Stainless vs. ceramic coated headers
Stainless vs. ceramic coated headers Anybody have opinions of stainless vs. ceramic coated headers? Assume you could have the same header and they were the same cost. This is a question about performance and integrity, not style. Will the stainless keep the heat as well? Will they crack easier? Anybody??
Staging Lane
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 56
Likes: 0
From: Sterling Heights, MI
Re: Stainless vs. ceramic coated headers Who offers stainless headers? Stainless would be awesome. Probably wouldn't do as good with the heat factor though. Structural integrity and longevity would depend on a number of things including gauge of metal and quality of construction and assembly. Quality ingredients are a good start but no good if you slap it together. Craftsmanship is a big part of quality. <img border="0" alt="[burn out]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_burnout.gif" />
Re: Stainless vs. ceramic coated headers By no means a metallurgist, but if I recall correctly SS is more brittle therefore it would be prone to cracking at the temps header are exposed to. Also, the SS if polished or of grade to be, will blue and discolor in little time, especially the way these engine bays are confined and we drive (would look nice until then). As for heat trapping, no, SS will not trap the heat for thermal efficency, under hood temps would rise. I believe SS of the same guage would weigh more than MS? not sure. Not of your question, but I believe SS would have to be a noticebly thicker guage to attempt to match the integrity when used on headers. Most I have seen, on T-buckets and such, are seemingly heavy compared to todays thinner guage MS ceramic coated headers., maybe just design and tube length, dunno.
Charlie.
Charlie.
Launching!
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 254
Likes: 0
From: From Houston, Stationed in Norfolk
Re: Stainless vs. ceramic coated headers i agree about the heat. SS is not so good with absorbing heat, and also sound level from the headers would increase. as stated earlier, by no means a metallurgist.
Re: Stainless vs. ceramic coated headers Thanks for the input guys. There is a reason for the question and I will take all inputs as opinions that are valued until proven or convinced differently. Lets just say a new (at least to this design) but quality company will soon have F-body Stainless Headers to offer in a superior long tube design. You will hear about them (I'm sure) when they are in stock.(2-4 weeks?). It's not my place to let any cats out of the bag.
Re: Stainless vs. ceramic coated headers Can you get them in ceramic coating? If not, I am sure they will not see a lot of movement. It is fact that SS will blue, not guess work there. If you ever see a Harley look at the pipes, the turn blue, and think about the heat applied their engine in comparison to ours and ours has the restricition of no air flow. The ONLY SS headers that dont turn have a double wall construction and this WILL add more unecessary weight. Not trying to start a fued here, but fact has it after Jet Hot and others started offering ceramic coating, the chrome and SS headers of other model car dropped off like your torque numbers on dyno graph after 6000rpms. BTW, I used to have a set of SS headers on a 67 Firebird, on when I bought it, off soon after. Besides, how are you going to be able to appreciate the qualities SS has to offer, one they shouldnt rust, two they should look bright chrome like mirror polish, but tucked in the bay of a 4th Gen, nah. I'll keep an ear out for them, but I dont see anyone making $$$ of them or really wanting them. Good-luck to them.
Teching In
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 33
Likes: 0
From: Long Island, NY
Re: Stainless vs. ceramic coated headers Hey Guys, Here's the scoop on stainless versus ceramic. Ceramic coated headers are better suited for the street especially in areas where rough roads are abundant.Stainless headers aren't as forgiving when having to deal with rough roads. Ceramic headers will definetely keep underhood temperatures lower and as already mentioned, their a bit lighter than S.S. The advantage to stainless are these; they don't require coating (coating them makes them less efficient), they make a bit more power in race applications because they maintain even temperature throughout the header,thus improving scavenging. Lastly, they usually last longer because they don't rust.
We build LS1 headers with caramic coating or stainless. We even build step headers for you high HP guys. Nick "Kook's Headers"
We build LS1 headers with caramic coating or stainless. We even build step headers for you high HP guys. Nick "Kook's Headers"
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Launching!
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 244
Likes: 0
From: Wichita Falls, Texas
Re: Stainless vs. ceramic coated headers When I ordered my QTP's Barry said that if I waited a couple of weeks I could get them in stainless. He said the flow on avg 1% better than coated. Anyway I went with coated for the reasons statted above. He did mention that they are High Grade SS.
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Re: Stainless vs. ceramic coated headers Personally, I don't care if they "blue"..in fact they would match my blue/chrome wheels as if they can even be seen. As far as roguh roads go, we'll have to see...quality of welds and the steel is most important. When it comes to wngine compartment heat...it's still an upgrade from stock manifolds no matter what. Weight...okay, no defense here. I take the less scavaging and "no rusting" and see if they perform. I'll keep you updated after they arrive and are installed. (approx 4 weeks?) The input was great and pointed out facts I had not considered. Thank you. I'm a gamblin' man.
Jas-
Jas-
Re: Stainless vs. ceramic coated headers So because SLp's are SS and Coated, does this make them less quality than the rest? I'm not sure I caught that one? I thought that the SLp's were supposed to be a nice piece. Any word?
Re: Stainless vs. ceramic coated headers Many stainless steels have a lower thermal
conductivity than mild steel. This is a good
thing for headers, where you want to keep the
heat in the case for lower engine compartment
and higher O2 sensor temps.
Stainless steels come in so many different
formulations that it's hard to generalize
about being brittle etc. But most of what
I see out there is 304, "sorta-stainless"
but pretty workable. In the context of tube
weldments subjected to heat cycling, the
most important thing is the welding process,
preheat, postheat control to get the best
weld metallurgy. You can't bank on the
initial material characteristics (even on
mild steel), it's the filler and the heat-
affected zone around the weld that will
likely determine whether the weldment
cracks. Who can say, other than the shop
foreman at the vendor (or their welding
contractor, more likely), whether these
are well-controlled or slap-em-down and
weld-em-up, time-is-money craftsmanship?
Of course, if you don't see any big ovens
or a bunch of bricks and an O/A rig next
to the MIG station, you can bet on #2.
conductivity than mild steel. This is a good
thing for headers, where you want to keep the
heat in the case for lower engine compartment
and higher O2 sensor temps.
Stainless steels come in so many different
formulations that it's hard to generalize
about being brittle etc. But most of what
I see out there is 304, "sorta-stainless"
but pretty workable. In the context of tube
weldments subjected to heat cycling, the
most important thing is the welding process,
preheat, postheat control to get the best
weld metallurgy. You can't bank on the
initial material characteristics (even on
mild steel), it's the filler and the heat-
affected zone around the weld that will
likely determine whether the weldment
cracks. Who can say, other than the shop
foreman at the vendor (or their welding
contractor, more likely), whether these
are well-controlled or slap-em-down and
weld-em-up, time-is-money craftsmanship?
Of course, if you don't see any big ovens
or a bunch of bricks and an O/A rig next
to the MIG station, you can bet on #2.
Re: Stainless vs. ceramic coated headers Your correct about them being 304 Stainless. The only tru test for durability can't be answered until they've been in use for several thousand miles I gather. Thnaks for the input...this has been a good thread and question was well addressed so far.
