badz2801

To all the members of this board.

I would like to tell all the members of this board about my experience with GWP (Golden West Performance). I understand that many of you are loyal to this company and I based my decision to purchase this system on that. In late November early December I ordered a Stage II supercharger system from GWP. I paid the total price of 6,500 + change and paid in full. The payments were charged in two installments on my credit card by GWP on different dates. Initially, Kenny (the builder/owner) told me there were delays due to the Christmas season with ATI. I was disappointed but being a twenty year old software programmer I understood based on my experiences in business. I took it in stride and was polite about the delay. I figured well he is supposed to be the best, I can wait.

After two months of delays and dozens of failed promises I started to get fed up. Kenny would often avoid my calls and always gave me a promise that fell thru. He refused to contact my mother consistently when asked, who is also involved in this process. Is this how normal business is conducted? I think not. I am a part time software designer/full time student and I complete business deals that cost in the thousands. I keep my clients informed and I am honest and upfront at all times. Quality, integrity and communication are key to successful business. Anyhow, Kenny consistently has reminded me about the rigors of small business and constructing a system like this. That creating a system from multiple manufacturers takes time. Ok, it takes time, fair enough. Not returning my phone calls, bad promises and loosing my parts (which I will get to next) are unacceptable. Does this remind you of anyone? Hennessy Motorsports?

It has been four months now and I still do not have a supercharger system or my PCM back. The PCM was shipped in December to Kenny after the order was made. I cannot recall how many times Kenny has told me the system would be on my door step and it is not here. Two weeks ago, Kenny used the excuse that snow had delayed my packages. Considering that I live in VA, that is believable. I then ask for tracking numbers to verify that the items have been in fact shipped. I waited for weeks, still no tracking numbers. I asked to speak to his contact regarding the numbers; he would not give me any information. No business man sends 6,500.00 worth of parts via FedEx without proof of shipment and insurance. He would not provide those records for me, just another promise that it would be there. In the end the boxes were shipped back to him due to the weather so he says (my opinion he never shipped them). I got the usual I have 25 similar customers and numerous cars running in the 9’s. Good for Kenny, unfortunately my system and PCM are not here and that is all I care about. Finally a fuel controller and fuel pump came in (to Kenny’s credit). The pump and controller are delayed parts that Kenny told me were being produced and would be shipped directly from the factory. Turns out it was shipped from his shop (no huge surprise). However, the actual system and my PCM are still absent when they were “at his shop several weeks ago”.

I called Kenny today and told him this was the final straw. I wanted my system, tracking numbers and PCM back. His reply was that the boxes had been lost, were found and reshipped to him due to weather again (yeah right). In exchange he offered to send a whole new system from ATI and reprogram a new factory GM computer for loosing mine. Sweet offer some would say. No way, sounds like he is just now shipping this. I told him this was unacceptable. I wanted my PCM back, not a new one. This is mainly due to principal and the fact that my PCM should not have been lost + delays + lies! Fortunately, I am a computer science major and I decided to record the serial number hard coded inside the PCM. Basically, I will know if I get mine back or not. In the end I told him to ship the new system + PCM to my door step by Saturday. I also wanted my old PCM back; correctly tuned (I would return the new one I give my word). Kenny is now unavailable and I still do not have my system. Additionally, Kenny has made numerous attempts to compensate me by getting a good deal on headers for me. Why would I ever order anything from this man again? In the construction business, back charges are applied to contractors who do not complete on time and deliver. Unfortunately this is not construction and Kenny is not under these terms in our contract.

I would like everyone to understand that I have physical proof of this and I am not trying to deface Kenny out of spite. I am not trying to start a flame war and I understand this is hearsay without proof on the board. This business deal has gone sour. I want a correctly produced system at my door for my car this Saturday as promised. I wanted to run some great times with the car and give Kenny’s system credit. I even held off from writing this letter. It has come to the point where I do not consider Kenny a good business man. If he does not come through this weekend, I will ask for my money back and purchase an ls1motorsports turbo kit. They can have credit for my fast times. If I do not get a correctly produced system or my money back I will take it to the next level. I have hired and consulted a lawyer concerning this matter and will pursue it across state line no matter the expense.

Post copied on Ls1tech.com camaroz28.com and ls1.com

Blown Hawk

Ouch, sorry to hear about all your troubles. Thanks for the heads up on GWP. Having been through the process you're going through, to some degree that is, I can sympathize. I ordered my ATI in a GP through Tbyrne. They have excellent customer support over there and were very upfront about the time frame everything would take. It did take a little over a month to get all the parts to me, but I knew that ahead of time and wasn't in a rush. Fortunately I have a daily driver, so my Hawk being down for a little while was no big deal.

I hope everything works out for you. Keep us updated on how this all goes down.

BH

<small>[ March 03, 2003, 02:37 PM: Message edited by: Blown Hawk ]</small>

Mike 01WS6

I've heard about this for quite some time about GWP. Thanks for another heads up.....I'll remember where not to do my business this spring. <img border="0" alt="[driving]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_driving3.gif" />

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

Sorry to hear that you car is not running.

IMO whether it's the stock pcm or a replacement that would not matter to me since it's most important to get the car running.

My advice is to send them a registered letter with some deadlines, since you have not received your parts for over 90 days as promised.

Black LS1 T/A

Man, that's messed up.

It took me a couple months to get mine, too. Though I've had to wait on things, GWP always came thru for me and has been helpful in explaining anything I needed to know... or pointing me in the right direction.

Kenny told me a couple weeks ago about a shipment that he sent out and the company couldn't deliver, so they returned it to his shop. It's odd that he told me this some time back and I never heard you tell your story, so I wouldn't dismiss his explanation out of hand. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

Situations like this are so subjective. But, you explained your position in a calm, intellegent and methodical way. I'm a programmer, too, ad we tend to approach issues and problems from a logical perspective. It doesn't seem you were just super-impatient and are exploding on the board. But, your described behavior is inexplicable to me (except the part about him not calling you. I learned long ago Kenny is too swamped to spend his day calling people, even though I can pin him down by callig him from time to time. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> )

I hope you guys can work the situation out.

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

If he could email you the tracking number from that time when he said it was not able to be delivered than I would believe him. If it was UPS it will be in their computer.

badz2801

To all the members thank you for your support.

Blown Hawk - Sorry to hear you had delays as well. As I stated before I really wanted to turn some heads with this system. I wanted to run the fastest time possible on an otherwise stock car to see the systems true protential. I was even going to call Kenny and ask if I could brag about it for him. That is neither here nor there at this point, but thanks for your help.

Mike 01WS6: Gald I could make you all aware, thanks for your support.

Pro Stock John: I agree I would really like to get the car up and running. But I have waited this long, I want it done right (even though a new PCM will work just as good). My dad always told me principal matters but at a cost. I guess I just expect a level of integrity that is in short order in todays world. Maybe if I stick to my values someone else will follow them as well.

Black LS1 T/A : It is good to finally meet you. I ordered from GWP because of you and your review of GWP. I figured if your car was running those times, so could mine. Congrats on your new 422 and system, hope you get the belt issues worked out.

I do not mind waiting for a good product, but when I suspect I am being brushed off or lied too I dont react well. I tried to keep my comments to a minimum, being 20 and a red head its not easy. I am glad my message came across the way it did, I tried my best to spread information without any kind of slander or childish antics. You are completely correct, everything is subjective and difficult to tell what is really going on. I wish to get this resolved quickly and without further dammage to our business relationship. I just hope it has not gone too far and that my system will be complete and correct when I get it.

I had no idea you programmed as well. Yes we do approach everything from a true false perspective <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> . You are also correct he is always busy and I have found the best time to contact him to be about 3:45PM EST. Like I said I hope we can work it out as well and good luck with the monster of a car you have.

P.S. When my bank account recovers I plan to do a 427 C5R block with a blower system on that. Ill let ya know if I ever get the $$$ to do it.

Sincerely
Badz2801

LASTLS1

iTrader: (7)

DON'T WORRY YOU HAVE IT EASY! CALL YOUR CREDIT CARD COMPANY, TELL THEM YOUR PROBLEM, THEY WILL INSTANTLY CREDIT YUOR ACCOUNT AND DEBIT HIS ACCOUNT. SHOULDN'T TAKE MORE THAN FIVE MINUTES. THEN LET HIM FIGURE IT OUT. DON'T WAIT, CALL RIGHT AWAY. THEN CALL SPEED INC.1-847-891-0767. AND YOU WILL BE TREATED RIGHT. GOOD LUCK.

Black LS1 T/A

Ah! I wish I were single and make the money I do!

Well... I didn't mean that quite the way it sounded. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Embarrassed]" src="gr_emb.gif" />

But, all the money that goes to my kids, and other bills, I find myself trying to find the most economical way to do things... hence the iron block. The C5R would definitely be my choice if I could afford it! Good luck!

I REALLY do hope you and Kenny have a meeting of the minds. Once you are up and running, his help and willingness to give you pointers is priceless. I agree with PSJ about the PCM thing... don't be too intransigent. But, some firm deadlines are a good idea.

Good luck, and I will be the first to <img border="0" alt="[worship]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_hail.gif" /> when you get that 427! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

BLOWNMERO

Sounds like my experience with GWP. I heard a bunch of empty promises myself. One time they told me they shipped it out and it got lost, then found in montana or somewhere and then sent back to them. The fun never seemed to end with them. Oh well, if I could do it again I would definatly buy a LS1 motorsports turbo kit.

BLMONGOOSE

Sorry to hear about your situation with GWP. I also had to wait a long time for my parts but my end result was great. I also had some lost boxes by Fed-ex. I did claim tracking number and even called fed-ex and it was proved. I even had an order make it to the shipping station some where in texas then all of a sudden the box was sent back to GWP? I cant explain why GWP has all the bad luck with shipping but I tracked all my packages and I couldnt put any blame on Kenny or GWP for the shipping problems.

Any ways Iam glad you have chosen to stick with your order you will be very impressed with the outcome. Make sure you get an experienced mechanic to install his system. His system does require an extensive amount of work and experience with cars. Ex... drilling the crank, welding, ect... Well my car was a vette so it could be different for the f-bodies.

I believe I waited alomst 4 months for my entire kit. But I also had ordered Heads and Cam from GWP. So I got started on my car as I was waiting for the blower.

After all is said and done Kenny knows how to treat his existing customers. I still call Kenny from time to time to talk about how to improve things on my car. He even saw a post I put up in this board about wanting to get more power and within a couple of hours he had alredy send me an e-mail with some recomendations.

His kit might take a little longer to recieve than other shops but it will arive. And it is definately worth the wait. Look at the boosted list and see how many cars he has put in the tens. He know how to build power. But I guess quallity just take time. For GWP it just might take a little more time? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

Good Luck, and I cant wait to see your track and dyno numbers. Iam also waiting for my bank account to recover so that I can go with a big block. Iam waiting to see what final number Blackls1t/a can get out of GWP's 422. Iam also torn between the 427 C5R block or GWP 422 Iron block. I have herd that the C5R block might not be able to support as much power as the iron block. But just how much more power? I just want something that safely support 700-800RWHP. I have herd that the iron block is the way to go, but I have also gotten recomendation to go with the c5r block and save the extra pounds.

But in the end I think it will come down to the the best bang for the buck!

Black LS1 T/A

From my understanding, the C5R block has enough material thicknesses to handle things... it's the LS1 Aluminum block that is purported to be weaker than the iron block.

badz2801

LASTLS1: I am going to see if kenny delivers. I have no desire to wait another few months to get this thing rolling. But yes I would go the credit card route before I would take legal action across state lines(cost $$).

BLOWNMERO: sorry to hear you went thru this as well. I guess I did not dig deep enough when I researched him, otherwise I would have gone a different way.

BLMONGOOSE: I know Kenny's system is supposed to be the best, but his customer relations suck (in my exp). I plan to install the system myself (half the fun). I was told by kenny that I would only need simple hand tools to install it on an F-body.

You are correct Kenny knows what he is doing and how to give tech advice, but that does me no good without a system. Personally, I think its just to bide time with the money issue (small shop no overhead).

Sincerely
Badz2801

badz2801

Update:

I have contacted a lawyer in Colorado concerning the matter. Under Colorado state law, 6,500.00 is not small claims. Hense it would be tried in circuit court. The addition of lost property (PCM) entitles me to damages. Furthermore Kenny told my mother that he would not refund the money until the boxes from Fedex were returned to him. I want the system, not my money back pref(and I know he does as well b/c he actually called my mom back when she made this known to him). Additionally he still appears to be avoiding my calls and has made himself unavailable.

Kenny if you read these boards I respectfully request that you contact me to work this out. I do not desire to drag this out, but I will not back down either.

<small>[ March 03, 2003, 07:43 PM: Message edited by: badz2801 ]</small>

MelloYellow

HELLO

USE YOUR CREDIT CARD COMPANY TO FORCE A CHARGE BACK.

Tell them you were fraudulently charged and the goods were never delivered. File a Police Report for Fraud too if desired. But typically the cops won't care. Your credit card company will tho.

badz2801

The problem with a credit card company is that the bill was paid in full. Also they usually send a warning and do not take direct action. It would be disputed on both sides and he could say well I sent one package (pump + controller). It would turn into a mess, but yes that is my first course of action if it is not here on Sat. The other problem is that it does not cover my PCM which I did not purchase from him. On top of that, he lives in Colorado and I live in Virginia. I cannot file a police report as they have zero jurisdiction in Colorado. I would have to live there or find someone with power of attorney (ie the lawyer I contacted). Thus, I have a feeling that legal action is going to be the only way to get this man to come up with the goods.

<small>[ March 03, 2003, 09:20 PM: Message edited by: badz2801 ]</small>

10.5 Dave

iTrader: (5)

Personally I would go the credit card route,much easier that would stop the BS real quick.After what you have been through I wouldnt want their products.Plenty of other companies will appreciate your business.C5R block free-flowing heads exhaust high boost ati you will have belt breakage guaranteed try 13 belts 1500miles 25 passes(my experience).Order single from Rob Raymer,GWP actions are a blessing in disguise.ATI went 10.91@ 126.85 just got tired of changing belt ever other pass.

QuickSilver2002

Sorry to hear about your luck. Sounds like you got the shaft big time.

I have heard the exact same experience you had from others. Your situation is not an isolated incident with these guys. They seem to "loose" quite a few packages and PCMs, makes you wonder.

I hope you get it worked out.

BIGBOS

Sorry to hear about your problems..

I agree with LASTLS1

I would call tom izzo over at speed inc. he will set you up w/everything you need, I got my ATI kit in 2 weeks... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

JMBLOWNWS6

iTrader: (17)

Call your credit card company! I had a simular transaction and got the run around until I called them and had the money credited routed back to my card and I paid no fees!!! This is what these companies are good at in solving problems like the one you have aquired!! <img border="0" alt="[bang head]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_banghead.gif" /> just my :02