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A stubby filter doesn't necessarily mean an undersized filter. What's more important than the length is the total surface area of the element. Given a 6" length, a filter that has a wide oval shape will have more surface area than the traditional round/tapered design. Deeper pleats add up to more surface area and an inverted top is icing on the cake.
Go to the AFE website and use their Build Your Filter tool and see what you can come up with for a 6" element length with an inverted top and the widest top diameter. With a TT, you only need a filter than can feed half the airflow the engine needs at full song.
So I have a 4" piece of mandrel tubing to match the 4" inlet on my turbo and it makes ~80 degree bend. I put the largest K&N filter I could fit on it...believe it's about 10" long. Even so, I am sure it's costing me some power but I'm not about to remove it, especially with the turbo in the location it is in which is in the right spot to suck up road debri/rocks.
I view air filters like I do Rotella 15w-40; do they cost you some power over no filter and 5w-20...well most likely yes...but are they worth the reduction? IMHO absolutely.
I say run the biggest inlet filtering system you can and don't lose any sleep over it
Is it better to run a 90 and get fresh air to the turbo or have no bends and get air from the engine bay?
And who do I need to contact at R2C to order a filter? Tried calling them and all I got was a list of names to be transfered to so I hung up lol.
Cool air is always worth power so I would do what it takes within reason to get it.
I was just talking to well known engine builder about IAT's and he said on his max effort builds ( Drag Car/Boat/Tractor pullers on methanol) that one degree of drop in temperature is good for 1hp , Keep in mind these are in the 2,000hp range so you're obviously not going to see the same results but it will make more power the cooler the intake charge is.
Can we please discuss the topic of this thread.. air filters (big or small) vs tube/bellmouth, vs no filter?
Stevieturbo or anyone else.... can you describe to some level of relative objectivity how much you 'd recommend against a 90* bend into the turbo inlet?
I'm having a bit of a conundrum, I didn't think a 90* elbow would be that much of a hindrance up until I scraped this thread for actually useful information. I'm running twin turbo's with 4" inlets on a 6L, and have about 6" of room from turbo inlet flange to rad support, and was planning on a 4" silicone bend to draw air from the fender thru the biggest filter I can jam in there.. maybe up to a 10" long one. My car is 99% street so losing a bit of power from undersized filter is just what it is, if I have to go with no elbow and a stubby filter.
I'm just having a hard time wrapping my head around "how bad" elbows feeding the turbos would be.
Thanks!
joe
Obviously size comes into it.
Say a 60mm turbo with a 60mm bend right in front of it....will pose a restriction.
A 60mm turbo with a 100mm bend....less of a restriction.
In a ideal world, clearly the turbo would want unhindered access to air for 360deg around the inlet....to a degree throwing a 90deg bend in front of it shuts that down quite a bit. How much depends on size, height etc of that bend.
But ultimately good filtration is better than none. Bigger is simply better ( assuming all units are of equal quality ) And as you say for the street....cleanliness and longevity can trump every last ounce of power.
And yes again, if you can direct cold air into the turbo at all times...that might be better than a slightly less restrictive setup that draws in hot air.
Thanks a bunch for the help guys. I've used AFE's builder to find a filter for my truck, so I was planning on using it again to see my round/conical/oval filter options for just slapping filters directly on the turbos.
It isn't so much the 90* as the shape of the 90*. If you blew out the curve and gave it plenty of space for air to make the turn, it wouldn't be too bad. Larger tubes will have lower moving air given identical flow rates, so as long as the tube is large enough to slow the air enough to get around the bend without too much friction/turbulence, you know, smooth clean bend plenty of space, like mine is, it will be fine. What you don't want is a sudden, tight turn, like an L shape coupler that you see sometimes. You can just tell by lookng at it that, that isn't an effective shape.
I’ve been looking at these as it seems it maybe my only option other than running a short filter off a s475.
see post 24. I ran a cobra elbow right on the front of my s480 to a big cone filter. It made little difference at 770 hp and even when turned up at the track it only made a couple hundreth difference on or off. But that is just my experience. As always test it and see what happens.
I’ve been looking at these as it seems it maybe my only option other than running a short filter off a s475.
Cobra design can have advantages.
ie...install a large bellmouth onto the turbo and do a cobra off it. That still gives the turbo a nice air inlet from all directions, even if ultimately the air is channelled from a single direction...but if done right with good pipe size it would be better than a simple 90 stuck onto the turbo.
Basically a budgetish single turbo 5.3 build, 11psi or so and 700hp, or just shy of it. Intended to last forever on 91 octane for a daily driver. They tested all of those filter designs below and basically negligible difference with all of them vs no filter.
Turbo was a BW, never said which model, 5" inlet so adapted to the 6" filters. 400 series though, and they used the Hooker single turbo kit, Dorman LS6 type intake.
Although would be nice to see them try some small filters just to see if or when they do start to create issues. It's a video, so not really screenshottable lol.
That's pretty interesting...guess there's a difference between turbo and blowers.
Yes, indeed there is. Wanna go fast?.... slap a turbo on the car, want average acceleration?.... put a blower on it . Nevermind me, I'm just being silly because it's track day! If I make more than one pass, I may make a pass without the filter just to see if I can tell a difference.
Yes, indeed there is. Wanna go fast?.... slap a turbo on the car, want average acceleration?.... put a blower on it . Nevermind me, I'm just being silly because it's track day! If I make more than one pass, I may make a pass without the filter just to see if I can tell a difference.
Youre allowed to comment when you finally launch that thing at the track
Im just messing around. I am curious about why turbos wouldn't see the increase but a blower would from a bigger filter.
To be honest, I really don't know. All I can come up with is, maybe the turbo spins at an rpm where it just doesn't matter anymore (within reason), and it's able to overcome the restriction. Whereas the blower doesnt spin fast enough? Again, I really don't know..... just speculation on my part.
04-10-2018, 07:27 AM
. Nevermind me, I'm just being silly because it's track day! If I make more than one pass, I may make a pass without the filter just to see if I can tell a difference. 