Can't see any obvious signs of wiring damage so far. I have a buddy going to drop by with a tech II, and I can get into a tuner next week.

punishmentcycle

iTrader: (6)

What is in the car for a tune now?

tommycompton

iTrader: (1)

Just a mail order tune from DRE with the specs of the bolts ons, just supposed to be a safe tune untill I could get to the dyno.

tommycompton

iTrader: (1)

Well I tested the connection to the throttle body with a light tester and a DMM as per the instructions above. all tested out OK. So it's leading me to think the throttle body is the culprit?
Still have a buddy dropping by with a tech II to see what that might tell me.

tommycompton

iTrader: (1)

OK never mind got her running. LOL I'm laughing at myself now, had a tech II on it, same conclusions, wiring or TB. Well I was to the point that the Blower had to come off to check for wiring pinches. Had a buddy come over and he just randomly started checking fuses, and the manifold fuse was blown,,,,,
probably when i spliced teh wire to the MAP. Put a new fuse and instantly heard the TB click with key on, sure enough hook it all back up and she fired.
Such an obvious yet dumb *** over sight. Remember cecking fuses but not the manifold labeled fuse. I gues it was shutting off the TB to prevent firing and turning on limp mode.
Idles like a kitten now after clearing the codes.
Man I was at wits end.
Just needed another fresh approach.

D Block

iTrader: (1)

Nice.. Sometimes it just takes that fresh set of eyes to find the little stuff. Now get that bad boy on the dyno n post up some #'s!!

whisler151

Good news! Cant wait to see/hear her running.

tommycompton

iTrader: (1)

Vids and dyno to be posted soon. I'll get her to the dyno this up coming week, god willing.

Just a note on my buddy with the Tech II, he brought it by and the thing is wireless!!!!
Too bad it didn't tell me the fuse was blown.
And thanks all for the posted help and insight.