Crank bolt won't stay put. Had to drop timing...
08-27-2003, 10:44 PM
#1
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Crank bolt won't stay put. Had to drop timing... OK, on the 3.20 pulley, I was seeing 8 PSI of boost, peaking to 10. But, then the boost would roll off and decrease. Soon after, I could hear the crank pulley chiming. (Crank Bolt backed out). 
Meanwhile, knowing the pulley is slipping, I ordered Reichard Racing 3.20 pulley. Then, based on what one of you guys said about how restrictive the ATI supplied filter is, I managed to swap that one out for a much bigger one. See the circled filters in this pic:
I tightened the bolt back down to 225 ft-lbs. and took it out (ATI 3.20 SC pulley and new E-1796 filter). Instead of 8 PSI peaking at 10, it immediately hit 10 PSI. But, then it immediately dropped off. That DANG bolt was backing out again. This time, the pins were knocked out except for one
I ran across MMS's new pulley instructions and tightened it to 250 ft-lbs. I even gave it a little more for good measure. I immediately saw 10 PSI, starting to climb to 11, but guess FREAKING what?!? I could hear a slight tinkle (tell-tell sign the bolt started to back out again). I took it back home before the bolts I'd put in place of the pins sheared off.
I called ATI and they told me with the torque of this 422 and the boost level I am trying to run, I MUST use something like the 'other' ATI's Crank Pin Fixture Kit for LS1. I guess I will put that on order. I can't reach my magic boost level without doing this.
Oh, I had to drop the timing with each increase in boost. I put a half can of Torco Race Fuel Additive in it one time, though, and all KR went away. So race fuel or TORCO should let me make more power at the track or when I want to see how much I can get out of it at the dyno. I gotta buy another case of that stuff.
BTW, I got a new contract! Yaayyyyyyyyyyyy!!!
Meanwhile, knowing the pulley is slipping, I ordered Reichard Racing 3.20 pulley. Then, based on what one of you guys said about how restrictive the ATI supplied filter is, I managed to swap that one out for a much bigger one. See the circled filters in this pic:
I tightened the bolt back down to 225 ft-lbs. and took it out (ATI 3.20 SC pulley and new E-1796 filter). Instead of 8 PSI peaking at 10, it immediately hit 10 PSI. But, then it immediately dropped off. That DANG bolt was backing out again. This time, the pins were knocked out except for one
I ran across MMS's new pulley instructions and tightened it to 250 ft-lbs. I even gave it a little more for good measure. I immediately saw 10 PSI, starting to climb to 11, but guess FREAKING what?!? I could hear a slight tinkle (tell-tell sign the bolt started to back out again). I took it back home before the bolts I'd put in place of the pins sheared off.
I called ATI and they told me with the torque of this 422 and the boost level I am trying to run, I MUST use something like the 'other' ATI's Crank Pin Fixture Kit for LS1. I guess I will put that on order. I can't reach my magic boost level without doing this.
Oh, I had to drop the timing with each increase in boost. I put a half can of Torco Race Fuel Additive in it one time, though, and all KR went away. So race fuel or TORCO should let me make more power at the track or when I want to see how much I can get out of it at the dyno. I gotta buy another case of that stuff.
BTW, I got a new contract! Yaayyyyyyyyyyyy!!!
08-27-2003, 11:03 PM
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Re: Crank bolt won't stay put. Had to drop timing... Glad to hear you're getting things worked out with that beast and the new contract.
I guess the TA's have more room for a filter because on my SS the ATI filter just barely fit up in there.
I guess the TA's have more room for a filter because on my SS the ATI filter just barely fit up in there.
08-27-2003, 11:07 PM
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Re: Crank bolt won't stay put. Had to drop timing... Congrats on the contract!
Are we talking the Accessible Tech SC pin kit or the ATI Super Damper pin kit?
True keyway would be nice.
Are we talking the Accessible Tech SC pin kit or the ATI Super Damper pin kit?
True keyway would be nice.
08-28-2003, 12:06 AM
#5
Re: Crank bolt won't stay put. Had to drop timing... I'm glad to see I am not the only one suffering from this problem. I might have it fixed now. I will see friday at the track. All I can say is she is making more than 10psi and holding it. 
I ordered the ATI pin kit from ThunderRacing, problem is you have to get the stock LS1 crank pulley keyed by ATI(the one's who make the pin kit) or by a local machine shop. I am trying to find a local place to cut the key way in the LS1 CP, so far no luck.
I will be using the pin kit on the new block and not on this one. Hopefully I will be posting new best times this friday.
Good luck Mike and congrats on the contract. They shut my place down, and shuffled me off to another place so I can keep getting paid
J
I ordered the ATI pin kit from ThunderRacing, problem is you have to get the stock LS1 crank pulley keyed by ATI(the one's who make the pin kit) or by a local machine shop. I am trying to find a local place to cut the key way in the LS1 CP, so far no luck.
I will be using the pin kit on the new block and not on this one. Hopefully I will be posting new best times this friday.
Good luck Mike and congrats on the contract. They shut my place down, and shuffled me off to another place so I can keep getting paid
J
08-28-2003, 12:09 AM
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Re: Crank bolt won't stay put. Had to drop timing... Black LS1 T/A thanks for posting this info about the filter, I'm going to have one ordered right away...
Glad to see your moving along nicely w/the car, I can't wait until I get my pulley/belt issue fixed...
Glad to see your moving along nicely w/the car, I can't wait until I get my pulley/belt issue fixed...
08-28-2003, 12:47 AM
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Re: Crank bolt won't stay put. Had to drop timing... I am also getting the ATI Crank Pin kit. Actually, ATI is right up the road from me (Baltimore, MD) so I'll probably drive up there when I get paid Monday.
Then I just need to slap in the second Walbro 340, retune, and I should be good to go for the magic 600 number.
Mike, I'm glad your back in the IT workforce! Best of luck on the new contract.
Then I just need to slap in the second Walbro 340, retune, and I should be good to go for the magic 600 number.
Mike, I'm glad your back in the IT workforce!
Best of luck on the new contract. Trending Topics
08-28-2003, 04:42 AM
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Re: Crank bolt won't stay put. Had to drop timing... I don't know if I can fit that filter because I did not replace the Air Pump. That may be why. The closed end of the filter butts against the inside of the fender, I cut the accordion hose in half (I have my MAF down there, so you will need more than half of the accordion hose if your MAF is still in the TB position). The outlet end of the filter is cradled in the curve of the small ATI J-pipe that connects to the hose going to the purge valve.
Not only does the filter have MUCH more surface area, but the intake air does not have as far to travel down that hose.
This is the ATI Crank Pin Kit:
Details are here:
http://www.atiperformanceproducts.co...s/pr/30402.htm
Not only does the filter have MUCH more surface area, but the intake air does not have as far to travel down that hose.
This is the ATI Crank Pin Kit:
Details are here:
http://www.atiperformanceproducts.co...s/pr/30402.htm
08-28-2003, 06:44 AM
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Re: Crank bolt won't stay put. Had to drop timing...
I am also getting the ATI Crank Pin kit. Actually, ATI is right up the road from me (Baltimore, MD) so I'll probably drive up there when I get paid Monday.
Then I just need to slap in the second Walbro 340, retune, and I should be good to go for the magic 600 number.
Mike, I'm glad your back in the IT workforce! Best of luck on the new contract.
Then I just need to slap in the second Walbro 340, retune, and I should be good to go for the magic 600 number.
Mike, I'm glad your back in the IT workforce!
Best of luck on the new contract. 
mark
08-28-2003, 07:13 AM
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Re: Crank bolt won't stay put. Had to drop timing... If you are looking for a place to key the pulley check out colman machine. They are very close to ATI, maybe 15 minutes down the road. They put the key way in my pulley and made a sweet crank triger mounting bracket for me.
08-28-2003, 08:53 AM
#11
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Re: Crank bolt won't stay put. Had to drop timing... Bump it... I feel a bit foolish (money-wise), but I ordered the Damper AND the pin kit. They claim vibrations with the stock damper (~4000 RPMs) affect engine longevity due to vibrations transmitted thru the crank. At least when it comes (next week), I will be able to put it in without worrying if someone can key the stock damper for me.
I'll just convice myself I will save money in the long-term.
I'll just convice myself I will save money in the long-term.
08-31-2003, 11:35 PM
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Re: Crank bolt won't stay put. Had to drop timing... [quote]
I don't know if I can fit that filter because I did not replace the Air Pump. That may be why. The closed end of the filter butts against the inside of the fender, I cut the accordion hose in half (I have my MAF down there, so you will need more than half of the accordion hose if your MAF is still in the TB position). The outlet end of the filter is cradled in the curve of the small ATI J-pipe that connects to the hose going to the purge valve.
Not only does the filter have MUCH more surface area, but the intake air does not have as far to travel down that hose.[quote]
Can you post a pic of the install of the E-1796. I picked one up this weekend and cant install it on my SS. Theres not enough room through the intercooler piping to fit the open end of the filter. How can this be done?
I don't know if I can fit that filter because I did not replace the Air Pump. That may be why. The closed end of the filter butts against the inside of the fender, I cut the accordion hose in half (I have my MAF down there, so you will need more than half of the accordion hose if your MAF is still in the TB position). The outlet end of the filter is cradled in the curve of the small ATI J-pipe that connects to the hose going to the purge valve.
Not only does the filter have MUCH more surface area, but the intake air does not have as far to travel down that hose.[quote]
Can you post a pic of the install of the E-1796. I picked one up this weekend and cant install it on my SS. Theres not enough room through the intercooler piping to fit the open end of the filter. How can this be done?
09-01-2003, 06:04 PM
#13
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Re: Crank bolt won't stay put. Had to drop timing... I'll take a pic for you tomorrow and get it developed. Most of the filter is in the fender well... actually bumping against the inside of the fender. I have my MAF down there, too.
09-05-2003, 07:49 AM
#14
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Re: Crank bolt won't stay put. Had to drop timing... Took the Pics after the holiday and finally got them yesterday:
http://www.blackls1ta.com/ATI_Filter_Mod.htm
Excuse the wire-tie on the fender joint... yes, I can be ghetto when it works.
http://www.blackls1ta.com/ATI_Filter_Mod.htm
Excuse the wire-tie on the fender joint... yes, I can be ghetto when it works.
09-05-2003, 08:53 AM
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Re: Crank bolt won't stay put. Had to drop timing... don't take the crank pulley spining lightly.
I will DESTROY your Crankshaft very quickly!
Mine slipped and it did a number on my crank snout. Grooved it pretty bad but I caught it in time.
I cut a keyway and never had a problem since.
I have a Vortech and the kit came with an ATI superdamper.
Hopefully when you remove your crank damper the crank snout will not be damaged.
I will DESTROY your Crankshaft very quickly!
Mine slipped and it did a number on my crank snout. Grooved it pretty bad but I caught it in time.
I cut a keyway and never had a problem since.
I have a Vortech and the kit came with an ATI superdamper.
Hopefully when you remove your crank damper the crank snout will not be damaged.
09-05-2003, 11:43 AM
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Re: Crank bolt won't stay put. Had to drop timing... I hope you don't think buying a $500 Super Damper and a $120 key/pin kit is taking the issue lightly.
09-05-2003, 11:03 PM
#19
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Re: Crank bolt won't stay put. Had to drop timing... You'll be very happy with the Super Damper. Really settles the motor down. I noticed ability to drive smoother at lower RPM's without stalling, less clutch chatter, etc. Must help the bearings and longevity too.
09-06-2003, 06:25 AM
#20
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Re: Crank bolt won't stay put. Had to drop timing... I plan to put it in Sunday.
If I could get three main questions answered, though, I'd feel more comfortable when I start.
Q1. Putting it on the crank (several related questions, actually): Did you HAVE to have a pulley installer to get it on? Does it slide on or does heating it a bit get it on? Is it best to put it on assembled or certain pieces at a time? I have the instructions for heating the aluminum hub with boiling water for five minutes. Is that what I have? With the coating on it, It's hard for me to tell...it feels a bit heavy for aluminum.
2. The drilled hole for the pin; how does it bottom out? I mean, I can't reconcile in my mind how after I drill to the center bore of the crank, how that pin is going to still protrude enough to lock in the keyway of the new hub. Do you just float it to protrude enough, anticipating after the bolt is installed, it has sufficient protruderence? (Yeah, I made up that word. )
Q3. Were you able to do all the install without removing the fan/radiator, etc., to make room to work? I'd just like to know that ahead of time so I don't start it, only to have to remove more stuff to get sufficient room to work.
I think I will replace my serpentine belts while I'm in there, too.
If I could get three main questions answered, though, I'd feel more comfortable when I start.
Q1. Putting it on the crank (several related questions, actually): Did you HAVE to have a pulley installer to get it on? Does it slide on or does heating it a bit get it on? Is it best to put it on assembled or certain pieces at a time? I have the instructions for heating the aluminum hub with boiling water for five minutes. Is that what I have? With the coating on it, It's hard for me to tell...it feels a bit heavy for aluminum.
2. The drilled hole for the pin; how does it bottom out? I mean, I can't reconcile in my mind how after I drill to the center bore of the crank, how that pin is going to still protrude enough to lock in the keyway of the new hub. Do you just float it to protrude enough, anticipating after the bolt is installed, it has sufficient protruderence? (Yeah, I made up that word.
)Q3. Were you able to do all the install without removing the fan/radiator, etc., to make room to work? I'd just like to know that ahead of time so I don't start it, only to have to remove more stuff to get sufficient room to work.
I think I will replace my serpentine belts while I'm in there, too.
