Dyno will get you close but be careful as a dyno tune is typically be to aggressive. I mean a 4-5 second pull will not replicate a 1/4 mile pass with rpm drop at wot and shift recovery .

I typically pull a degree or two of timing and make some logged runs after a dyno tune .

you have air to water and in my opinion that’s why it’s still alive . I have never seen any car at 16 psi on pump gas live at the track .at least not an ls turbo car .. . but I run air to air with 130 degree temps at the finish line.

not sure where the limit is but I’m going to tell you your very close . Braver man than me .

 

There is no real limit to pump gas if you drop compression accordingly. You can run 300*+ charge temps no problem at 7:1 with a timing table like his on pump gas. Problem is, no one does that anymore.

I think many don't understand its not the charge temps you need to worry about. It’s the peak cylinder pressure and CC temp. That’s why water/meth helps so much. In the volumes used on typical kits it does VERY little for charge cooling. But it pulls a lot of heat from the CC.

Basically acts like race gas and lowers the detonation threshold. So you can tune fore more power, but on its own it does almost nothing, or even hurts performance if too much is used.

 

Yes with meth you can go a long ways but I really hate to set up my car to live or die by whether my meth kit works or has good distribution.

I get it and guys do it.

im just saying at 12* timing and 16 psi boost without meth he is very close to the limit if not beyond.

every car is different and if he didn’t make a timing pointer with a dead stop and varied timing he might only have 8 degrees in it ??

 

Yikes, I'm really glad I asked, really thought I had more room than I did.
At this point I think I'll turn it down to 14 lbs. and leave it there for the summer, no sense in hurting it farting around on the street right before moving across country.
I can run the WMI kit through my Cortex EBC so if I can piece something together that way, I'd like to do that.
That way I can use the Cortex's safety features and ties AFR and boost cuts all into one.
@Forcefed86 you wouldn't happen to have a component list for piecing together a kit, would you?
I know so little about WMI kits I wouldn't really feel comfortable selecting everything without some guidance.
Jose at Alkycontrols recommended his truck kit which is $900 but comes with a controller which I don't need but doesn't have a component list unfortunately.
He recommended twin M15 nozzles iirc spraying 100% meth and that I could use that to get into the 20+psi range so I know I'll need those.
I doubt I have the injector to support a 50/50 pump/meth mix now that I think about it.
God I wish I had E85 around lol.

 

Surflo pump, nitrous Solenoid, adjustable boost switch, Nozzle size to taste, and Hobbs switch right at the Nozzle wired to LED in your face. Anytime I'm WOT and that little red LED is on I know my WMI is spraying and it's as cheap as it gets with quality.

 

I don't think I'll need the Hobbs since the Cortex will be controlling it based of boost and rpm.
Does everything need to be PTFE rated for use with methanol?

 

I don’t have one handy. But look it from a KISS point of view. It’s a pump, a tank, some hose and fittings, and a boost switch. You don’t need the switch if you control it with an ECU. So you are looking for a tank/pump/hose/fittings/nozzle.

Julio is right and great people. But you don’t “need” that IMO. What he is describing is a performance setup that you can lean on pretty hard. I ran similar on my Buick GN. 30gph 100% meth. on a baby 3.8 liter. I went from knock at 16lbs on pump gas @ 15*. To 25lbs and 25* of timing. It was a massive change. Distribution is better on that intake than the LS though. Id limit a basic on/off kit to around 10gph at 50/50. Or 7gph w straight washer fluid.

I like these tanks because the opening is huge. You can clean and easily pour the meth in without spilling. But they have almost doubled in price since I bought one. I’ve also used a 1 gallon gas tank. Or water meth reservoir. You can literally tap the windshield reservoir already on the car if you have one. Nice to have the low level light on those.

https://www.plastic-mart.com/product...ank-sp002-5-rt


Push lock fittings and nylon hose are cheap and 50/50 compatible. Can buy them anywhere. Amazon etc. Only issue with those is the o-rings swell with anything over 50/50 and leak. You don’t want 100% meth leaking in the engine bay. If you use 100% meth you should use AN fittings and meth approved lines. Treat it just like a fuel system. Canalso use barbed fittings, hose clamps and fuel line.

The pump is really up to you. Anything that spits out around 100psi is fine. That’s what the flow rating on the nozzle is calibrated to anyway. So a 10gph nozzle flows 10gph at 100psi. At 300psi is flows a lot more. You don’t need the fancy pumps. Esp for lowish volume. Any 1800 series shurflo 100psi has been bullet proof in my experience. Though I have had to RTV seal the pump heads on a couple.

Ebay also has many $10-20psi high pressure pumps that people have used in the past with success. Same deal here with 100% meth though. Lots of pumps won’t be compatible with 100%.

This is the shurflo I use a lot. Clip the wires that go into the cap/regulator and run them directly to power the motor. Then you get around 150psi.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/134660399517

Here's a $15 100psi rv pump. Would prob work ok as well.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/225274599446

Nozzles are also up to you. They are annoying priced. I liked Devils Own nozzles. But IDK if they are still in business. But any meth kit nozzle and holder would work. But they aren’t super cheap. Any mcmaster car misting nozzle that’s rated in GPH would work fine too. Stainless Steel 1/8th inch 90 pipe fittings work for holders on the Devils own nozzles.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/164855964792

The pump has a check valve in it. But you can also opt for a check valve at the nozzle or a solenoid.

 

up to you with the Cortex, just another layer but I'd still use the Hobbs switch switche visual indication. that "guarantees flow". Simply trying to turn on the pump and solenoid doesnt guarantee anything.

For the tank I use the stock windshield washer fluid tank.

 

Oh okay, I misunderstood what you were saying for the hobbs switch.
I would definitely want some visual confirmation that its working, my washer tank is long gone but a buddy of mine has a bunch of WMI parts for a kit he was building but never got around to it so I think I'll scoop it up and go from there.

 

@Forcefed86 can I come back to reading the plug and get a little more clarity on your comment if you don't mind?
So where does the timing mark appear to you?
Based on Steve Morris's video (If I'm interpreting it correctly) I thought the timing mark was just above the base of the electrode where the carbon is cleaned off, initially I thought it was on the horizontal part of the electrode about half between the tip and the bend.
Are you seeing something different?

 

Without a clean run on a new plug, you are guessing and open to interpretation. 5 people may see 5 different things. If you were to make a clean pass and shut it down the timing mark is unmistakable, in most cases. Esp. with pump gas or race gas. Alcohol plugs of any kind are harder to read.

This is a new plug with 2 runs on it at the track and no WM. ET and MPH were the same with the WM on VS off. The plug heat read about half way down the strap with 10gph of 50/50 @ 23ish lbs and 14ish*. (e85 car)

This about where SM and most others think “good” is. IMO this on the edge for a street car. Can certainly on the edge for a pump gas car. I’d add fuel, up the WM, or pull 2 degrees for a “Safe” tune. I’ve nipped a ringland or 3 on tune-ups showing that much heat…

What a motor will take timing wise varies a TON as well. So if SM has some nice large domed smoothed combustion chambers and great parts all around, they will likely take that tune up and more.

The other issue is the plug itself. If I were to put a #10 heat range plug in that tune with no other changes and make a pass… the heat mark on the strap would be completely different. So you really have to take all the plug reading and timing suggestions with a grain of salt. They are very combo specific.

 

So I'm looking at homes in the area of SC I'd like to live in and there are two E85 gas stations within 4 miles of where I'm looking......

 

Start saving for ridiculous fuel pumps and injectors and you’ll be set! Then hope you don’t get the dreaded E85 goo issues in that area.

 

I live 2 miles from pump E85, made my decision easy. With a 15 gallon cell I figure I have a 100 mile range city and somewhere between 135-150 highway.

 

We have just one E85 station. Still made my choice easy.

 

If they stop selling e85 locally I’d just buy a 55 gallon drum. No way could I go back to pump gas.

 

do you use this with 100% meth?

 

That was going to be my next question, I was looking at the pump that Alkycontrols sells as its not much more and it'll handle 100% methanol.

 

I have, though I have had them leak a bit from the head over time. I pop it off and seal with silicone before hand now. Yet to have one leak that I've done that on.

They are nylon and viton diaphragms. Which are listed as "ok" for methanol compatibility.

 

Okay so @Forcefed86 talked me into pulling a couple degrees of timing instead of lowering the boost level which he didn't have to try very hard since I really don't want to turn it down lol.
So, my next question is where would I pull 2 degrees timing on the timing table? (See below)
Thinking 5,500 rpm to redline but not sure how far to go on the cylinder airmass side.