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Speaking specifically of the LS1 F-bodies, I would say the manuals tend to be worth a little more, mostly because their demand is higher than for the autos. But, in my experience, now that these cars are 20+ years old it's generally easier to find a low(ish) mileage manual than an auto, simply because the autos were more often daily drivers vs. the manuals having spent more of their lives as toys. So for the folks who want an auto, albeit a smaller contingent, we have less of a pool to choose from in the "very low mileage" range therefore might have to pay more. But those are isolated incidents, not really representative of the average (average being that the manuals are usually worth a bit more, all else being equal).
With all of that said, I disagree with the concept of buying a manual strictly for value retention. That might have been a plausible concept when these cars were new, as there was no MSRP difference between the manual and auto so you would have paid the same for a car that might be worth a bit more later (now). But that no longer applies today, as you'll likely pay a bit more to get a manual in the first place, so it ends up being a wash. In other words, if the question is, "are the manuals continually appreciating faster than autos, or continuallydepreciating more slowly than autos", the answer is no on either count. The price spread between the two on the used market hasn't really changed much in the last decade or more. In fact, if anything, the gap may be a little smaller now as, again, the pool of low mileage/nice condition autos has become more depleted than the pool of otherwise comparable manuals.
Buy what you want for enjoyment. Stick's are definitely worth more. It's literally 1 of the first 3 questions anyone will ask when a 4th gen is for sale. Miles, stick/auto, price.
The 6 Speed cars always go for more $$$ and will hold it's value better over a 4l60e car, as manuals become more rare in todays market Im sure they will continue to increase more and more over the auto cars
as manuals become more rare in todays market Im sure they will continue to increase more and more over the auto cars
I don't know, that's not really consistent with what has happened over time with the now 50-60 year old cars that are still on the road. As a platform ages and available examples are depleted, being picky about options (especially ones that are changeable) becomes less feasible and less important than overall condition (as a trans swap is easier/cheaper than restorative body work and such). Plus, as the age of the individuals who are interested in a given platform advances, their bodies sometimes don't agree with constant clutch operation (I've seen a lot of old 4-speed muscle cars swapped to autos just for this reason, folks with bad knees, hips, etc.).
The price spread between the 4-speed and the auto versions of cars like my '71 hasn't really changed much at all in the last couple of decades that I've owned mine. Now that the LS1 F-bodies are reaching antique status and the really nice ones of either trans type are getting harder to find, I don't expect the current value spread of one trans type over the other to grow in any dramatic fashion.
I'd like to chime in that manual convertibles are really a nice find and will really hold their value if kept nice. So few were built. Most 'vert buyers, like myself, want A4 cars for cruising vs rowing through the gears.
I'm so glad I went the automatic route as I have trouble shifting these days due to an ailing left knee. I actually had to sell my 2007 Mustang GT/CS 5 speed manual that I had for many years. Even in the very common Mustang world, manual convertibles were tougher to find.
Some years back, I briefly and stupidly thought about selling my manual 2013 SS Camaro and went to see what it would bring if I sold it to a dealer. That bottom feeding used car salesman evaluator said they pay LESS for manual stick cars because they are harder to sell. His point was that many, many fewer people (this LS1Tech web site is an enormous exception) in the younger generations today don't know how to drive a manual stick car.
I still have this Victory Red, factory dual-mode exhaust (absolutely love that sound), factory Hurst shifter car. With only about 91,000 miles on it and it still does zero to jail in about three seconds.
Manuals are more popular in weekend cars. As the availability of manuals in specific performance cars has dropped, the desire for a manuals in that category has risen. So it depends on the car, and the use. I suspect, over time, the manual C7s will be more popular than C8's, and like what Gated Six/EAG did for Ferrari and Lambo, someone will figure out how to put a manual in the C8 to respond.
If the person is searching for an f-body as a fun driving car, then most likely they'll want the six speed. Auto's are popular with daily's and drag racers.
Some years back, I briefly and stupidly thought about selling my manual 2013 SS Camaro and went to see what it would bring if I sold it to a dealer. That bottom feeding used car salesman evaluator said they pay LESS for manual stick cars because they are harder to sell. His point was that many, many fewer people (this LS1Tech web site is an enormous exception) in the younger generations today don't know how to drive a manual stick car.
I still have this Victory Red, factory dual-mode exhaust (absolutely love that sound), factory Hurst shifter car. With only about 91,000 miles on it and it still does zero to jail in about three seconds.
Rick
The main reasons I bought my SS were that it was an M6 car and that it was from down south. This site may be an exception, but the issues with the autos in 5th Gens are well documented and I'll bet the attrition rate for those will be much higher as the years go by. Same goes for 4th Gens. The 4L60E is not a stout piece stock. While most people don't know how to drive sticks, a lot of the younger ( read: import fans ) car guys out there DO know and when they decide to step up into something better, they'll want a stick. Whether or not any of these cars will increase in value over an auto remains to be seen. I think it's much more a question of actual condition than how they're optioned out.
...His point was that many, many fewer people (this LS1Tech web site is an enormous exception) in the younger generations today don't know how to drive a manual stick car.
I agree with that line of thinking. The overall market demand is lower as there are fewer young folks who want this in the first place, and as the older crowd continues to age (and develops more knee and hip problems) some of them will also move away from the manual trans type. That's not to say that demand will ever go away, but I don't think it's likely that there will be any uptick in demand going forward. However, as long as the supply is lower than the demand, they will still hold some additional value.
Originally Posted by LS1Formulation
This site may be an exception, but the issues with the autos in 5th Gens are well documented and I'll bet the attrition rate for those will be much higher as the years go by.
The auto trans isn't what kept me away from the 5th gens, it was the L99 engine that GM saw fit to saddle them with. If they had offered an LS3 with an auto in those cars, I would have most likely bought one when they were new. I had no interest in the manual, but I had even less interest in the L99 (which isn't something I wanted to tear into and "fix" when they were still new and under warranty).
Originally Posted by LS1Formulation
Whether or not any of these cars will increase in value over an auto remains to be seen. I think it's much more a question of actual condition than how they're optioned out.
I definitely agree here. As I mentioned above, looking at the "old" antiques of today, 50-60 year old cars, there hasn't been any continued increase in the average value spread between the manuals and autos in the last couple of decades at least. The spread typically doesn't continue growing as a given platform reaches an advanced age because ALL examples of nice condition become exceedingly more rare (and, again, a trans type swap is almost always easier than major restorative work). So far I have seen no indication that this trend would be significantly different in relation to the 4th gen F-bodies.
I was just curious about the value perspective of these cars when it comes to M vs A. I know I shouldnt care about it that much. There are better investments out there.
RPM is correct. Many of the manual F bodies out there have lower miles than Autos and the sellers are pointing out the "value increase" as a selling point.
I have a 87 Camaro convertible thats manual, a Miata thats manual and a Toyota truck, thats manual and a Wrangler, that's manual. All of these are weekend drives. Like the poster with bad knee I think I want to just relax and push on the gas and get going. I just sold a 1993 LT1 and looking for a LS1 F body. I think I will go with Auto. so I can commute with half of the time.I am a great fan of manual, but getting old my friends.
I always believed I would have at least one manual in my car family. Always did until August 2022, the month I sold my last manual. . All automatics now.
A before with the GT 5 speed and after with the automatic. At least I gained 120 more HP between the old 4.6 (300 HP) and 5.0 Coyote (420 HP). .
Prior to the days when the manual was always the fastest option stock for stock the manual might have been sought after more during their protection run or shortly after. You know while they are still “late models.” If one is looking for a “classic” I bet it doesn’t matter as much.
Now that the autos are faster than the manuals I don’t think a later model manual will bring more than an auto today or 40 years from now.
Prior to the days when the manual was always the fastest option stock for stock the manual might have been sought after more during their protection run or shortly after. You know while they are still “late models.” If one is looking for a “classic” I bet it doesn’t matter as much.
Now that the autos are faster than the manuals I don’t think a later model manual will bring more than an auto today or 40 years from now.
Whether one is more desirable is context dependent. What kind of car are we talking about? what is it being used for? In the context of f-bodies when it comes to speed, even in their hey day, the auto's were preferred to manuals in drag racing because they are consistent. Manuals are largely preferred in some contexts because they are "cooler" and "the driver engagement" thing. It was never really about speed, except maybe in road race/autox.
If one is looking for a “classic” I bet it doesn’t matter as much.
Yep. As mentioned above, one need only look at the "old" car world to see this. Of course, there are certain super rare/desirable muscle cars where the manual will still carry significant extra value due to rarity of the example and the bragging rights/collector desirability therein, but when it comes to more general examples of the classics any value spread between manual and auto hasn't grown at all in a very long time. It's so expensive to restore a car, and so few (compared to how many were built) of these dinosaurs remain, that condition is usually far more important than original trans type.
Originally Posted by lees02WS6
In the context of f-bodies when it comes to speed, even in their hey day, the auto's were preferred to manuals in drag racing because they are consistent. Manuals are largely preferred in some contexts because they are "cooler" and "the driver engagement" thing.
I agree here too. Even though I don't spend much time at the track these days, I've always been a drag racer at heart, so my preference has always been for the auto. The "cool" factor might have been important to some of the guys in high school, but I couldn't have cared less about that even when I was young. The "driver engagement" factor is different, it's a personal preference and I can certainly respect that, but I just never got into the whole "clutch operation" thing. Living in the Chicago area (horrible traffic, stop lights every 1/8 mile, and straight flat roads) my entire life, I just never had any fun dealing with the 3rd pedal. On the other hand, shifting can certainly be fun and I do enjoy my ratchet-shifted built TH350, and various MVB setups with the proper stall speed and crisp shifting internals. Although most folks argue that manuals are so much more fun, I would argue that even "fun" is very subjective in this context.
03-01-2024, 01:23 PM
Do Manual cars keep value better or Auto? 
. All automatics now.
Yep. As mentioned above, one need only look at the "old" car world to see this. Of course, there are certain super rare/desirable muscle cars where the manual will still carry significant extra value due to rarity of the example and the bragging rights/collector desirability therein, but when it comes to more general examples of the classics any value spread between manual and auto hasn't grown at all in a very long time. It's so expensive to restore a car, and so few (compared to how many were built) of these dinosaurs remain, that condition is usually far more important than original trans type.