-Freak-

iTrader: (6)

I've heard the term inter mixed with the 3rd and 4th gen camaros.
Are they muscle cars or are they sports cars?

or does it depend?

it starts off as a sports car but as soon as you start modifying it it becomes a muscle car?
or are the only true muscle cars the 60-70's model cars?

i know a couple classic car guys that don't really think anything newer then 1975 is considered muscle.

darrensls1

IMO all F-bodies are muscle cars. Here is my logic:

Sports cars do not have back seats.

Sports cars do not weigh 3500+ lbs.

Sports cars do not have jokes made about them referring to mullets

GET_SOM

imo f-bodies are a bit of both.. they start off as sports cars and then the more you beef em up, the more of a muscle car they become... at least thats how i see it

Vicious.

Have those classic car guys listen to an LS1 with long tubes and true duals and tell you it isn't a muscle car.

nebraskaTA

I consider them modern muscle.

ROCNDAV

iTrader: (100)

+1 yup

BLKWS.6

The F-body is a Pony car. Dang, and its NOT SEMANTICS, you want proof?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pony_car

Give it up, your car falls under a category defined and created by Ford Motor Company.

lunatik

+1, all f bodies are muscle cars. They've used the same damn formula for performance for 35 years. Mid size passenger car, two doors, v8, rear drive. Many sports cars have these features too. Concider the vette. But what is it made to do as compared to the camaro? Thats what make the vette a sports car. Less passenger room, smaller, built more for road handling, yes usually lighter. If anything the camaro has always carried a exterior feature on every year since birth and thats the point made on the upper grill valance. Cant deny the DNA that says all generations are all in the same family. MUSCLE CARS. And no they do dont transit from being a sports car to muscle. They are muscle cars to start and only get more muscled.

y2k_ta

iTrader: (80)

Pontiac said "The Muscle Car Lives"..........end of debate

jpat1023

+1 for modern muscle...

darrensls1

BLKWS.6

pfft, you drive a pony car. Stop with the poser terminology.

y2k_ta

iTrader: (80)

Yeah but you're a Mustang owner balking on a GM-faithful site........go figure.

99camarosupersport

iTrader: (6)

Ok i'll give you that, Guess it just took the camaro and firebird to figure out all the kinks and get the fastest "pony car".

'Trust'

iTrader: (24)

I don't know about the Pony car thing, wikipedia is basically a community website where individuals sumbit an article or write it about a particular subject, some information won't be 100%. I vote muscle car, darrensls1 nailed it!

Doomsday

iTrader: (8)

Muscle cars I think, it dont have no IRS setup, but it will in 2009.

WhiteStripes

iTrader: (1)

Yeah, but ask any old hot rodder that knows his ****. It's not just Wikipedia. Mustangs and Camaros/T/A's are Pony cars.

The Butcher

When it really boils down, it's all matter of opinoin. What makes a muscle car a muscle car? Well lets think here...Mustang=302 v8,and a four cylinder/six cylinder. Ok, Dodge challanger...slant 6/318ci/340ci. Next Camaro/TA available sixes (vary thru the years) and anything from a 301 v8 clear up to 455 Pontiac v8...It seems to me that just about any car that's been called a muscle car has had a smaller, less "cylindered" engine available. So what your telling me, by your Wikipedia definition, is that technically...there never was a muscle car. You think of one, and I'm sure that somewhere along it's bloodline it had that retarded little sister everyone picked on. And as far as what you say WhiteStripes, of course any "old hot rodder" would think that. In all honesty it's like saying, if you ask an asian, honduhs kick chevy's ***! lol any normal person is going to defend what's "theres". IMO a pony car is the smaller, "economy inspired" version, with the larger displacment version being the muscle car...IE a 1988 Mustang with the 2.X liter 4 banger is the pony car making the 1988 5.0 GT/LX the muscled version.

RPM WS6

iTrader: (3)

GM had an entire advertising campaign already mentioned above.... "The Muscle Car Lives" refering to the F-body (specifically the Trans Am, but a V8 F-body is a V8 F-body).


Fact: Sports cars don't have back seats, muscle cars do. (F-body has a back seat).

Fact: Sports cars are small, light weight cars; muscle cars are mid-sized two-doors. (4th gen F-bodies are as long and heavy as most other mid-sized two-door built during their time).

Fact: Muscle cars, traditionally, have a large V8 (4th gen V8 F-bodies have one of the largest V8s offered in any regular production passenger car during their production span).

Fact: GM has refered to the 4th gen F-body as a "Muscle Car".

In the end, a 4th Gen V8 F-body is a modern muscle car.

RPM WS6

iTrader: (3)

Good thinking, I think that's an excellent definition of the difference between a modern Pony car and a modern Muscle car.