'70 Nova LY6/TH400 6.0VVT
09-06-2012, 02:26 PM
#482
I got word today that they found a Gen IV 6.0 iron block (most certainly an LY6 or L96 since all others would be 4.8/5.3 or aluminum) and expect to have it in their shop tomorrow. They said if it checks out they could have it ready by Monday. I guess we'll see.
09-08-2012, 12:46 AM
#483
I'm not sure that if I had the issues that you are having, that I would have got through my build. I have been very busy this year moving, minding the kids, and haven't had very many opportunities to drive my car. Had it not come together when it did, I wouldn't be enjoying it now. That being said, I drove it 200 miles this evening, got stuck in horrible stop and go traffic, and have another 11 second all motor street radial pass, without breaking a sweat. This would have never been possible before without an overheat, a blown head gasket, and race gas. Soon it will be in the 10s, when I rebuild my bad nitrous solenoid, which I haven't had time to do. It handles great ,for a 40+ year old, with new suspension and steering, but I could really use bigger brakes. Yours will handle even better, and if you're lucky, be faster.
I'm rambling on here, not to brag about my build, but to motivate and encourage you to press on. It will be worth it. I haven't worked on my car in several months, but to hop in the car and do what I did tonight... totally worth it. Nice job on the frame by the way and keep up the good work.
I'm rambling on here, not to brag about my build, but to motivate and encourage you to press on. It will be worth it. I haven't worked on my car in several months, but to hop in the car and do what I did tonight... totally worth it. Nice job on the frame by the way and keep up the good work.
Last edited by futureuser; 09-08-2012 at 02:35 AM.
09-10-2012, 01:38 PM
#484
futureuser, thanks for the encouragement. I know the results will be well worth the effort. The reminder keeps me motivated. This is going to be a very fun car when it's running again, but it's also a lot of fun to build/tinker with. I really enjoy it.
09-11-2012, 05:33 AM
#486
I'm not sure I'm yet in the "it was worth it phase," since I'm still chasing a few gremlins and the amount of work it took me this summer put a tremendous strain on me and the family time, but I have NEVER been in a car that has the tremendous power and driveability that my Mast-cammed L96 has. It is simply amazing....hopefully you'll be enjoying that soon. Hang in there and get 'er done!
09-14-2012, 11:52 AM
#487
If anyone knows a source for a Gen IV 6.0L+ block, iron or aluminum near the Ventura or San Fernando Valley areas in CA, please let me know. I talked to Summit and I can still exchange my Wiseco pistons if I need a difference bore size, so 6.2s will work too.
09-14-2012, 01:39 PM
#489
That's a good idea. I asked and it is at least .100 over and damaged near the top of the bore within the first .200 of the deck. His said the only way he'd feel comfortable using the block would be to sleeve that cylinder, but I really don't want to go that route. He is following up with his GM parts connection to see if he can't obtain a replacement block. I reiterated that an aluminum block would also be fine, but we'll see how it goes.
09-14-2012, 03:31 PM
#490
Clint,
Sorry to hear they dropped the ball on you. You are WAY more lienant than I would be. They should just bite the bullet and replace it with a LS2 block and mark it up as a "learning exsperince". Their almost 2 months to machine a block is simply unacceptable.
best wishes,
Jim
Sorry to hear they dropped the ball on you. You are WAY more lienant than I would be. They should just bite the bullet and replace it with a LS2 block and mark it up as a "learning exsperince". Their almost 2 months to machine a block is simply unacceptable.
best wishes,
Jim
09-19-2012, 05:26 PM
#491
To be fair, although it still is pretty bad, they didn't get the parts until early August, so the block waited one month (not two) to get machined. Still not an acceptable delay.
I got an email from them and while they are still looking for a replacement block, they offered to sleeve my block and do all the block machine work free of charge, but would still charge for the crank polish and balancing. I have been doing some research on sleeving blocks and while it gives me some heartburn, it would save me a big chunk of money. I am going to call and see what they can tell me about the process and reliability of the repair. From what I've read the most important things are to get the right interference fit and either machine a step at the bottom of the bore or use a flanged sleeve to prevent it from shifting. Other than that I have no idea how reliable that kind of repair is or if this offer is worth considering. Thoughts?
I got an email from them and while they are still looking for a replacement block, they offered to sleeve my block and do all the block machine work free of charge, but would still charge for the crank polish and balancing. I have been doing some research on sleeving blocks and while it gives me some heartburn, it would save me a big chunk of money. I am going to call and see what they can tell me about the process and reliability of the repair. From what I've read the most important things are to get the right interference fit and either machine a step at the bottom of the bore or use a flanged sleeve to prevent it from shifting. Other than that I have no idea how reliable that kind of repair is or if this offer is worth considering. Thoughts?
09-21-2012, 10:25 AM
#494
I spoke to the shop a bit more yesterday to get details. They leave a step at the bottom of the cylinder to retain the sleeve. The block is honed for a smooth interference fit to optimize heat transfer. They use dry ice to shrink the sleeve prior to install. No sealant / locking compounds are used to prevent loss of heat transfer. In their opinion the repair is as reliable as the original block when done properly.
I also private messaged back and forth with Steve @ Race Engine Development in Oceanside. He echoed this is not an uncommon repair and when done properly is as reliable as the original block. The important thing to note is that if the block is cracked it will likely leak. In my case, the block is not cracked and the damage did not break a water jacket. Steve was very helpful over PM and I greatly appreciate his advice.
QMP has been honest with me about what happened. If they were dishonest I think they would have just sleeved it without telling me what happened since the sleeve will not be easy to see once the fix is done. They have also offered to work with me to make things right. At this point I am leaning toward taking their offer and having them proceed with the sleeve.
I also private messaged back and forth with Steve @ Race Engine Development in Oceanside. He echoed this is not an uncommon repair and when done properly is as reliable as the original block. The important thing to note is that if the block is cracked it will likely leak. In my case, the block is not cracked and the damage did not break a water jacket. Steve was very helpful over PM and I greatly appreciate his advice.
QMP has been honest with me about what happened. If they were dishonest I think they would have just sleeved it without telling me what happened since the sleeve will not be easy to see once the fix is done. They have also offered to work with me to make things right. At this point I am leaning toward taking their offer and having them proceed with the sleeve.
09-21-2012, 11:23 PM
#495
Okay on to other things. If you remember a while back I mocked up the accessories:
Notice how low the AC bracket sits where the tensioner attaches at the bottom. I unfortunately didn't take any photos, but when I was mocking things up I did a test fit of the sway bar and it interfered with that part of the bracket. To remedy, I through some washers under the sway bar mount to bring it down and was able to get enough clearance. So now I am following up with a more permanent solution - some aluminum spacers. I made these out of 1/2" aluminum (nevermind the temporary hardware - I need to get some socket cap screws to fit these properly)
With the spacers, here is where the swaybar sits relative to the notches in the frame:
It's hard to see, but there is still a small clearance between the bottom of the bar and the middle of the frame. I have a feeling the bar may rub here when the bushings distort under load, but not enough to hurt anything.
Now doing this is not without penalty of course. There is a 1/2" reduction in clearance between the sway bar mounts and the lower control arm. To see if it limited up travel, I tried jacking the car up by the control arm. Because there is little weight on the front of the car, the bump stop hardly compressed.
So next I removed the bumpstop and jacked the arm up until it made contact. Not surprisingly, the lower control arm hit the sway bar bracket.
In this position I measured about 1/2" of gap where the bump stop goes.
Here is a tape-measure shot of the factory-style bumpstops I currently have. The overall height is about 1-1/2" and the full width portion is about 5/8". I am not sure how much this will compress under load, but I have a feeling it may be close. Anyone have any experience in this regard to tell me about how much bumpstop compression I should expect?
Thanks for any thoughts/feedback.
Notice how low the AC bracket sits where the tensioner attaches at the bottom. I unfortunately didn't take any photos, but when I was mocking things up I did a test fit of the sway bar and it interfered with that part of the bracket. To remedy, I through some washers under the sway bar mount to bring it down and was able to get enough clearance. So now I am following up with a more permanent solution - some aluminum spacers. I made these out of 1/2" aluminum (nevermind the temporary hardware - I need to get some socket cap screws to fit these properly)
With the spacers, here is where the swaybar sits relative to the notches in the frame:
It's hard to see, but there is still a small clearance between the bottom of the bar and the middle of the frame. I have a feeling the bar may rub here when the bushings distort under load, but not enough to hurt anything.
Now doing this is not without penalty of course. There is a 1/2" reduction in clearance between the sway bar mounts and the lower control arm. To see if it limited up travel, I tried jacking the car up by the control arm. Because there is little weight on the front of the car, the bump stop hardly compressed.
So next I removed the bumpstop and jacked the arm up until it made contact. Not surprisingly, the lower control arm hit the sway bar bracket.
In this position I measured about 1/2" of gap where the bump stop goes.
Here is a tape-measure shot of the factory-style bumpstops I currently have. The overall height is about 1-1/2" and the full width portion is about 5/8". I am not sure how much this will compress under load, but I have a feeling it may be close. Anyone have any experience in this regard to tell me about how much bumpstop compression I should expect?
Thanks for any thoughts/feedback.
09-23-2012, 08:14 PM
#497
I spoke to the shop a bit more yesterday to get details. They leave a step at the bottom of the cylinder to retain the sleeve. The block is honed for a smooth interference fit to optimize heat transfer. They use dry ice to shrink the sleeve prior to install. No sealant / locking compounds are used to prevent loss of heat transfer. In their opinion the repair is as reliable as the original block when done properly.
I also private messaged back and forth with Steve @ Race Engine Development in Oceanside. He echoed this is not an uncommon repair and when done properly is as reliable as the original block. The important thing to note is that if the block is cracked it will likely leak. In my case, the block is not cracked and the damage did not break a water jacket. Steve was very helpful over PM and I greatly appreciate his advice.
QMP has been honest with me about what happened. If they were dishonest I think they would have just sleeved it without telling me what happened since the sleeve will not be easy to see once the fix is done. They have also offered to work with me to make things right. At this point I am leaning toward taking their offer and having them proceed with the sleeve.
I also private messaged back and forth with Steve @ Race Engine Development in Oceanside. He echoed this is not an uncommon repair and when done properly is as reliable as the original block. The important thing to note is that if the block is cracked it will likely leak. In my case, the block is not cracked and the damage did not break a water jacket. Steve was very helpful over PM and I greatly appreciate his advice.
QMP has been honest with me about what happened. If they were dishonest I think they would have just sleeved it without telling me what happened since the sleeve will not be easy to see once the fix is done. They have also offered to work with me to make things right. At this point I am leaning toward taking their offer and having them proceed with the sleeve.
09-24-2012, 01:08 PM
#498
The deed is already done. They are working on it now. It's not ideal, but I've talked to a lot of people with experience sleeving iron blocks and I have yet to come across a failure. Here is another thread with some discussion on the subject: https://ls1tech.com/forums/generatio...ron-block.html
The latest expected finish date for machining is this Friday.
The latest expected finish date for machining is this Friday.
09-27-2012, 08:17 PM
#499
Got a call from the machine shop today. The block is finished. I couldn't pick it up today but will try tomorrow. They checked all the bearing clearances for me and came up with:
Mains: 0.0011in (Clevite P spec 0.0002-0.0018)
Rods: 0.0021in (Clevite P spec 0.0012-0.0037)
Both are within Clevite specifications, but the mains sure seem tight by performance standards. This is with stock style (p-series) Clevite bearings. I can go to a performance bearing (h-series) which is available in 0.001 increments if I want to increase clearance. I'm not sure what to do yet. I was leaning toward the p bearings because I've heard it wears better, but it isn't available over-sized and I think I may want to shoot for more clearance. Any thoughts?
Mains: 0.0011in (Clevite P spec 0.0002-0.0018)
Rods: 0.0021in (Clevite P spec 0.0012-0.0037)
Both are within Clevite specifications, but the mains sure seem tight by performance standards. This is with stock style (p-series) Clevite bearings. I can go to a performance bearing (h-series) which is available in 0.001 increments if I want to increase clearance. I'm not sure what to do yet. I was leaning toward the p bearings because I've heard it wears better, but it isn't available over-sized and I think I may want to shoot for more clearance. Any thoughts?
Last edited by -TheBandit-; 09-27-2012 at 11:53 PM.
