gillbot

iTrader: (27)

Not on the set's i've installed. The collectors themselves got scraped after little driving on a stock height car and we had to unbolt the motor mounts and jack the motor around to get them in. After we got them in, we had to beat the primaries in a few spots to make clearance, mostly around the K member. Then there was the horrific fit of the Y pipe that we couldn't even get to mate up to the collectors which resulted in a custom Y being made thus adding to the cost.

My MACs dropped in from the top, all I had to do is remove the coil packs, valve covers and steering linkage. No scrapes anywhere but the U bolt clamp that I didn't trim the bolts off of after I installed it and my car is lowered pretty far.

gillbot

iTrader: (27)

Mids do not use the stock Y pipe, it's totally different and I can assure you with 100% accuracy, MAC headers WILL outflow manifolds with even gutted cats. I have seen the dyno results that prove it.

jpat1023

A little extreme, I know, but you get the point...

jpat1023

Yep. Save money. Do it once, do it right.

gillbot

iTrader: (27)

Your idea of doing it right doesn't mean it is the RIGHT way. I'm perfectly happy with my purchase. By your logic, I did it wrong.

jpat1023

No, b/c when you purchased yours the only other thing was $1300 flp's, I have already said I think you did it right, I wouldn't spend $1300 on headers either. But if you had bought those recently, I would say Yes, you did it wrong.

Pacesetters are like $375, so why not?

AINT SKEERED

iTrader: (2)

I think a lot of you are downing Macs without ever useing them yourself. I bought them wehn all others were over 1000 as well and kind of wish I would not have spent teh money to put the Edelbrocks on. I gained 5 hp from 420 with Macs to 425 with edelbrocks. I did gain alot down below 4000 but I have not went any quicker since adding more power. I now have 441/409 with the ffast 90 int and n/w t.b and have not matched the times I ran with the macs. as for sound , THe edelbrocks do sound better but the macs did not sound bad.

You guy's keep saying that when the headers were 1300 for other brands then it was ok to just spend 900 on the macs. same thing here , pacesetters are 375 macs are 200.
some people still want to save the few dollars.


Any one who wants Macs, tehy are not a bad header and fittment is awsome. the ceramic coating last a long time and the o2's did not give me any trouble. The edelbrocks dont seem to tune out as easy at Idle.

jpat1023

...and you will kick yourself for not getting long tubes.


j/k I'm done.

AINT SKEERED

iTrader: (2)

I see with your mods , the long tubes must have just made a world of difference

jpat1023

Yeah, cuz that's what we're talkin about right, my car? Or maybe it was macs vs. pacesetters...hmm...

gillbot

iTrader: (27)

PREACH IT!

That's the most aggrivating part about the whole MAC/LT debate. Most are just passing on rumors.

Because I'd still rather save the $175 or more over LTs. If I had ZERO headers right now, I'd still buy MACs because they are cheaper, fit better and they make good enough power. My car is not perfect, noones car here is. There is always SOMETHING on everyones car here though could be better for a few more $. I don't have the $ or desire to go through and correct every little flaw in my setup.

THe only header I am contemplating purchasing right now are the ebay ones for the sole reason that they are stainless. If there was a company that could reproduce the MAC header in stainless for the same price, I'd be ALL over them in a second.

When I build my large cube motor, I may switch then. Heck, I may run it with the MACs then with LT's just to see how huge of a difference it really makes. As it stands right now though, 98% or more of the people I personally know that switched from MACs to LT's regrets the switch for a few reasons:
1) Small gain of about 5hp
2) COST
3) ground clearance issues with LTs
4) installation headaches
5) crappy y pipes

Most say that if they could do it over, they would have stuck with the MACs but they were suckered in by all the misinformation of those who say MACs suck though they never had a set or even tried them.

ChocoTaco369

who cares? again, on a stock car, you're still looking at a 5-10 hp gain with longtubes over macs. that equates to a 20%-50% power loss by getting macs. i don't give a **** how much power you made, you could have made more. you threw down 399 rwhp. realize if you had longtubes, you'd be deep into the 400's. when you can get pacesetters for $375, macs are a mistake. you say you hate "mac headers haters", but the haters are completely justified. they're an inferior header. mac haters are just fine hating on them, whereas you only support macs because you spent your money on it and you are trying to justify the money spent in your mind. yes, macs are capable of making great power, but so are stock manifolds. you can throw down 500rwhp on stock manifolds if you try hard enough. of course, throw on longtubes and you're putting down 550+rwhp. the point is, they're second rate. there is no point to get them. end of story. would you buy shorties if you got them for $150, even though the gains are next to nothing? a mistake is a mistake, whether you spend $50 on it or $500 on it. some mistakes are just bigger than others.

possibly the biggest bullshit argument you have is the cost of macs. you're comparing the price of used, rusted out mac headers to brand new pacesetters. i love your tainted logic.

http://thunderracing.com/catalog/?ac...&vid=3&pcid=52

mac headers and a catted y are $730.

http://www.texas-speed.com/shop/item...id=181&catid=8

pacesetter longtubes and a catted y are $700.

macs are MORE EXPENSIVE than pacesetter longtubes, stop comparing brand new pacesetters to shitty used mac headers.

so let's get this straight. you're going to pay MORE MONEY for an inferior header? yea, go mac. what a waste of money and what a poor argument. if you're going to compare used mac headers to pacesetters, you have to compare them to used pacesetters. if you can get macs for $200, you can get pacesetters for around the same price. the only difference is you can get macs more easily. do you know why? people don't want them because they're a bottleneck to their exhaust system and a waste of money.

also known as power loss of 20%. pay more money for a 20% loss of power? where do i sign up? stop trying to justify your purchase. that's all this is about - you justifying the money you spent in your own mind. stop trying to convince someone else into wasting the money. if you're happy with the header, that's fine and dandy, but don't try to drag someone else into spending more money to lose power.

lastcall190

iTrader: (36)

Wow... I wouldn't say it was a mistake to buy them, people have different goals in mind, maybe he really DOESNT like the ground clearance issues, or the other issues he listed. His purchase, let him do what he wants... and I don't think, for the record, he'd be "deep" into the 400s with LTs. 400+, yes... I think if someone wants to buy shorties or mids, let 'em. There's plenty of info here where a sensible person can make what is to them, an "INFORMED" decision. Whether we all agree, well...

Btw my gas needle is moving slower choco

-J

ChocoTaco369

what's setting me off is he's saying macs are $200. he's comparing someone's used, several year old rusted mac headers to brand new pacesetters. his argument is based on complete spin and he's lying right in front of everyone. if he's going to compared used mac headers, he has to compare them to used pacesetters, roughly the same price. of course, if he wants to compare new pacesetters, he has to compare them to new macs - which are MORE MONEY. i just hate seeing this spin. it's like politics in here.

good, glad to hear it. seafoam FTW!

lastcall190

iTrader: (36)

Fair enough, I don't venture over to SSU anymore because I can find plenty of entertainment value in these sections

That's still a badass number you put down for that cam through those wimpy mids don't blow a gasket I'm just kidding

-J

EDIT: HAHAHAHA nice sig

Z284U2TRY

iTrader: (5)

I bought my macs many years ago there was not a big variety of headers. I also purchased both y pipes so I can switch cats on and off for inspections. If I could do it over again now sure I would go with a long tube since there are so many now. But the macs are staying on the car until they rust out.

jpat1023

Glad to see you could take over while I was gone, looks like you got the point across as well.

GregWS6&z28

iTrader: (8)

my macs were cheap, $280 shipped for everything 2 years ago. but they get the job done. I may get some pacesetters or XS Stainless whenever the time comes.

gillbot

iTrader: (27)

Do you think that throwing expletives into your statement will make me listen to you more? Once again, I'll restate the FACTS so you can clear up your misconceptions.

There it is.... I compared them to ANY LT header available. Everyone else kept saying that pacesetters were $375. I simply stated SHOW me where you can reliably find ANY set of LT's used or new for the same price as USED MACs and i'd retract my statement.

EDIT> Now that i've reread some of the posts, YOU were the one that claimed pacesetters were only $175 more so you need to look in the mirror and clear up YOUR OWN "circle of lies" about the header pricing.

There is is. Man that is sweet. Apparently by you claiming that pacesetters only cost $175 more than MACs, that means that I am putting an unfair spin and "lying" to everyone? Interesting, your false statements mean that I am a liar. I'm going to have to use that one someday and see how well it goes over.

And for the record, your pricing on MAC headers is quite a bit off. About 5 YEARS ago I bought my MACs BRAND NEW here on LS1Tech from a sponsor for under $500 shipped. They can still be purchased on ebay WITH Y pipe for under $500 shipped NEW. If my memory serves, MOST LT headers alone are about $300 plus shipping, then you have to buy a Y pipe and hope it fits.

I'm not going to even bother to pick apart the rest of your "tainted logic" since you obviously refuse to listen. If someone has $200 to spend and they want macs and are willing to sacrifice 5-10hp for it, have at it. Not my car so I really don't care if they get shorties. I will simply tell them that macs are FINE and YES, LT's will make a little more but they can buy whatever they want. I won't call them a moron or dumbass like others in this thread have because they care to save a few $ .

Spoken like a man who truly understands and can LISTEN to reason.

ChocoTaco369

hell yes and damn right. i'm from jersey.

you're wrong. you can get used pacesetters for roughly that price for sure. pacesetters are $375 BRAND NEW. seeing as how headers sell for roughly 50% of their value used, that's slightly under $200, but i'll even up the price to make you look good to $200. even if pacesetters are $50 more than macs, they are still a BETTER DEAL as you get full horsepower out of them that increases exponentially with more mods. either way, macs lose.


oh brother again, some people don't want rusted out, underperforming mac headers. even at $200 they are a ripoff as pacesetters can be had for half their value used.

here's a good link:
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...ght=pacesetter

a guy sold pacesetters BRAND NEW, never installed with all hardware and gaskets for $295. so let's see, what's the better deal? underperforming, rusted mac headers for $200 or brand new pacesetters and all required hardware that give 20%-50% more horsepower over macs for $95 more? it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know pacesetters are the better deal.


what in the hell are you talking about? apparently you need to read a little better, because i claimed BRAND NEW pacesetters are only $175 more than USED, RUSTED OUT MACS. again, comprehension is your friend


did you graduate 8th grade? not only are NEW PACESETTERS CHEAPER THAN NEW MACS, NEW PACESETTERS ARE ONLY $175 MORE THAN RUSTED, USED MACS. get it now? or do i need to explain it a third time?

you can get a lot of things off ebay for cheaper. what's your point?

http://thunderracing.com/catalog/?ac...&vid=3&pcid=52
mac headers and catted y: $729.99
mac headers and ORY: $529.99

http://www.texas-speed.com/shop/cate...?MID=1&catid=8
pacesetter headers and catted y: $700
pacesetter headers and ORY: $500

there you have it, macs are more expensive than pacesetters brand new no matter how you look at it. this makes you wrong - in ALL areas. but why stop now? you've been lying this entire post.



i think i need to clarify this statement for the readers. the reason why you won't "even bother to pick apart the rest of my tainted logic" is because you can't. you can't pick apart facts, so instead of coming up with more lies, you'll just act like you're too busy to do it. it's okay that you lost the argument, it happens. we can't always convince the general public, but as long as it's okay in your own mind that you made a good purchase, that's all that matters. just don't try to drag other people into the same thing when they can get a better header for the same or even less money.


thanks for this compliment. that's what i'm here for