72Elkytpi

iTrader: (47)

nice job on the stang. how did you hook up the camaro gauge to the camaro computer. is there just one wire with the serial data. there is a large connector on the back of the gauges with about 20 pins on it.

also do you like the hydraboost or should we not bother with something so exotic. My tall valve covers are hitting my 95 cobra booster, really anoying so im considering your route.

you seem to have a great handle on the wiring too. did you have a schematic???

oh and my kooks exit right by the trans mount so im a little miffed at this, how did you route your collector and xpipe.

thanks
Rich

96gt4.6

iTrader: (5)

Interesting. All I did on his was use a generic ground cable from the auto parts store, go from the negative post to the engine block. Then, make sure you have a ground going from the body of the car to the negative battery post also.

96gt4.6

iTrader: (5)

Rich,

All the gauges on Mustang's pre '99 model year are still hardwired to their individual engine sensors. So, all I did was install the Mustang sensors into the LS motor. However, I do not have the water temp hooked up yet as i'm going to have to fab a bung and piece of pipe to go into the heater hose for that to work. As far as the tach and such, the LS motor has a dedicated tach output wire, and the '96 had a tach wire running to the PCM, so I just spliced the two together at the passenger kick panel, and adjusted the tach output frequency in the LS PCM to make the tach read correctly.

The hydorboost was factory on this stang, and worked out really well. On the older cars that had a vacuum booster, i'm not sure what it would all involve changing over. There are a lot of prebent steel lines that would be needed also. I have miles of room on his build with it though. It might be more advisable to attempt a valve cover change rather than switching to hydroboost?

I have access to factory Ford wiring schematics, and for the GM side I used: http://www.alldatadiy.com

you will definately need schematics to do the install as I have done, utilizing stock wiring and moving the PCM.

As far as exhaust, his headers have no issues, they exit right on each side of the trans, and he used a universal X kit from summit, the X crosses behind the transmission.

ge_forcez22

iTrader: (3)

Do you have pictures of which wires you hooked up to get the tach and speddo to work? And exactly what you changed with the GM PCM. (I have a 1998 GT)

I am going to likely be tackeling my cluswter setup today as DSI should have my driveshaft made today

Also have to build the T-56 crossmember.

Speedy911

iTrader: (24)

Is it me, or is your tach lazy?

96gt4.6

iTrader: (5)

Wiring the cluster is easy. You do not need to remove it to access any wires behind it at all. All the necessary input wires for the tach and speedo are located at the factory Ford PCM connector in the passenger kick panel.

Here's how you hook it up.

Beware, these instructions only apply to '96-'98 PCM's. I DID NOT check pinouts for any other years. On the GM side, the pin numbers are for the drive by wire computer, but are possibly shared by the drive by cable. Double check for safety!

Tach

On the factory Ford PCM connector, locate pin#48. They are labeled on the back side of the connector. Snip this wire off the connector. Now, on your LS PCM, connector 2, Green (assuming you are using a drive-by-wire PCM) find pin 10. Splice Pin 10 from the LS PCM to Pin 48 on the Ford PCM. Now, you will need to add a "pull up" resistor to the circuit. Grab a 1K resistor from Radio Shack, splice one end of the resistor to a 12V switched power source (I used an adjacent power wire going to the LS PCM) and connect the other end of the resistor to the new circuit you have made. This must be done as the factory LS PCM's tach output signal is too weak to be read by the factory tach. If you are using EFI Live, i'm told you have the capability to turn this feature on with your tuner. Now, you'll need to change the factory LS's pcm output tach pulses to match the 'Stang's. Go into the tune and change this parameter from 6 to 3. Done!



Speedo

On the Ford PCM connector, find pin 58. On the LS connector C2 - Green - (again assuming you are using DBW) find pin 50. Splice the two together. Now beware, there will only be a VSS pulse on this wire if you are using a 4L60E/80E/6spd trans where the VSS input to the LS pcm is hooked up! If say you're using a TH350, you will need to get an in-line signal generator and hook it up to the LS PCM, then go into the tune and calculate the VSS pulses/mile to get the proper output pulses on this output wire.

You guys might check and make sure i've got those pin numbers right on the Speedo output, there are two outputs on the LS PCM, one is at a higher pulse rate for the ABS, and one is for the cluster. I believe that's the right pin number.

Nope, it's lazy in the video. I'm not sure if it's YouTube or the video itself. It's fine in person, snaps with the RPM perfectly. If you notice the oil PSI guage is also lazy in the video.

99MUSTANG5.3L

Yup, I have a 2 gage ground from neg battery term to block(sanded clean), another 2 gage strap from block to body, a 2 gage from starter to block, and a 4 gage from battery to body. I'm gonna add a 2 gage from body to crossmember this weekend and if that doesn't do it I'll start from scatch again. I even had the starter tested to make sure it was good.

96gt4.6

iTrader: (5)

This is not necessary. The starter grounds through the casing.

I wouldn't see a need for this one either.

This problem should be very simple to solve using a digital multimeter and voltage drop testing. Put the meter across the wire in question, attempt to crank the motor and read the voltage drop. Should not exceed .5-.8 or so per circuit.

Is the starter even trying to engage? Clicking?

If you're not getting any clicking or even an attempt to crank, you need to be looking at the power supplied from the starter relay to the starter solenoid itself, not the high-current side of the starter wiring.

On Dan's, I noticed that you had to have one of the connectors installed under the hood as it had a 'looped' circuit in it to complete the starting circuit on the Mustang. The purpose of this 'loop' was only present on the manual trans equipped cars, as it was the circuit to the neutral safety switch. Without that plug plugged in the car won't crank.

Keep me posted if you would like help, and i'll guide you as best as I can.

99MUSTANG5.3L

I was just thinking about this "loop" you are talking about. Reason being, I have supplied this motor with better grounding than my Silverado has and still no crank. I have been just using a jumper across the starter relay contacts at the underhood fuse block. I know I'm just missing something. Now like you said, I am thinking it has to do with the nuetral safety switch. Thanks for all your help and suggestions, I'll keep you posted.

Forgot to mention that yes it does click and kind of groan, but thats it. I've pulled the starter and tried testing it with jumper cables and I can get it to run(not just click) if I put both leads on the case to ground with power supplied via the starter cables.

96gt4.6

iTrader: (5)

10-4 buddy. If you can crank it by jumping the relay, it's not the high current side you're having problems with.

This loop is found in this connector on Dan's '96, it's on the transmission wiring harness end:



Here it is detailed in the wiring diagram, you can see the Auto vs. manual schematic. Also, make sure if your car was a stick you have bypassed the clutch switch! This diagram is from a '96, so '99 may be different. Notice how the diagram shows the jumper as straight? Confusing right, if you were looking at this you wouldn't even think that's a loop, till you look at the connector number it enters/exits.

96gt4.6

iTrader: (5)

This statement definately throws a wrench in the theory.

Check power to the 'S' terminal of the starter while cranking, the smaller terminal on the solenoid, to make sure you got good power from the starter relay to the solenoid.

If the starter is clicking, and trying to crank the motor, you need to do a voltage drop test of your ground and power cables. You also need to check your battery's charge and state of health.

If the battery LOAD tests ok on a load tester, and your cable voltage drop testing check ok, the next step is to current draw test the starter. Bench testing can yield somewhat innaccurate results on a starter, as you're not loading it. You'll need an inductive pickup for your multimeter to measure the high current load of the starter, or an appropriate substitute. If neither are available, a substitute starter is necessary.

If the current draw, voltage drop and battery check, we need to make sure the motor turns over OK in the 1st place, as this is the last alternative if all the above check, exactly as i've described doing it.

99MUSTANG5.3L

Battery is brand new Interstate. The motor turns over by hand, I can turn it over using the harmonic balancer and just my hands, no wrenches.

I had the starter tested at a local Auto zone, not sure if they current draw test them or not, will call them tomorrow. Then I will start with the voltage drop testing. Thanks again,Mark.

99MUSTANG5.3L

I called the Auto zone where I had the starter tested and they said their test does include the current draw test. I took the starter over to an Advance Auto store and had them retest it, PASS. I then thought that maybe the battery was too small so I tried the battery out of my truck, same results! I took my die grinder and cleaned every grounding point, same results. I found the wire in the column for the start circuit, verified 12v while cranking, connected this to the "S" term on the starter via a 12 gage wire, same results.


So to recap; grounding, 2 gage from batt to block, 2 gage from block to body, 2 gage from starter to block, 4 gage from starter to body, 2 braided straps(came from Avalanche donor) from block to body 1 at drivers side head and 1 at rear of head drivers side, 4 gage from pass side front head to body.

power; 2 gage from batt(+) to starter, 4 gage from batt(+) to under hood fuse block,12 gage wire from ignition switch directly to "S" term on starter.

After all of this I still have no crank! WTF!! I used the same points to ground as the truck. When I do attempt to start it the cables get REAL hot! You can actually see the cables move when you hit the key. I don't mind tellin ya, I'm stumped!!!!! Ready to firebomb the POS.

ge_forcez22

iTrader: (3)

If you are saying the wires are getting hot you have a major short. When you say you have the starter grounded to the block... Off which terminal? Starter grounds by the housing being bolted to the block, not a wire.

99MUSTANG5.3L

Dude, you were absolutely correct!! I knew I was overlooking something. I don't know what made me even put a ground there. Thank you for your tip! Turns over nicely now.

96gtdan

iTrader: (6)

Ran into a snag! Car bout done on tuning and 3rd gear decides to go out. performa built being nice with there great customer service and replacing the tranny.

Inbred

iTrader: (5)

I'm at the final Stages of my build and have encountered some small wiring setback.....

How did you hook up the volts gauge?
Whatt did you do with the tcc brake switch Connector? Seems like Ford integrted it into the trans range sensor, right?
I also am confused with the p/n switch.....

Any help would be appreciated. Thanks -eli

96gt4.6

iTrader: (5)

Sorry for the delayed reply, i've been very occupied with a multitude of things right now.

The (factory) volts guage gets it's reading from the Insturment Cluster's power feed wire, so you don't need to do anything there.

The TCC brake switch input is kinda tricky. The GM PCM looks for a constant B+ input on the TCC Input pin, untill you step on the brake, then it needs to remove power to that pin (i'd have to look at the diagram to recall which connector/pin this is). The Ford however, is opposite, it is looking for B+ only when you are on the brake, and no power when not on it.

The above also answers the question about the TCC brake switch on the Ford, no it's not integrated into the Neutral Safety/PN switch on the side of the trans. The two are totally different systems.

If your car came factory with cruise control, I believe there is a pin on the cruise servo that has this constant output with no brake input, and you can tap into it.

Dan's car did not have cruise, so I had to use a relay to invert the brake signal.

As far as the GM neutral safety switch, what trans are you running in your setup?

Inbred

iTrader: (5)

Thanks..

im using a a 4l60e.
i bought an ebay harness. theres two wires for the p/n switch and two more for the tcc.....thats where i stumbled...

everything is pretty much done, just need to finish up the last of wiring and get my driveshaft hooked up.

this thread has been of lots of help. thanks guys

96gtdan

iTrader: (6)

Still waiting on tranny to come back. while waiting went ahead and sent the stall in aswell to get restalled to 4400.