Hand ported 853 heads from 2002 with a TR224 cam, GUESS!
06-18-2010, 03:15 PM
#1
Hand ported 853 heads from 2002 with a TR224 cam, GUESS! Last time my car was on a dyno was back in 2002. I dyno'd 430/408 and was very happy. The heads are 853's hand ported by Joe Prince, with a good valve job, milled 0.038" (something around 11:1) and the cam is a 224/224 on a 112lsa.
I finally decided to go with a set of Cary's new Performance Induction heads, and a custom Virginia Speed cam. So I wanted a baseling before swapping and it's a good way to sell the current setup. Over the past 8 years, I've kept the same heads and cam, but swapped from an LS6 intake to a Vengeance ported 90/90 combo. I went from a box tune with LS1Edit to a custom tune with Hptuners by me. I upgraded from MACS with a crushed ypipe, to QTP's with a 3" offroad ypipe through an SLP powerflo setup. I went from a Texas Speed lid and stock maf to a Fast Toys 90mm and an 85mm maf. I went with bigger injectors, and also put on a set of truck coils, for whatever they are worth.
As for the drivetrain, I had 3.42s then, now I have 3.73s in a 10-bolt of course, but I did swap my flywheel from the Mcleod which weighed 29lbs down to a Fidanza which weighs 12.6lbs. Back then I had chrome 17x9 ZR1's, and now I have 19x9.5 Ruff 278s which I think weigh a little less.
I went to Injection Connection, which is owned by Dale Cherry. So my guesstimates for today was 440/415. I was off, BIG time.
Right off the street I made 453/440 with shutting down at 6000 and no fans on. I had 2.5 degrees of knock due to IAT's being well over 100 degrees from no cooling fans. Let the car cool for 5 minutes while setting up a fan, and this time we pulled to 6800 because I wanted to see if I had any valve spring float up top. It was rock solid, and made 461/454 with peak torque at 4600 and peak HP at 5750. Needless to say, I was shitting myself.
Final pull, we let it cool 10 minutes, and it pulled 468/460. Again, at low rpms.
Needless to say, someone is getting a kickass setup when I pull these heads/cam.
Here's the three overlayed:
And here is a screen shot showing the weather station and SAE correction selection.
I finally decided to go with a set of Cary's new Performance Induction heads, and a custom Virginia Speed cam. So I wanted a baseling before swapping and it's a good way to sell the current setup. Over the past 8 years, I've kept the same heads and cam, but swapped from an LS6 intake to a Vengeance ported 90/90 combo. I went from a box tune with LS1Edit to a custom tune with Hptuners by me. I upgraded from MACS with a crushed ypipe, to QTP's with a 3" offroad ypipe through an SLP powerflo setup. I went from a Texas Speed lid and stock maf to a Fast Toys 90mm and an 85mm maf. I went with bigger injectors, and also put on a set of truck coils, for whatever they are worth.
As for the drivetrain, I had 3.42s then, now I have 3.73s in a 10-bolt of course, but I did swap my flywheel from the Mcleod which weighed 29lbs down to a Fidanza which weighs 12.6lbs. Back then I had chrome 17x9 ZR1's, and now I have 19x9.5 Ruff 278s which I think weigh a little less.
I went to Injection Connection, which is owned by Dale Cherry. So my guesstimates for today was 440/415. I was off, BIG time.
Right off the street I made 453/440 with shutting down at 6000 and no fans on. I had 2.5 degrees of knock due to IAT's being well over 100 degrees from no cooling fans. Let the car cool for 5 minutes while setting up a fan, and this time we pulled to 6800 because I wanted to see if I had any valve spring float up top. It was rock solid, and made 461/454 with peak torque at 4600 and peak HP at 5750. Needless to say, I was shitting myself.
Final pull, we let it cool 10 minutes, and it pulled 468/460. Again, at low rpms.
Needless to say, someone is getting a kickass setup when I pull these heads/cam.
Here's the three overlayed:
And here is a screen shot showing the weather station and SAE correction selection.
06-18-2010, 03:20 PM
#2
And I think there is more in it as it sits. I checked my logs and I am running rich, 12.0:1 at low rpms, then I get richer to 11.7:1 by the end of the run. I'm also running 24 degrees of timing and saw no knock at all other than the first run when IAT's were over 100 degrees.
06-18-2010, 03:41 PM
#4
Let's be real here, LS1's don't make that kind of power @ that rpm. I know you know all about bmep and imep so you can draw your own conclusion. Run is a bit irrelevant and I do not see why you didn't dyno on the same dyno you baselined on. For reference we have two dynos in town. Dyno jet and a dynocom, here are results from each dyno, for reference PTR is dynocom and Brian's is a dynojet.
mine were like this (local guy on net sorry not me)
ptr- 433 - 409
brian's 396 - 366
seems pretty consistent with your numbers for loss...
we'll just say that brian's dyno is the orrect one and use it from now on...
Thanks again Brian for the free pulls!
Here are the results:
PTR: 364.2whp 364.4ftlbs
Shelley: 321.71whp 297ftlbs
Also check this http://www.my350z.com/forum/vq35hr/4...s-dynojet.html
Not hating or anything at all but you need to be realistic here as I know you're no dumby. It's a nice setup that someone will appreciate for sure, how hard did it fall off when you pulled it to 6800?
mine were like this (local guy on net sorry not me)
ptr- 433 - 409
brian's 396 - 366
seems pretty consistent with your numbers for loss...
we'll just say that brian's dyno is the orrect one and use it from now on...
Thanks again Brian for the free pulls!
Here are the results:
PTR: 364.2whp 364.4ftlbs
Shelley: 321.71whp 297ftlbs
Also check this http://www.my350z.com/forum/vq35hr/4...s-dynojet.html
Not hating or anything at all but you need to be realistic here as I know you're no dumby. It's a nice setup that someone will appreciate for sure, how hard did it fall off when you pulled it to 6800?
Last edited by Nitroused383; 06-18-2010 at 03:47 PM.
06-18-2010, 03:56 PM
#5
Reply #2.... about what I said it would be for when someone called BS. But I hear you, I was surprised as well. The reason I didn't dyno on the other dyno is because honestly, I haven't talked to the that shop in almost 7 years, and don't even know if they are still open.
They were conservative with the pulls, like I said, the first he lifted and stopped the run at 6000 to get a feel. Then we saw that we had already hit our peak at 5900, so there was no point to kill the motor. He spun it to 6500 and it dropped 5-10hp, but nothing crazy, but it's obvious that the cam on a 112 with 4 degrees of advance ground in is pulling back the curve and not letting it rev high, which was fine by me because I don't race the car.
EDIT: Here is the info on the dyno. They say they have backed up their dyno on multiple occasions with another dyno to be within 5-10hp. So beleive what you want. I know I'm happy and have always been with this setup.
http://www.injection-connection.com/DynoInfo.htm
They were conservative with the pulls, like I said, the first he lifted and stopped the run at 6000 to get a feel. Then we saw that we had already hit our peak at 5900, so there was no point to kill the motor. He spun it to 6500 and it dropped 5-10hp, but nothing crazy, but it's obvious that the cam on a 112 with 4 degrees of advance ground in is pulling back the curve and not letting it rev high, which was fine by me because I don't race the car.
EDIT: Here is the info on the dyno. They say they have backed up their dyno on multiple occasions with another dyno to be within 5-10hp. So beleive what you want. I know I'm happy and have always been with this setup.
http://www.injection-connection.com/DynoInfo.htm
06-18-2010, 04:11 PM
#6
My 224 cam is on a 107 ICL which gives it an earlier intake valve closing point. The intake manifold determines the majority of the curve of the power. A fast will help extend the rpm range over the LS6 but it's pretty typical to see most dynojet setups make peak torque 4800-5000 rpm and peak power from 6000-6300 if the cam is not too big trying to force the intake out of it's range. I'm not calling BS at all, I believe those results on that dyno,and I know your car is a great seutp. I know you understand quite a bit from being over on hardcorels1.com. In the end a dyno is just a tuning tool and as long as you use the same dyno for your future upgrades you will have a good baseline for a comparison. You probably have another 10-15 rwhp from leaning it out to 12.8-13 and having your timing up around 28 degrees.
06-18-2010, 05:33 PM
#7
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06-19-2010, 07:24 AM
#8
I know dyno's are just for tuning, and hence the reason why I wanted to dyno prior to getting my new setup. I'll have a good reference point for what the car will do later.
My car is a 2000, so it came with 853 heads, but once a head is ported, there's no difference really between a 241 and a 853 head.
No track numbers for me. The car is simply a show / street car. I used to race back in 2000-2003 but I got tired of braking **** constantly. Between clutches, transmissions etc, I didn't get any joy out of it.
My car is a 2000, so it came with 853 heads, but once a head is ported, there's no difference really between a 241 and a 853 head.
No track numbers for me. The car is simply a show / street car. I used to race back in 2000-2003 but I got tired of braking **** constantly. Between clutches, transmissions etc, I didn't get any joy out of it.
06-19-2010, 02:37 PM
#12
As for it peaking at ~5900, well, it is what it is. I think the springs are getting a little old, so it wouldn't surprise me if it was a little valve float above that. The springs are getting replaced when the heads are being installed, so that should clear that up. Even thought the peak is at 5900, it flatlined to 6400.
06-19-2010, 07:35 PM
#17
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It's will be good for a before and after.Your new heads and cam should make a great improvement over what you have now,the difference from before to after is the main thing.but as far as accurate numbers-i think that we can all agree that the dynocom's are pretty generous.I have a customer in Texas that his engine made more tq on the dynocom than it did on the engine dyno-it's not real hard to figure out.
06-19-2010, 08:01 PM
#18
Like I said, I figure on a dynojet it's probably 440/415, which is fun. I just wanted to make sure the car was healthy before doing the swap. To me, the airflow #s and fueling is a good measure of gains. More air in, more power out.
06-21-2010, 09:41 AM
#19
