Fender exit exhaust for street car. Fumes?
02-24-2020, 08:55 PM
#61
Anyone who says dumps aren’t loud is not telling the full truth. Sound and loudness is subjective and thus wats loud to one person might not be to another. I can tell you that with even a turbo as a built in muffler they are not quiet and I’ve had really loud cars in the past. A turbo dump is quieter than an NA dump but for the most part they can and will be normally too loud for most of the population. Fender dumps are less loud bc they project the sound outward away from the vehicle which makes the owner think the fender dump is more quiet than it really is but the person observing from the side is not going to feel the same way. Also consider the fumes pushing toward the vehicle on the pass side. Fender dump loudness will also reveal itself when driving past a concrete divider or wall on the shoulder or in an overpass or bridge. Also the human ear will adjust to the loudness so it becomes less loud quickly after start.
moat people who post videos don’t post the difference in sound level with a cutout vs a full exhaust and the sound reduction is drastic, also audio on phones etc aren’t capable of picking up the loudness or general tone of loud things in there entirety.
I did a test on my car with the cutout opened and closed as I tested different mufflers on my firebird looking for a good median of loudness and tone through a full exhaust. I tested like 5 mufflers before deciding on a Borla pro XS 14” case single 3” muffler. The Borla quieted things down a lot being only a offset 3” muffler and 14” case but it’s a straight through SS design so I actually picked up alittle power over a stock style (3” inlet and dual 2.5”’outlet) high flow dynomax ultraflow. My guess is due to the single path of less restriction compared to the dynomax with 2.5 exits on opposite sides.
here you can hear the difference at the same time between the 2 with the cutout open and closed. Again my phone doesn’t capture the loudness of the cutout at all. I actually prefer to drive through the full exhaust 80% of the time and only open the cutout when I really want turbo whistle and a noticeable bump in power to get rowdy.
https://youtu.be/FKtiIQf8b5k
moat people who post videos don’t post the difference in sound level with a cutout vs a full exhaust and the sound reduction is drastic, also audio on phones etc aren’t capable of picking up the loudness or general tone of loud things in there entirety.
I did a test on my car with the cutout opened and closed as I tested different mufflers on my firebird looking for a good median of loudness and tone through a full exhaust. I tested like 5 mufflers before deciding on a Borla pro XS 14” case single 3” muffler. The Borla quieted things down a lot being only a offset 3” muffler and 14” case but it’s a straight through SS design so I actually picked up alittle power over a stock style (3” inlet and dual 2.5”’outlet) high flow dynomax ultraflow. My guess is due to the single path of less restriction compared to the dynomax with 2.5 exits on opposite sides.
here you can hear the difference at the same time between the 2 with the cutout open and closed. Again my phone doesn’t capture the loudness of the cutout at all. I actually prefer to drive through the full exhaust 80% of the time and only open the cutout when I really want turbo whistle and a noticeable bump in power to get rowdy.
https://youtu.be/FKtiIQf8b5k
My cammed 4.8 with a full exhaust is 10x as loud as my turbo car with a 4ft open downpipe....
And the fumes are a real thing on petrol. It’s pretty gnarly. Everything is a give/take tho
02-25-2020, 09:20 AM
#62
What exactly is E85 rough on? Pretty much all modern cars are perfectly fine with it and have been for last 2 decades. Shelf life isn't bad either, I've let E85 sit for months and its perfectly fine. I do think people worry too much about content but that's another story.
02-25-2020, 11:25 AM
#63
Launching!
[QUOTE=SLOW SEDAN;20214775]Cops can be as cool as anyone, but the ones that would rather target modified cars instead of actually do real work bug me. Our local guys are as cool as anyone with modified cars but a county over you would think you murdered someone for having a loud exhaust and drag tires, meanwhile they have numerous crime and drug problems they choose to look past. A few cops used to sit around and watch the street racing, for the most part they knew that crowd was way cleaner and down to earth then the majority of the people they deal with in the evening hours.
I totally get it.... I don’t want to beat a dead horse or keep going on about cop **** on a car forum. Just bugs me when people are able to just say “**** the police” because they had a bad experience with an officer or even the simple fact that they are a cop. Guaranteed I could sit and drink beer and talk cars with anyone here. Some guys focus on The vehicle code and it is what it is. If you have a fender exit and bias plys don’t get pissed if you get whacked lol
p.s. I won’t muddy the thread anymore by standing on my soap box talking cop ****... just had to get that off my chest.... 5inch fender exit FTW!!!!
I totally get it.... I don’t want to beat a dead horse or keep going on about cop **** on a car forum. Just bugs me when people are able to just say “**** the police” because they had a bad experience with an officer or even the simple fact that they are a cop. Guaranteed I could sit and drink beer and talk cars with anyone here. Some guys focus on The vehicle code and it is what it is. If you have a fender exit and bias plys don’t get pissed if you get whacked lol
p.s. I won’t muddy the thread anymore by standing on my soap box talking cop ****... just had to get that off my chest.... 5inch fender exit FTW!!!!
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truckdoug (02-25-2020)
02-25-2020, 11:37 AM
#64
I totally get it.... I don’t want to beat a dead horse or keep going on about cop **** on a car forum. Just bugs me when people are able to just say “**** the police” because they had a bad experience with an officer or even the simple fact that they are a cop. Guaranteed I could sit and drink beer and talk cars with anyone here. Some guys focus on The vehicle code and it is what it is. If you have a fender exit and bias plys don’t get pissed if you get whacked lol
02-25-2020, 11:57 AM
#65
Launching!
I agree no need for that at all, go blue. If officers want to enforce vehicle code I totally get that and will happily take my infraction like a man, I just desire to be treated as an equal man with only a vehicle infraction not as a murder suspect taken out of vehicle at gunpoint. I am beyond friendly with any interaction with LEO's but some guys really go above and beyond what's required. My tires are DOT approved, but it seems some officers get caught up on certain aspects of the code and would rather be informed of the total vehicle code in the courtroom. I'm certainly not going to argue with a traffic cop over the code, you hand that stuff to your legal counsel and let them sort it out, beauty of our justice system.
02-25-2020, 12:16 PM
#66
Due to funds and not having a ton of injector or pump this year, I’m Running 110. Kinda funny though cuz everyone thinks I’m nuts since e85 is the big thing these days..
02-26-2020, 03:19 PM
#67
Skip the legal considerations, we all play in this hobby with our big boy pants on. This front dumped exhaust is a safety issue, and not just yours. Got kids? Do you blow a variety of carcinogens in their faces? No. They you really can't ethically take them out in your no exhaust having toy. Also, look into progressive hearing loss. Yeah, kids don't need to hear to effectively communicate in life.
Eastern Ontario is virtually bone dry, despite this I still built my Monte to run on E85 (I pray to the corn Gods daily).
Eastern Ontario is virtually bone dry, despite this I still built my Monte to run on E85 (I pray to the corn Gods daily).
02-26-2020, 07:02 PM
#68
Skip the legal considerations, we all play in this hobby with our big boy pants on. This front dumped exhaust is a safety issue, and not just yours. Got kids? Do you blow a variety of carcinogens in their faces? No. They you really can't ethically take them out in your no exhaust having toy. Also, look into progressive hearing loss. Yeah, kids don't need to hear to effectively communicate in life.
Eastern Ontario is virtually bone dry, despite this I still built my Monte to run on E85 (I pray to the corn Gods daily).
Eastern Ontario is virtually bone dry, despite this I still built my Monte to run on E85 (I pray to the corn Gods daily).
lol i meant in the US but glad you are enjoying E85 in canadia.
02-26-2020, 07:08 PM
#69
Safety issue? With windows up how exactly is it any different? My kid has traveled with me a lot and even he said my turbo car is way quieter then when it was NA. Its not like long tubes, no cats, and no mufflers is any better just because its out the back. Certainly no where near as bad as parents I see smoking in the car with their kids.
lol i meant in the US but glad you are enjoying E85 in canadia.
lol i meant in the US but glad you are enjoying E85 in canadia.
02-26-2020, 08:38 PM
#70
Smoking with children in the car is illegal up here. Why? Because it is unethical. I am not even going to address how poorly thought out and misguided your position on exhaust exit position relative to window placement is. You'd have to be deranged to believe that exhaust exiting forward of the cabin is a healthy choice. It is the stuff you can't smell that does the most damage.
02-26-2020, 10:07 PM
#71
TECH Fanatic
Id love to do under front fender exhaust, maybe only for fun days, but if i could get rid of 50ish lbs of exhast off the car, and the fumes arent bad.......
doug, am i wrong, or did i get your n.w.a. reference.....
(prob just stirred the shitpot again)....
sorry guys
doug, am i wrong, or did i get your n.w.a. reference.....
(prob just stirred the shitpot again)....
sorry guys
02-26-2020, 11:56 PM
#72
Mehh have had a front exit exhaust for 10 years havent died yet, can’t be that bad. Certainly cant be worse then following a bunch of cat less cars around in circles on track with windows down all day and nobody died from that either. You can’t address it because you can’t prove how much actually makes it in the cabin and how diluted it is by the time it gets there. Many things in life will kill you, worrying about exhaust placement isn't one worth worrying about.
Not saying a fender dump isn't an option or that it should never be used. But there is nothing good about doing it to something that drives on the street. It is entirely a bad compromise to doing tedious fabrication.
Its like going to a shooting range all day and not washing your hands after because its not enough lead on your hands to kill you right then...
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SLOW SEDAN (02-27-2020)
02-27-2020, 06:49 AM
#74
Cars with tailpipes are not always free of exhaust smell, there is kind of a
back draft there, if you have a bad trunk lid seal, etc you prob have had experience
with it. Station wagons used to use that "wing" on the back to counter it. If you drive
with the rear window open it can suck it in.
Noise wise I run a 4" back to my bumper on my truck, have 2 straight thru mufflers, and its
still to loud (thought turbos were quite, lol) I would like to find a diff muffler, but with 4"
kind of hard. Thought of splitting into 2-3".
back draft there, if you have a bad trunk lid seal, etc you prob have had experience
with it. Station wagons used to use that "wing" on the back to counter it. If you drive
with the rear window open it can suck it in.
Noise wise I run a 4" back to my bumper on my truck, have 2 straight thru mufflers, and its
still to loud (thought turbos were quite, lol) I would like to find a diff muffler, but with 4"
kind of hard. Thought of splitting into 2-3".
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truckdoug (02-27-2020)
02-27-2020, 07:48 AM
#75
I'm a weldor and it's made me really sensitive to fumes of any sort. i have to stand away from people smokin ciggies, cant be inside a garage if a car is running etc.
bumper dumps work mostly because they exit into a high pressure zone air-wake at the nose of the car, which flows along side the car into a low pressure zone.
rear exits *can* get caught in a turbulence at the rear of the car and trapped. which is why you never wanna have the hatch open on a station wagon on the interstate. you'll be turning pink and feeling verrrrry sleeeepy pretty quick.
bumper dumps work mostly because they exit into a high pressure zone air-wake at the nose of the car, which flows along side the car into a low pressure zone.
rear exits *can* get caught in a turbulence at the rear of the car and trapped. which is why you never wanna have the hatch open on a station wagon on the interstate. you'll be turning pink and feeling verrrrry sleeeepy pretty quick.
02-27-2020, 09:19 AM
#76
I'm a weldor and it's made me really sensitive to fumes of any sort. i have to stand away from people smokin ciggies, cant be inside a garage if a car is running etc.
bumper dumps work mostly because they exit into a high pressure zone air-wake at the nose of the car, which flows along side the car into a low pressure zone.
rear exits *can* get caught in a turbulence at the rear of the car and trapped. which is why you never wanna have the hatch open on a station wagon on the interstate. you'll be turning pink and feeling verrrrry sleeeepy pretty quick.
bumper dumps work mostly because they exit into a high pressure zone air-wake at the nose of the car, which flows along side the car into a low pressure zone.
rear exits *can* get caught in a turbulence at the rear of the car and trapped. which is why you never wanna have the hatch open on a station wagon on the interstate. you'll be turning pink and feeling verrrrry sleeeepy pretty quick.
02-27-2020, 09:29 AM
#78
He can't because he doesn't have your car but battery operated carbon monoxide detectors exist for about $30 so you definitely could. You really have no clue what you're exposed to until you measure it. Legality of gas poisoning is a factor if density and length of exposure. You could have a lethal level at 18 hours of exposure and just a really toxic level of exposure at 2 hours. I would be willing to bet there would be issues if you spent copious amounts of time in the car. But that **** can make you feel sick and tired and stuff and you would never know it was from that. It just makes you feel shitty and tired and under the weather like you didn't sleep enough that night. People find out major health issues were caused by intermittent exposure all the time that go away almost instantly the moment the environmental factor was dealt with.
Not saying a fender dump isn't an option or that it should never be used. But there is nothing good about doing it to something that drives on the street. It is entirely a bad compromise to doing tedious fabrication.
Its like going to a shooting range all day and not washing your hands after because its not enough lead on your hands to kill you right then...
Not saying a fender dump isn't an option or that it should never be used. But there is nothing good about doing it to something that drives on the street. It is entirely a bad compromise to doing tedious fabrication.
Its like going to a shooting range all day and not washing your hands after because its not enough lead on your hands to kill you right then...
As far as shooting goes, lots of people have been in situations that have required lots of shooting with no immediate sinks and lived to tell about it. Also ripped open MRE's after shooting and ate with our hands... ohh the blasphemy
I swear if people worried about every little thing that could kill them they would never get out and live life. You would probably be the same guy that would yell at me for shooting without ear protection, yet I can still pass a hearing test. This thread reminds me of a quote from Hunter S. Thompson “Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming "Wow!"
02-27-2020, 10:01 AM
#79
Just for fun looked up what science and our gov had to say about E85 vs pump fuel:
Numerous studies have compared the emissions of E85 and gasoline. E85 decreases the emissions of CO2, as well as the emissions of many harmful toxics, such as benzene—a known carcinogen.Ethanol burns cleaner than gasoline and therefore is responsible for fewer toxic fumes, which is highly advantageous from an anti-pollution point of view. The fact that ethanol does not contribute significantly to greenhouse gasses, makes it a popular alternative among the environmentally consciousThe ethanol combustion byproducts are high temperature steam and CO2.
A comparison chart, while probably not ideal to huff either one, you will probably live longer huffing E85
Fuel type, Heating Factor, CO2 Factor per ton, CH4 factor per ton, N20 Factor per btu, CO2 Factor per btu, CH4-methane, CO2-carbon dioxide, Unit measurement
Motor Gasoline - 0.125, 70.22, 3.0, 0.60, 8.78, 0.38, 0.08 gallon
Ethanol - 0.084, 68.44, 1.1, 0.11, 5.75, 0.09, 0.01 gallon
Numerous studies have compared the emissions of E85 and gasoline. E85 decreases the emissions of CO2, as well as the emissions of many harmful toxics, such as benzene—a known carcinogen.Ethanol burns cleaner than gasoline and therefore is responsible for fewer toxic fumes, which is highly advantageous from an anti-pollution point of view. The fact that ethanol does not contribute significantly to greenhouse gasses, makes it a popular alternative among the environmentally consciousThe ethanol combustion byproducts are high temperature steam and CO2.
A comparison chart, while probably not ideal to huff either one, you will probably live longer huffing E85
Fuel type, Heating Factor, CO2 Factor per ton, CH4 factor per ton, N20 Factor per btu, CO2 Factor per btu, CH4-methane, CO2-carbon dioxide, Unit measurement
Motor Gasoline - 0.125, 70.22, 3.0, 0.60, 8.78, 0.38, 0.08 gallon
Ethanol - 0.084, 68.44, 1.1, 0.11, 5.75, 0.09, 0.01 gallon
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j88l98irocz (02-15-2022)
02-27-2020, 10:37 AM
#80
I have a few in my basement, maybe I should measure... but driving my car for hours on end doesn't make me feel nearly as bad as being in a smoky bar and I've lived through both.
As far as shooting goes, lots of people have been in situations that have required lots of shooting with no immediate sinks and lived to tell about it. Also ripped open MRE's after shooting and ate with our hands... ohh the blasphemy I swear if people worried about every little thing that could kill them they would never get out and live life. You would probably be the same guy that would yell at me for shooting without ear protection, yet I can still pass a hearing test.
This thread reminds me of a quote from Hunter S. Thompson “Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming "Wow!"
As far as shooting goes, lots of people have been in situations that have required lots of shooting with no immediate sinks and lived to tell about it. Also ripped open MRE's after shooting and ate with our hands... ohh the blasphemy
I swear if people worried about every little thing that could kill them they would never get out and live life. You would probably be the same guy that would yell at me for shooting without ear protection, yet I can still pass a hearing test.This thread reminds me of a quote from Hunter S. Thompson “Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming "Wow!"