TEA L92 headed 416ci Z06 going to the dyno tuning tomorrow 10am
06-09-2007, 01:03 PM
#61
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Originally Posted by VINCE
Let's keep it simple and civil.. You cant just compare flow #'s... The ENTIRE package must work well together...
Very true! I get to drive my entire package and its fun
06-09-2007, 08:45 PM
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Originally Posted by VINCE
Let's keep it simple and civil.. You cant just compare flow #'s... The ENTIRE package must work well together...
06-09-2007, 09:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Forteen3GT
exactly....flow numbers are like dyno numbers..... braggin rights are in the track time slips.
I agree, but it is part of the puzzle!
06-11-2007, 10:24 AM
#65
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k guys.. this is what im getting at...
all im saying is that until some further R&D to figure out what kinda cams and tunes these heads like they are NOT the best option out there. with the flow numbers they produce, with a good matched cam and some research there should be nothing holding back from BIG numbers. but until some people have tried and trued the setups (like the good ole cathedral ports) then people are going to be pissing away their money.
i give it 6 months before a breakthrough comes out with a magic cam that makes outrageous power.. kinda like the Trex, and now the MS3&4 cams for cathedral heads. how long did it take to start making outrageous power on the cathedrals?? lol we are just barely making outlandish power after tons of R&D.
in a nutshell... it has not been long enough for the vendors/R&D big wallet kinda guys to go through and find the magical setup to make wicked power on these heads. Until they do then budget builders like myself shouldnt really be throwing money away to try and R&D things ourselves when our budgets are nowhere near a vendors.
ill be holding out and saving my money until i see these heads come near the 550 RWHP mark. until then ill stick with my tried and true HP/$ ratio patriots.
all im saying is that until some further R&D to figure out what kinda cams and tunes these heads like they are NOT the best option out there. with the flow numbers they produce, with a good matched cam and some research there should be nothing holding back from BIG numbers. but until some people have tried and trued the setups (like the good ole cathedral ports) then people are going to be pissing away their money.
i give it 6 months before a breakthrough comes out with a magic cam that makes outrageous power.. kinda like the Trex, and now the MS3&4 cams for cathedral heads. how long did it take to start making outrageous power on the cathedrals?? lol we are just barely making outlandish power after tons of R&D.
in a nutshell... it has not been long enough for the vendors/R&D big wallet kinda guys to go through and find the magical setup to make wicked power on these heads. Until they do then budget builders like myself shouldnt really be throwing money away to try and R&D things ourselves when our budgets are nowhere near a vendors.
ill be holding out and saving my money until i see these heads come near the 550 RWHP mark. until then ill stick with my tried and true HP/$ ratio patriots.
06-12-2007, 12:32 AM
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my results.......... stock virgin g.m. ports with REV valves.
https://ls1tech.com/forums/generation-iv-internal-engine/672462-408-l92-231-235-lsk-ctsv-back-dyno.html
https://ls1tech.com/forums/generation-iv-internal-engine/672462-408-l92-231-235-lsk-ctsv-back-dyno.html
06-12-2007, 01:05 AM
#68
You guy's and your flow #'s 
Higher flow never means more power,expecially on the LS1 motor since nobody Cams or revs them high enough to use it
We've dyno's a few of these new head setup's and they didn't push more than the old head setup's.Seams like they would work goos in a FI app. but the decks are too thin to support high boost.
Higher flow never means more power,expecially on the LS1 motor since nobody Cams or revs them high enough to use it
We've dyno's a few of these new head setup's and they didn't push more than the old head setup's.Seams like they would work goos in a FI app. but the decks are too thin to support high boost.
06-12-2007, 02:26 AM
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06-12-2007, 08:40 AM
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Originally Posted by cybernco
Check out the results on this thread...
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=672462
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=672462
that thread seems like par for the coarse... i still expect to see some 500+ rwhp numbers out of those heads otherwise, whats the point?
not to mention the thin deck on them..... the flow numbers and head design would be great for a FI head but then the deck is too thin and can flex too much and wont hold boost....
those are the reasons im not sold on these heads. Im not a hater by any means but when i can put down over 500 RWHP on a vette w/ heavy drivetrain, patriot heads, 1 3/4 TPIS garbage headers, no UD pully, and complete budget built 408 i dont understand why these heads cant do the same
06-12-2007, 08:52 AM
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Originally Posted by LostCauseZ06
those are the reasons im not sold on these heads. Im not a hater by any means but when i can put down over 500 RWHP on a vette w/ heavy drivetrain, patriot heads, 1 3/4 TPIS garbage headers, no UD pully, and complete budget built 408 i dont understand why these heads cant do the same
A couple of 402's have made 500 with these heads. Yea, you could make 550 with some top of the line ported or aftermarket heads, but they will cost you more (at least another $1000 or more if you get a FAST). They are a cheaper alternative to what is out there. That is the reason to use them.
-Geoff
06-12-2007, 09:10 AM
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Originally Posted by LostCauseZ06
that thread seems like par for the coarse... i still expect to see some 500+ rwhp numbers out of those heads otherwise, whats the point?
not to mention the thin deck on them..... the flow numbers and head design would be great for a FI head but then the deck is too thin and can flex too much and wont hold boost....
those are the reasons im not sold on these heads. Im not a hater by any means but when i can put down over 500 RWHP on a vette w/ heavy drivetrain, patriot heads, 1 3/4 TPIS garbage headers, no UD pully, and complete budget built 408 i dont understand why these heads cant do the same
not to mention the thin deck on them..... the flow numbers and head design would be great for a FI head but then the deck is too thin and can flex too much and wont hold boost....
those are the reasons im not sold on these heads. Im not a hater by any means but when i can put down over 500 RWHP on a vette w/ heavy drivetrain, patriot heads, 1 3/4 TPIS garbage headers, no UD pully, and complete budget built 408 i dont understand why these heads cant do the same
A vette with a heavy drivetrain, what do you think my V has, light components??
The point is, I'm making 500 at the wheel, with a baby cam, 231/235 cam with stock heads and intake. I have $1,200 in my topend. Do the math, $1,200 vs. $3,250. I'll give up 10-20 rwhp to save $2,000.
It's a budget topend package that makes good power, nothing more, nothing less.
06-12-2007, 09:28 AM
#73
I'm at 500RWHP with a small XE-R 234-240 112 cam with cats, heavy wheels and 3.90's Put on 3.42's, take off the cats and put on lighter wheels (CCW's in the mail) and my car would probably be 525-530. It truly drives like stock. I think it's going to take another combination with more $$ and more cam to make more and will not drive as well.
The setup meets my goal and purposes.
The setup meets my goal and purposes.
06-12-2007, 11:15 AM
#74
Originally Posted by LostCauseZ06
that thread seems like par for the coarse... i still expect to see some 500+ rwhp numbers out of those heads otherwise, whats the point?
not to mention the thin deck on them..... the flow numbers and head design would be great for a FI head but then the deck is too thin and can flex too much and wont hold boost....
those are the reasons im not sold on these heads. Im not a hater by any means but when i can put down over 500 RWHP on a vette w/ heavy drivetrain, patriot heads, 1 3/4 TPIS garbage headers, no UD pully, and complete budget built 408 i dont understand why these heads cant do the same
not to mention the thin deck on them..... the flow numbers and head design would be great for a FI head but then the deck is too thin and can flex too much and wont hold boost....
those are the reasons im not sold on these heads. Im not a hater by any means but when i can put down over 500 RWHP on a vette w/ heavy drivetrain, patriot heads, 1 3/4 TPIS garbage headers, no UD pully, and complete budget built 408 i dont understand why these heads cant do the same
The intake alone, capable of supporting over 500 rwhp, and a fast is how much? We use them all the time (fast intakes), but damn, talk about an over priced, over rated piece!!
06-12-2007, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by edcmat-l1
You make it sound like they are complete duds. When, in the grand scheme of things, they are the best bang for the buck.
The intake alone, capable of supporting over 500 rwhp, and a fast is how much? We use them all the time (fast intakes), but damn, talk about an over priced, over rated piece!!
The intake alone, capable of supporting over 500 rwhp, and a fast is how much? We use them all the time (fast intakes), but damn, talk about an over priced, over rated piece!!
best bang for the buck for a car thats going to be straight NA?? yeah, i could see that. but the thin deck is not good for nitrous hits or boost. thus negating any of the benefits the heads represent in my book.
also the best bang for the buck as far as intake manifolds go is an LS6... they are free for most people (came stock). i paid 750 for a FAST intake and 100 bux for a LS2 TB, ported them myself, and picked up 40 RWHP (also added lighter wheels and fixed a bad exhaust valve)
06-12-2007, 06:44 PM
#77
Originally Posted by LostCauseZ06
but the thin deck is not good for nitrous hits or boost. thus negating any of the benefits the heads represent in my book.
In the few MONTHS that these heads have been experimented with, everyone who has spent any time with them, have all had positive things to say about them.
06-12-2007, 08:19 PM
#78
Originally Posted by Slowhawk
You guy's and your flow #'s
Higher flow never means more power,expecially on the LS1 motor since nobody Cams or revs them high enough to use it
We've dyno's a few of these new head setup's and they didn't push more than the old head setup's.Seams like they would work goos in a FI app. but the decks are too thin to support high boost.
Higher flow never means more power,expecially on the LS1 motor since nobody Cams or revs them high enough to use it
We've dyno's a few of these new head setup's and they didn't push more than the old head setup's.Seams like they would work goos in a FI app. but the decks are too thin to support high boost.
It is all about velocity around the circumference of the valve, look at the new TFS 235 heads we have been working with, almost 300 cfm at .400 with a smallish 2.08 intake valve, compared to the same type of flow as a ported L92 or factory LS7 both of which have MUCH bigger valves.
We have customers that have made 550 RWHP with ported L92's, they are a fine head, they are not the end all, nor will they ever be.
