JonSal

Hey guys! So, I have a 1970 C10 with a 350 SBC. Cam, High rise IM, 600cfm carb, and some aftermarket headers. Not happy with the setup, she just doesn't get up and go like I would like her too(bad tune maybe?). I am new to V8's, been an import guy for a long time so my knowledge of these motors are very very limited. She is also matted to a Muncie 4 spd manual trans, with VERY long gearing which I think is killing it a bit as well. My local shop is willing to handle an LS swap for $2,500, all I need to do is bring the drivetrain. Or $5,000 end to end including the motor and auto trans(LM7).

Here are my options that I am throwing around:

1. Build the 350 with the $6,000
2. Swap in the LM7 shop suggested and have some money left over.
3. Acquire an LQ9(or the like) and mildly build as best I could with the 6k total in mind.

What do you guys think? I want to stay NA on this build. I would LOVE to have EFI, but if it doesn't make sense cost wise, I can deal with the carb or go FItech maybe?

Thanks!

BudRacing

iTrader: (3)

TBH, since it's probably just a weekend toy/cruiser, I'd probably just put a lower rear gear in it and reassess. It could change your perspective enough to keep you happy for now.

I'm pretty set on FI for all of its conveniences and efficiencies, but you also have to consider that you've got a running, driving vehicle and a solution to its pep could be more simply solved.

bammax

Your build doesn't give alot of details but what you did say shows some issues. A 600 cfm carb is perfect for the street with good throttle response and mileage. A high rise manifold is great for the strip with a high revving engine. Using them together makes for a dog generally. The cam could make things better or worse depending on the specs. Basically it sounds like a build that was done without having a specific goal in mind.
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My go to for a budget street car is an edelbrock 600 with electric choke on a dual plane performer intake, 2.5" dual exhaust, headers and emissions delete if the state allows, then a custom tuned hei. That formula won't make you the fastest at the track but it's a super reliable setup that runs in any weather and gives a good seat of the pants feel when you get on it. When you want more power slap some high flow heads and a cam designed to give you the powerband you want and you'll feel the power jump again.

If you decide to do a swap research like crazy first. If you know what your end goal is you can build the new motor to get you there and you won't be chasing issues after it's already in. With the right kit you can probably do the swap yourself in a weekend and save a ton of money.

JoeNova

x2. If you're staying N/A, you're going to want to do this either way. Might as well do it first.

emfh

You could put a supercharger and efi on the sbc for 6 grand

JonSal

Thanks for the responses guys. Yes, rear end gearing is a great idea.

My goal with this truck is to make her decently quick while maintaining driveability, and reliability. I had a 1999 Ford Lightning back in the day, all stock. I am hoping to be quicker than that. She was about 1,000lbs heavier than the c10, so hopefully, it won't be too difficult.

Any advice on what to change out on this setup for the ideal streetable set up? I forgot to mention I have an aftermarket HEI distributor.

pdxmotorhead

What part of the world you in? Sometimes there are regionally specific suggestions, shops etc..

JonSal

Charlotte, NC

Rick Dorion

iTrader: (1)

Do you know what rear gear you have?

matts01z71

My neighbor was quoted 6500 for an ls engine only swap into his 80s K5 blazer, so for a complete turn key drive train, 5k sounds like a great deal. I agree on the current build status, dump the high rise. I just built a JY 5.3, got it for 550, complete rebuild kit 700, TSP cam 400, machine shop 5-600. I did the rebuild and the R&R on my 03 Tahoe. I think it might cost more than 6k to be quicker than the Lightning in this truck.

Tuskyz28

Your C10 will be a easy vehicle swap to convert to a LS. It' alot of room in the engine bay. If I was in your shoes this is what I would do. Sell the SBC for 500 minimum. That will bump your budget to 6500 dollars. For that amount of money you can make 550 horse at the crank with ease. I have done it before so it can be done again. Follow this recipe.....

LQ4 short block- 1000 used
Gasket Kit- 350 new ( ws6 store or BTR)
LS3/L76 intake- 250 used ( they pop up for this or less all the time)
Trunion kit- 160 new (BTR)
92 mm throttle bottle- 375 or less ( Go Nick Williams and avoid a Fast brand)
lifters- 200 dollars new ( morel 5315s)
oil pump- 105 dollars new (ws6 store or jegs/summit or BTR)
LS3 heads- 500 dollars used ( some in the for sale section now by a member)
Cam- 425 new (cam motion or Pat G or BTR)
tune- 350 dollars
various engine covers and bolts- 400 dollars or less (it's easy to find covers here as well used)
42 lb injectors- get used LS3 injectors for 175 or less. I paid 150 for mine on here from a member.

All those parts added up is 4200 dollars or so. That'll still leave you with money for a set of headers and mufflers.

8.Lug

The only difficult part about swapping an LS into something is the VSS (vehicle speed sensor). Everything else is cake - and way easier than any import engine swap, that's for damn sure. Just do it yourself.

B52bombardier1

Yea, but an LM7 is not the highest horsepower or torque LS-style of engine. I only have mine because it was the least expensive option and my SBC 350 block was badly cracked / not rebuildable. To get what you want out of a modern GM engine, you will need to up your game here and expenses with maybe an LS3, not an LM7. Certainly, the LM7 can be brought up to a higher horsepower level, but it will cost significant bucks in parts and labor.

Rick

8.Lug

Any LS is going to be an upgrade from the dog SBC. The head design on the LS is worlds apart from a SBC and once you get the LS bolted up and running, the hard part is over. Now it's all just plug-n-play. Unless your name is Kenny Duttweiler, you'd be a fool to waste any more time on a SBC.

JonSal

No idea. 95% set on doing this while i collect LS parts.

This guy was reasonably priced and VERY busy. 2 months out!! I really would prefer a 6.0L though.

nice! This is what I need. I can do the swap, I've done probably 10 or more honda swaps, but it's all new to me so overwhelming, not to mention I do not know what heads/cams/etc to use for an efficient budget set up. Which i figured I could do little by little once the motor is in. You have me thinking though! So this doesn't count for mounts, trans, harness, ecu, right? also, what hardware do i need for a tune to be possible?

The import swaps were very easy(honda b16/b18/d16/etc), I would be surprised if this is easier. what about the drive shaft? that just bolts up? What about fuel delivery?

hmm. second comment about ease. You guys may have just convinced me!

Tuskyz28

So this doesn't count for mounts, trans, harness, ecu, right? also, what hardware do i need for a tune to be possible?

With 2500 left there is some money left for those parts you list.... trans, mounts, harness ecu.

Harnesses/ECU can be found on GM based vehicles at a pull a part for roughly 200-300.

Tranny-not sure which one you want to use but on Craigslist I've seen turbo 350 cores sell for 150- 200 dollars. Then a rebuild kit varies on your rebuild kit and your builder.

Motor Mounts- it's alot of people that makes mounts for this swap. It's a popular swap. BRP, Dirty Dingo and Holley just to name a few.... I'll estimate 200 for mounts. Some are more, some are less just depends on what brand you choose.

JonSal

Would it be better to buy a custom-made harness for my vehicle? I would imagine they make a plug and play version. Or would it be better to grab the harness and take it somewhere for modification?


I have no idea which trans I would like to use. I've been tossing the idea around of using the Muncie 4-speed transmission that I currently have in there, and changing out the rear gearing because first gear feels like second gear at the moment. Is there much that needs to be done to a or Auto transmission for 450 to 500 horsepower? I would imagine an upgraded clutch for a manual transmission, I've never dealt with a high horsepower automatic transmission before. I've also read to stay away from rebuilt auto Transmissions because usually they are weaker than original Factory built Transmissions.

Also I've seen kits with mounts, headers, subframe of some sort. Close to $900 to $1,000 for everything. Would this be the most economical way to do things?

Tuskyz28

painless makes a harness for roughy 325 dollars. You also need to make your mind up on the tranmission you want to use. It's plenty of articles to help/show you how to get the job done without breaking the bank.
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/how-to-drop-an-ls-engine-in-a-67-72-chevy/
I'm honestly a stick guy at heart but if I was a auto guy I recommend you reaching out to circle D tranmissions. Prices are high but all their customers are happy. Shoot me a PM and may be I can help you out more

JonSal

Thanks brother! I will pm you

99 Black Bird T/A

iTrader: (4)

​​​​​​Is resell value important to you for this 1970 C10? Some times the market will punish a swapped vehicle's value. If your keeping the C10 long term that may be irrelevant. In 10 years the LS we all love will generally be remembered fondly but long surpassed by the new LT1/LT4 and upcoming GM DOHC V8's. Value wise the C10 might Resell better with a small block Chevrolet engine at that point.

That truck issue sounds more like the wrong gears in the rear and a old manual for that you don't like plus a mismatched SBC 350. With $6000 I wouldn't feel too confident about staying on budget with an LS swap for a C10. It sounds like you don't like the Muncie transmission with its long gearing. I would save up some more cash and get rid of the Muncie and get a T56 and put 4.10 gears in the rear.

The old 350 if it's in decent shape can drive pretty well. It's hard to find someone good with carbs sometimes these days. I would find an Edelbrock Performer dual plane intake, HEI distributor and someone with some old school knowledge and try that first. If the 350 is a solid engine I think you can sort it out for less than a $1000. If you can do the work yourself for probably $500 or less.

I was shocked how well the old worn out 350 in my 72 vette ran with a correctly rebuilt Q-jet carb and good tune up. Less than $400 in a Lars rebuilt Q-jet, plugs, wires HEI kept the old 350 running well for another four years while I planned the motor upgrade I really wanted.

Next for your truck I would do some 4.10 gears and research a T56 swap. I think 90% of daily driving fun is gears, good shifter and a good transmission.

Everyone has their own view of things. My view is shaped by having a 91 RS that's LS swapped and that 72 vette that has a custom built Dart 400 in it. As far as future value goes, I don't care I want to drive and have fun. The 72 Vette has walked away from several LS cars,V8 BMW M3, etc on the street. A friend drove my 99 TA with a heads and cam package that made 418 whp and the 72 vette blew the doors off the TA. It's fun to spank an LS car with a small block Chevy. A couple of C5 owners don't speak to me anymore

Then if the truck still isn't suitable I'd look at a GM crate SBC 383 or crate BBC 454/502 or the LS swap.