new gears installed!!
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 142
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From: Roanoke Rapids, NC
new gears installed!! well i finally got around to putting my 4.10's in thursday night. it took almost 7 hours lol but it was the first time i've ever built a rearend. anyways i took that little block out that holds the axles out and then removed the c-clips. i put that little block back in place so the spiders wouldnt fall out of place. anyways i put the new ring gear on the carrier and got everything shimmed and what not and went to remove the block from the carrier and... SUPRISE!.. it doesnt come past the ring gear!! so here i go tearing everything back apart again just to get that out. i grinded the side of it down just enough to get it past the ring... maybe 5 thousanths at the most.. Has anyone ran into this before? i used motive gears. but i got it back together and its very quiet until you coast or decelerate. it doesnt whine loud but its more than i want. will this go away after break in or something i'll have to live with? thanks!
No gear should make noise, I have 4.10's in my car, they don't make noise. 4.56's in my truck they don't make noise. I've done many gear swaps, it's all in how you set it up.
I'd check your backlash, you want 5-9 thousandth's, then check your pattern.
I'd check your backlash, you want 5-9 thousandth's, then check your pattern.
Got any pics of the pattern the gears are making? That will tell a lot, but it sounds to me like the backlash is too open causing the deceleration whine your talking about. Did you keep the to machined spacers separated so they went back on the sides they cam off of. That seems to be the most common mistake leading to whine when someone sets up a 10 bolt.
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 142
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From: Roanoke Rapids, NC
nah no pictures.. i had the backlash set at .006 according to the dial indicator. i figured it would get a little looser as time went on.. as far as the spacers i could only reuse one of them the other side needed to be smaller. the pattern was right in the middle of the teeth on the ring and about halfway down. how about the problem i had with that little block thing not coming back out?
the little block thing makes it appear you have a torsen differential,as auburns have a round cross pin.SLP advertises a special modified block for use when installing 4.10s' on a torsen.
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Teching In
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 45
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From: Kansas City, MO
yes that little block i have a 02 ss camaro with 4:10's and i have to take it apart to get to the pinion bearing and i cant get that Block out cuz it hits the damn ring gear HOW DO I GET IT OUT!!!!?
As for the little block you just have to grind the corners down where it will interfere with the teeth on a 4.10 on the install and removal. As far as parts or spiders falling out there aren't any of those in a Torsen so no need to worry about it. Far as the backlash goes .006 is a little tight Motive recommends from .010-.012 if I remember correctly but don't quote me on that one. That block setup from SLP is a joke unless you just feel like wasting $200 for now reason. If you didn't reuse the factory cut spacers with the diff what did you use?
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Sep 2008
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From: Roanoke Rapids, NC
i used one of those spacers on one side along with a couple other shims. on the other side i had to use a combination of different shims to get the pattern right. yeah i was pissed i got it all together and had to go taking it back apart again. but as far as the factory spacers.. can you usually use just those with aftermarket gears and it pattern correctly? oh and the instructions said .007 - .009. i figured it would wear into spec..
Yeah as for the factory machined spacers you are best to leave them where they are, and bring the pinion depth to where it works with what you already have with the new gear. I have never replaced one with shims. Like I mentioned earlier if you get them mixed up you will end up with a crazy pattern and backlash reading you might try swapping sides with the factory ones and it work right out.
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Sep 2008
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From: Roanoke Rapids, NC
but the new 4.10 ring was about .100 thicker than the old one. wouldnt this mean i would have to move the carrier farther to the driver side? or is the pinion smaller around to compensate for that? as far as the shim on the pinion i just pressed the bearing off and reused the original.
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Sep 2008
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From: Roanoke Rapids, NC
take note of where your spacers are at and tear that thing apart! thats what i ended up doing. then just grind some off of the corners and it should slide by it
but the new 4.10 ring was about .100 thicker than the old one. wouldnt this mean i would have to move the carrier farther to the driver side? or is the pinion smaller around to compensate for that? as far as the shim on the pinion i just pressed the bearing off and reused the original.
Even though the ring gear is thicker the pinion is also smaller in diameter. You could use the original shim from the pinion to rough it in but probably end up adding about .020 to it to get the clearances you want. It may take 2 or 3 tries of putting things together before it all works out on the backlash and the pattern just takes some patience. How are you setting the bearing preload on the pinion? Using a torque wrench or doing it just by feel. Did you swap to a solid pinion spacer on this install or a crush sleeve still in there?
Jeff
Last edited by Jawsgear; Feb 16, 2009 at 05:41 PM.
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 142
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From: Roanoke Rapids, NC
well i only had a click type torque wrench so i got pinion preload to just over 20 inch pounds. backlash i set between .006 and .007.. um as far as pinion depth i just used the original shim behind the bearing. everyone i talked to said that 99% of the time that will get it verry close.
I dont know if I would give using the original shims a 99% chance of working... Maybe 75 - 80.... Establishing pinion depth is pretty easy, and its a pretty important step. Ive had rear ends go together with all the stock shims. It usually where I start, assuming the pinion depth is right. But Ive also had rear ends require complete set up from scratch. It all depends on what you are working with.
Also...a click wrench is pretty bad to use for pinion preload. You really need a beam style wrench set up for inch pounds. I got one pretty cheap from napa awhile back. Not saying yours is set up bad or incorrectly...just saying its much easier to get the preload correct.
To the original talks about noise. I have 4.56s in my jeep, and Ive put 4.88s and 5.16s in other peoples jeeps. All are dead quiet even at highway speeds. You can have noise, and have the gears be set up pretty much spot on, but you can always make them better, and quieter. Grinding a few inner corners off the ring gear is very common to get the crosspin out also. They make crosspins with recesses built in, so after you remove the crosspin bolt, you spin the cross shaft, and there is a recess to slide the axle shaft over. Not sure what rears they offer them for...I never found a use for them.
J.
Also...a click wrench is pretty bad to use for pinion preload. You really need a beam style wrench set up for inch pounds. I got one pretty cheap from napa awhile back. Not saying yours is set up bad or incorrectly...just saying its much easier to get the preload correct.
To the original talks about noise. I have 4.56s in my jeep, and Ive put 4.88s and 5.16s in other peoples jeeps. All are dead quiet even at highway speeds. You can have noise, and have the gears be set up pretty much spot on, but you can always make them better, and quieter. Grinding a few inner corners off the ring gear is very common to get the crosspin out also. They make crosspins with recesses built in, so after you remove the crosspin bolt, you spin the cross shaft, and there is a recess to slide the axle shaft over. Not sure what rears they offer them for...I never found a use for them.
J.