Forged 347, Trex, and Heads = 402rwhp??????
10-23-2006, 07:07 PM
#1
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Forged 347, Trex, and Heads = 402rwhp?????? I dynoed 402 rwhp on a dynojet with a tune. I was at LEAST expecting 450rwhp. The only thing i think what could be holding me back is the rings have not sealed yet. My car smoke prefusely at idle randomly. Im using 10w40 Penzoil SAE oil. Ive changed my oil 4 times already and every time it is black as **** and has gas in it (which I was told was normal). I have 1400 miles on my motor. My car is throwing 2 codes p0125 which is a TPS sensor code and p0135 which is a o2 sensor heater malfunction on bank 1 sensor 1. What other possibilites could cause such a dramtic power loss. I made 400rwhp with just a MS3 before my current setup. All my supporting mods are listed in my sig. Some one please help.... 
10-23-2006, 07:57 PM
#4
If the rings haven't sat by now, they probably aren't going to.
http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm
http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm
10-23-2006, 08:50 PM
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Well would it be safe to put that "stop smoking" **** for oil in??? I just saw it at advance today. Man this sucks. So what happens if the rings are washed? Do i have to get the rings replaced or what? I didnt do anything wrong, I dont understand. Took it easy for the first 500 miles to break it in and got a tune at 700 miles.
10-23-2006, 09:00 PM
#7
Originally Posted by ws.6kid
Well would it be safe to put that "stop smoking" **** for oil in??? I just saw it at advance today. Man this sucks. So what happens if the rings are washed? Do i have to get the rings replaced or what? I didnt do anything wrong, I dont understand. Took it easy for the first 500 miles to break it in and got a tune at 700 miles.
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10-23-2006, 09:06 PM
#8
Originally Posted by ws.6kid
Well would it be safe to put that "stop smoking" **** for oil in??? I just saw it at advance today. Man this sucks. So what happens if the rings are washed? Do i have to get the rings replaced or what? I didnt do anything wrong, I dont understand. Took it easy for the first 500 miles to break it in and got a tune at 700 miles.
10-23-2006, 09:06 PM
#9
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Originally Posted by Slowhawk
The way we do it is start tuning the first minute a new motor like that is built/running.On a stock tune it is very easy to wash down the rings.
10-23-2006, 09:08 PM
#10
a quote from my link:
"The Problem With 'Easy Break In' ...
The honed crosshatch pattern in the cylinder bore acts like a file to allow the rings to wear. The rings quickly wear down the "peaks" of this roughness, regardless of how hard the engine is run.
There's a very small window of opportunity to get the rings to seal really well ... the first 20 miles !!
If the rings aren't forced against the walls soon enough, they'll use up the roughness before they fully seat. Once that happens there is no solution but to re hone the cylinders, install new rings and start over again."
"The Problem With 'Easy Break In' ...
The honed crosshatch pattern in the cylinder bore acts like a file to allow the rings to wear. The rings quickly wear down the "peaks" of this roughness, regardless of how hard the engine is run.
There's a very small window of opportunity to get the rings to seal really well ... the first 20 miles !!
If the rings aren't forced against the walls soon enough, they'll use up the roughness before they fully seat. Once that happens there is no solution but to re hone the cylinders, install new rings and start over again."
10-23-2006, 09:29 PM
#11
Ive been told by numerous reputable machinists that proper break in is to heat cycle the motor twice,then put it on the dyno.Seems all these motors that were broke in easy have problems.
10-23-2006, 09:33 PM
#12
about heat cycling:
"What about "heat cycling" the engine ??
There is no need to "heat cycle" a new engine. The term "heat cycle" comes from the idea that the new engine components are being "heat treated" as the engine is run. Heat treating the metal parts is a very different process, and it's already done at the factory before the engines are assembled. The temperatures required for heat treating are much higher than an engine will ever reach during operation.
The idea of breaking the engine in using "heat cycles" is a myth that came from the misunderstanding of the concept of "heat treating"."
About break-in on a dyno:
"On a Dyno:
Warm the engine up
completely !!
Then, using 4th gear:
Do Three 1/2 Throttle dyno runs from
40% - 60% of your engine's max rpm
Let it Cool Down For About 15 Minutes
Do Three 3/4 Throttle dyno runs from
40% - 80% of your engine's max rpm
Let it Cool Down For About 15 Minutes
Do Three Full Throttle dyno runs from
30% - 100% of your engine's max rpm
Let it Cool Down For About 15 Minutes
Go For It !! "
and also if the cool down refer to heat cycling:
"Many readers have e-mailed to ask about the cool down, and if it
means "heat cycling" the engine.
No, the above "cool down" instructions only apply if you are using a dyno machine to break in your engine. The reason for cool down on a dyno has nothing to do with
"Heat Cycles" !!!
Cool Down on a dyno is important since the cooling fans used at most dyno facilities are too small to equal the amount of air coming into the radiator at actual riding speeds. On a dyno, the water temperature will become high enough to cause it to boil out of the radiator after
about 4 dyno runs. This will happen to a brand new engine just as it will
happen to a very old engine. "
"What about "heat cycling" the engine ??
There is no need to "heat cycle" a new engine. The term "heat cycle" comes from the idea that the new engine components are being "heat treated" as the engine is run. Heat treating the metal parts is a very different process, and it's already done at the factory before the engines are assembled. The temperatures required for heat treating are much higher than an engine will ever reach during operation.
The idea of breaking the engine in using "heat cycles" is a myth that came from the misunderstanding of the concept of "heat treating"."
About break-in on a dyno:
"On a Dyno:
Warm the engine up
completely !!
Then, using 4th gear:
Do Three 1/2 Throttle dyno runs from
40% - 60% of your engine's max rpm
Let it Cool Down For About 15 Minutes
Do Three 3/4 Throttle dyno runs from
40% - 80% of your engine's max rpm
Let it Cool Down For About 15 Minutes
Do Three Full Throttle dyno runs from
30% - 100% of your engine's max rpm
Let it Cool Down For About 15 Minutes
Go For It !! "
and also if the cool down refer to heat cycling:
"Many readers have e-mailed to ask about the cool down, and if it
means "heat cycling" the engine.
No, the above "cool down" instructions only apply if you are using a dyno machine to break in your engine. The reason for cool down on a dyno has nothing to do with
"Heat Cycles" !!!
Cool Down on a dyno is important since the cooling fans used at most dyno facilities are too small to equal the amount of air coming into the radiator at actual riding speeds. On a dyno, the water temperature will become high enough to cause it to boil out of the radiator after
about 4 dyno runs. This will happen to a brand new engine just as it will
happen to a very old engine. "
10-23-2006, 10:54 PM
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Originally Posted by SSilverSSurfer
how do you figure? erik koenig is one of the best in the biz
http://www.hardcore50.com/Articles/E...ilding_101.htm
Last edited by WizeAss; 10-23-2006 at 11:02 PM.
10-24-2006, 08:52 AM
#17
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This does not make any sense, I have done a TON of research before starting my motor up and 50% of the people say to run the car easy for 500 miles, don't go past 4500 rpm, then after 500 miles let it rip,with oil changes periodically.
The other 50% say it is necessary to run the motor hard with in the first 20 mins as there is a small window of opportunity to get the rings to sit.
So if there is a chance my rings could seal which should I do to by all means to make this happen? Would it be a good idea to try lucas oil stabilizer or some other kind of "stop smoke" oil additive, which cause bad rings to supposedly seal????
The other 50% say it is necessary to run the motor hard with in the first 20 mins as there is a small window of opportunity to get the rings to sit.
So if there is a chance my rings could seal which should I do to by all means to make this happen? Would it be a good idea to try lucas oil stabilizer or some other kind of "stop smoke" oil additive, which cause bad rings to supposedly seal????
10-24-2006, 09:12 AM
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Originally Posted by ws.6kid
This does not make any sense, I have done a TON of research before starting my motor up and 50% of the people say to run the car easy for 500 miles, don't go past 4500 rpm, then after 500 miles let it rip,with oil changes periodically.
The other 50% say it is necessary to run the motor hard with in the first 20 mins as there is a small window of opportunity to get the rings to sit.
So if there is a chance my rings could seal which should I do to by all means to make this happen? Would it be a good idea to try lucas oil stabilizer or some other kind of "stop smoke" oil additive, which cause bad rings to supposedly seal????
The other 50% say it is necessary to run the motor hard with in the first 20 mins as there is a small window of opportunity to get the rings to sit.
So if there is a chance my rings could seal which should I do to by all means to make this happen? Would it be a good idea to try lucas oil stabilizer or some other kind of "stop smoke" oil additive, which cause bad rings to supposedly seal????
10-24-2006, 09:14 AM
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Oh, and about the oil changes, I might be a little over cautious, but I change mine after the first week, and then again after 500 miles. You have to think about the junk that might be in the oil after it's built, even if it's just dirt. You don't want that in your newly built engine.
10-24-2006, 09:36 AM
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Well I want to CONFIRM my rings are not seated before I start tearing my motor apart after I just got it back up and running. Whats the best way to actually test and see if the rings are really whats causing my problem?