Stock Long/Short block record contender
02-22-2012, 03:44 PM
#22
If you have an untouched bottom end its stock... If you took it apart it is no longer stock... Its just factory PARTS you are using. So technically you could send everything out to get cryo'd and have everything balanced perfect... and have a decent bottom end and still claim its stock.... BS. You take it apart and its no longer stock. -My opinion.
02-22-2012, 06:19 PM
#23
TECH Apprentice
If you have an untouched bottom end its stock... If you took it apart it is no longer stock... Its just factory PARTS you are using. So technically you could send everything out to get cryo'd and have everything balanced perfect... and have a decent bottom end and still claim its stock.... BS. You take it apart and its no longer stock. -My opinion.
This is getting so nit picky, the guy is building the car for the stock shortblock shootout. He has said he will use the stock rings and bearings, so really all he has done is disassemble and clean the engine, I do not see how this is being veiwed as "modification" by some. So what about a guy that buys a truck/SUV 5.3 or 6.0 and removes the oil pan and gets another to fit his chassis, no longer a "stock" engine since it was opened up and the crank saw some sunshine???
Yeah I guess he could go get all his parts cyro'd but he coulda never posted anything and did that anyhow, or he could just put a forged rotating kit in it and say its stock. Has anyone ever checked the fast running shortblock guys to make sure they are all stock, NO, we just go on the honor system. If the OP says hes putting it back together with 100% of the stock parts then that is good enough for me. And Id consider that engine stock.
I bought a 5.3 to build and it only has 24k miles on it, and I disassembled it to clean it up and check to make sure everything was ok, and I'm sure glad i did because it had 1 lifter with a broken axle and the original owner must not have believed in changing the oil cause it was gummed up and the ring grooves were so full of carbon and garbage they wouldnt even move, so it got cleaned, and 1 used lifter outta a 6.0 i have. Anyone see this as "cheating" or an "advantage". I dont because everyone has the same opportunity to do this to their engine
Op, build your engine and make some power, I consider it stock and bet most others would too.
02-22-2012, 07:14 PM
#24
This is getting so nit picky, the guy is building the car for the stock shortblock shootout. He has said he will use the stock rings and bearings, so really all he has done is disassemble and clean the engine, I do not see how this is being veiwed as "modification" by some. So what about a guy that buys a truck/SUV 5.3 or 6.0 and removes the oil pan and gets another to fit his chassis, no longer a "stock" engine since it was opened up and the crank saw some sunshine???
Yeah I guess he could go get all his parts cyro'd but he coulda never posted anything and did that anyhow, or he could just put a forged rotating kit in it and say its stock. Has anyone ever checked the fast running shortblock guys to make sure they are all stock, NO, we just go on the honor system. If the OP says hes putting it back together with 100% of the stock parts then that is good enough for me. And Id consider that engine stock.
I bought a 5.3 to build and it only has 24k miles on it, and I disassembled it to clean it up and check to make sure everything was ok, and I'm sure glad i did because it had 1 lifter with a broken axle and the original owner must not have believed in changing the oil cause it was gummed up and the ring grooves were so full of carbon and garbage they wouldnt even move, so it got cleaned, and 1 used lifter outta a 6.0 i have. Anyone see this as "cheating" or an "advantage". I dont because everyone has the same opportunity to do this to their engine
Op, build your engine and make some power, I consider it stock and bet most others would too.
Yeah I guess he could go get all his parts cyro'd but he coulda never posted anything and did that anyhow, or he could just put a forged rotating kit in it and say its stock. Has anyone ever checked the fast running shortblock guys to make sure they are all stock, NO, we just go on the honor system. If the OP says hes putting it back together with 100% of the stock parts then that is good enough for me. And Id consider that engine stock.
I bought a 5.3 to build and it only has 24k miles on it, and I disassembled it to clean it up and check to make sure everything was ok, and I'm sure glad i did because it had 1 lifter with a broken axle and the original owner must not have believed in changing the oil cause it was gummed up and the ring grooves were so full of carbon and garbage they wouldnt even move, so it got cleaned, and 1 used lifter outta a 6.0 i have. Anyone see this as "cheating" or an "advantage". I dont because everyone has the same opportunity to do this to their engine
Op, build your engine and make some power, I consider it stock and bet most others would too.
The spirit of this competition is the fact that you can go buy a $500-1000 junkyard motor then turn unthinkable times at the track, as skinnies has displayed.
Stock means as assembled by GM, not Joe Blow.
02-22-2012, 09:23 PM
#25
TECH Apprentice
When was the last time you saw anyone selling short blocks that came with an oil pan and lifters?
The spirit of this competition is the fact that you can go buy a $500-1000 junkyard motor then turn unthinkable times at the track, as skinnies has displayed.
Stock means as assembled by GM, not Joe Blow.
The spirit of this competition is the fact that you can go buy a $500-1000 junkyard motor then turn unthinkable times at the track, as skinnies has displayed.
Stock means as assembled by GM, not Joe Blow.
So let me get this straight, Changing to a different oil pan, pickup, and windage tray than what came on the engine originally to fit your chassis is ok. And R&R for the harmonic balancer, timing cover, oil pump, timing chain, and cam is OK and still considered GM built but remove anymore and your in the forbidden zone and its not "stock" anymore. CMON! If its got all the stock parts in it why are you guys giving him a hard time
02-22-2012, 09:40 PM
#27
TECH Apprentice
They cheated, it was a highly modified purpose built race engine, with its fancy, bench grinder ground piston rings, and rusty ball honed cyls. Def all high dollar stuff and not budget/stock oriented. Im sorry but this has got me steamed that a few dont consider builds like that stock and dont want them competing in the shootout. Wake up guys. Rant over
02-22-2012, 10:47 PM
#28
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They cheated, it was a highly modified purpose built race engine, with its fancy, bench grinder ground piston rings, and rusty ball honed cyls. Def all high dollar stuff and not budget/stock oriented. Im sorry but this has got me steamed that a few dont consider builds like that stock and dont want them competing in the shootout. Wake up guys. Rant over
let me step in here and set you straight.
if you modify the ring gaps on an engine, reinstall them, and run the motor. it is a shortblock with stock parts, not a stock shortblock. it has been modified.
if you pull the bearings out and replace one that looks questionable it is a stock.......prepped......shortblock. but not a stock shortblock. period.
if you put rod bolts in. thats obvious.
if you changed the rings. sorry.
ball hone? however archaic it may be. that is MACHINE WORK.
if you disassemble it in any way, shape, or form it simply CANNOT be a stock shortblock by definition. because the accepted definition is a shorblock that is UNTOUCHED from the factory.
untouched. aka not ****** disassembled, fiddled with, adjusted, measured, or any other variant of MODIFIED.
just take it out of the donor vehicle, clean it without taking the damn thing apart, assemble the top end stuff and go after the record. its sooooooooo easy to understand.
edit. i guess if you take it all the way apart, and reassemble it using all the SAME parts. not all ''stock'' parts, then that would be a POSSIBLE exception. but you would have to have the exact same bearing tolerances down to .0000000000001 etc. but thats a slippery slope. it would just be a whole lot easier if you just did like the record holder did and not take the motor apart. but dont let my common sense get in the way of your attempt to bend the rules to suit yourself. cause we all know if your motor was a true stock shortblock you would be as up in arms as you are now.
its important to note that im not trying to be a ball buster to you. frankly, i have no earthly idea of who you are or anything. just an attempt to help you understand why you are wrong.
Last edited by dilsnick; 02-22-2012 at 10:55 PM.
02-23-2012, 01:14 AM
#31
I agree that adjusting the ring gaps makes the engine no longer stock, but if there is a bad bearing that needs to be replaced, and it is replaced, I'd consider that a stock shortblock still. I laugh at the people who say it no longer makes the engine stock.
02-23-2012, 05:59 AM
#32
We actually measured the ring gaps in one we took apart to clean up and the gaps had opened themselves up from the 100k+ miles. They were larger than stock specs on both top and bottom ring.
As for all the debate, I don't think cleaning and reassembling makes the block no longer stock. I think it is just smart to take apart a motor to check it out before slapping it in and putting 800 hp+ to it. Cleaning (for free in your garage) is still in the spirit of the race imho. It is not modifying the parts or making any unfair advantage. It is just making sure that all your hard work putting together a budget motor is not a waste. This is especially true for people (not race teams) that are actually ON a budget because they HAVE to in order to be able to afford a project!
As for all the debate, I don't think cleaning and reassembling makes the block no longer stock. I think it is just smart to take apart a motor to check it out before slapping it in and putting 800 hp+ to it. Cleaning (for free in your garage) is still in the spirit of the race imho. It is not modifying the parts or making any unfair advantage. It is just making sure that all your hard work putting together a budget motor is not a waste. This is especially true for people (not race teams) that are actually ON a budget because they HAVE to in order to be able to afford a project!
02-23-2012, 01:29 PM
#34
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ps. it is an honor to get an introduction from the man who cannot understand words of the english language and interpet them.
02-23-2012, 01:31 PM
#35
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funny you should mention that. i happen to have held the record for the quickest and fastest stock shortblock hayabusa for a period of time. but hey you probably run high 8's so youre a stud in your sport and im a nobody.
ps. it is an honor to get an introduction from the man who cannot understand words of the english language and interpet them.
ps. it is an honor to get an introduction from the man who cannot understand words of the english language and interpet them.
Carry on. Nice build OP
02-23-2012, 02:44 PM
#36
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