AES 390ci - Now with Callies Dragonslayer crankshaft
12-03-2010, 07:28 AM
#21
7k for a built LSX short block, sounds great to me. Makes me want to sell my engine right now, or put an extra hole in it, so I'll have to buy one.
What's the usual shipping on the LSX?
What's the usual shipping on the LSX?
12-04-2010, 12:53 PM
#23
What kind of blueprinting or honing goes into these blocks?
And are ARP studs included or extra?
And how much extra to pin the mains and do 1/2" head studs? Anything else you would recommend for 1500hp LSX block 6 bolt setup?
And are ARP studs included or extra?
And how much extra to pin the mains and do 1/2" head studs? Anything else you would recommend for 1500hp LSX block 6 bolt setup?
12-04-2010, 09:27 PM
#26
Blueprint means this to us, in terms of the cylinder block centerlines for the crankshaft, camshaft and cylinder bores. By stating blueprint we machine all centerlines, journal and bore sizes to our blueprint. We use 2.7520" for our LS main journal for example.
You could take our centerlines and journal sizes and plot them creating a 3D picture of the block (ie blueprint)
On occasion we may include enlarging lifter bore size to blueprint.
Cylinder block is line honed, deck surfaces cut with BHJ 'block-tru' deck fixture, cylinders are honed with torque plate in our Sunnen CV-616.
Camshaft centerline is indexed from the main journal center, specially on early LSX block, camshaft centerline was like a road map, all over the place. We hone the cam bore tunnel, most the newer blocks just need a dusting to ensure its straight.
Each crankshaft is indexed to ensure correct stroke, roundness and taper of each journal. Crankshaft is balanced on our CWT balancer and polished once checked. We may order a crankshaft balanced to 17XX grams, those we have seen much as 20 grams heavier then stated!
Connecting rods and pistons are checked on our Sunnen rod hone, here we check for rod housing bore roundness, which we've seen new rods out of round, and pin fit the small end of the rod. Pin fit is under estimated in engine building. Typically will find factory pin fit to be at minimum spec .0005", we like to have .001" any less and we find wrist pins prematurely fail.
Rings are gapped before assembly according to application.
Then most important, everything is jet washed or solvent tanked and dried with compressed air before assembly.
ARP main studs are included with either the $4350 6.0 or $6995 LSX block package price
1/2" head studs, $550 machine block, either $400 or $600 depending on which grade head studs
LSX block has doweled main caps, didn't see them move till 1900hp, I don't think you would need it but 11mm main studs would be a good upgrade.
You could take our centerlines and journal sizes and plot them creating a 3D picture of the block (ie blueprint)
On occasion we may include enlarging lifter bore size to blueprint.
Cylinder block is line honed, deck surfaces cut with BHJ 'block-tru' deck fixture, cylinders are honed with torque plate in our Sunnen CV-616.
Camshaft centerline is indexed from the main journal center, specially on early LSX block, camshaft centerline was like a road map, all over the place. We hone the cam bore tunnel, most the newer blocks just need a dusting to ensure its straight.
Each crankshaft is indexed to ensure correct stroke, roundness and taper of each journal. Crankshaft is balanced on our CWT balancer and polished once checked. We may order a crankshaft balanced to 17XX grams, those we have seen much as 20 grams heavier then stated!
Connecting rods and pistons are checked on our Sunnen rod hone, here we check for rod housing bore roundness, which we've seen new rods out of round, and pin fit the small end of the rod. Pin fit is under estimated in engine building. Typically will find factory pin fit to be at minimum spec .0005", we like to have .001" any less and we find wrist pins prematurely fail.
Rings are gapped before assembly according to application.
Then most important, everything is jet washed or solvent tanked and dried with compressed air before assembly.
1/2" head studs, $550 machine block, either $400 or $600 depending on which grade head studs
LSX block has doweled main caps, didn't see them move till 1900hp, I don't think you would need it but 11mm main studs would be a good upgrade.
Last edited by AES Racing; 12-05-2010 at 02:57 AM.
12-04-2010, 11:57 PM
#27
sounds like a stout motor even without the lsx block. I know the dragonslayer crankshaft is a little over ~$1,000. I just don't know if it would be necessary in your average persons FI car on here especially when guys are making easy 1,000 plus on stock cranks and making tons of passes on them....so what i'm getting at do you have any other options as far as crankshafts?
Last edited by AutomagicLS1; 12-05-2010 at 12:03 AM.
12-05-2010, 02:52 AM
#28
The thought process behind this engine was to have the perfect cost effective strong shortblock to be coupled with D1SC, 76/88mm turbocharger etc.
Original 390 shortblock package starts at $3390, with Compstar H beam rods, ARP main studs, balanced and assembled 6.0 block $3495.
12-05-2010, 10:05 AM
#30
We certainly do, in our original '390ci' engine we use a Compstar 3.825" crankshaft, its a 5140 Forged steel, stronger then factory crankshaft, heat treated/nitrided and have radius on the rod journals to increase strength, just like the high end cranks do. Has a full length snout keyway, good for mild blower application. I'm putting 390 in my own turbo GTO looking for 800rwhp through TH400.
The thought process behind this engine was to have the perfect cost effective strong shortblock to be coupled with D1SC, 76/88mm turbocharger etc.
Original 390 shortblock package starts at $3390, with Compstar H beam rods, ARP main studs, balanced and assembled 6.0 block $3495.
The thought process behind this engine was to have the perfect cost effective strong shortblock to be coupled with D1SC, 76/88mm turbocharger etc.
Original 390 shortblock package starts at $3390, with Compstar H beam rods, ARP main studs, balanced and assembled 6.0 block $3495.
12-06-2010, 01:09 PM
#32
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I'm confused
So let me see if I got all this straight
All assembled, blueprinted, w/CP Pistons & ARP main studs
Original 390ci = $3390
6.0 Block
Eagle Rods
Callies C-Series 5140 3.825" crank
Original 390ci = $3495
6.0 Block
Callies Compstar H-beam rods
Callies C-Series 5140 3.825" crank
New 390ci (technically 388ci) = $4350
6.0 Block
Callies Compstar H-beam rods
Callies Dragonslayer 3.800" crank
New 390ci (tech 388ci) = $5150
6.0 Block
Callies Ultra billet rods
Callies Dragonslayer 3.800" crank
New 390ci(tech 388ci) = $6995
LSX block
Callies Ultra billet rods
Callies Dragonslayer 3.800" crank
Just trying to get all the info in one spot.
So whats the difference between the Compstar 3.825" crank and the Dragonslayer 3.800" crank? other than the obvious size?
So let me see if I got all this straight
All assembled, blueprinted, w/CP Pistons & ARP main studs
Original 390ci = $3390
6.0 Block
Eagle Rods
Callies C-Series 5140 3.825" crank
Original 390ci = $3495
6.0 Block
Callies Compstar H-beam rods
Callies C-Series 5140 3.825" crank
New 390ci (technically 388ci) = $4350
6.0 Block
Callies Compstar H-beam rods
Callies Dragonslayer 3.800" crank
New 390ci (tech 388ci) = $5150
6.0 Block
Callies Ultra billet rods
Callies Dragonslayer 3.800" crank
New 390ci(tech 388ci) = $6995
LSX block
Callies Ultra billet rods
Callies Dragonslayer 3.800" crank
Just trying to get all the info in one spot.
So whats the difference between the Compstar 3.825" crank and the Dragonslayer 3.800" crank? other than the obvious size?
Last edited by No Juice; 12-06-2010 at 03:46 PM.
12-06-2010, 03:23 PM
#35
That list looks correct
Compstar 3.825" crankshaft is 'c-series' 5140 forged steel, heat treated.
Dragonslayer is AISI-4340 USA steel forging, heat treated.
If you want the dragonslayer crankshaft to be 3.825" that can be done, but FWIW callies told me "we have new forgings do you want to do that crankshaft you talked about?" " do you want it 3.800 or 3.900" I said 3.800".
For now I think 3.800" would be the best option, 3.900 possible, but you have to start cutting the top land down.
1.200" compression height piston gives you the right ring lands. 3.800 has fraction more overlap.
All callies LS crankshaft, dragonslayer or c-series has .125" radius rod journal, radius adds strength.
Dragonslayer is AISI-4340 USA steel forging, heat treated.
If you want the dragonslayer crankshaft to be 3.825" that can be done, but FWIW callies told me "we have new forgings do you want to do that crankshaft you talked about?" " do you want it 3.800 or 3.900" I said 3.800".
For now I think 3.800" would be the best option, 3.900 possible, but you have to start cutting the top land down.
1.200" compression height piston gives you the right ring lands. 3.800 has fraction more overlap.
All callies LS crankshaft, dragonslayer or c-series has .125" radius rod journal, radius adds strength.
12-06-2010, 06:11 PM
#40
7/16" ARP 2000 main studs $350
Machine work for block $550
Can add dowels for $150 extra in addition to that work
ERL makes a main girlde
Both the above I'd say unnecessary under 1200hp,
we have a few customers running 8.5-8.8, 850rwhp, ARP main studs and no unusual wear.
Machine work for block $550
Can add dowels for $150 extra in addition to that work
ERL makes a main girlde
Both the above I'd say unnecessary under 1200hp,
we have a few customers running 8.5-8.8, 850rwhp, ARP main studs and no unusual wear.