Need help on choosing right cam.
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From: Smith Mills, Kentucky
Need help on choosing right cam. Ok my mods are in my sig, only the bolt-ons are on the car... I was wondering if someone with my future set-up could help me out or just you alls input.
Im wanting to go for a good lope, but maintain an average amount of drivability. Will a MS3 cam be OK? If so, then what LSA and why. If not what would be good to mate with my 4k stall and reasons.
All input will be appreciated! The time is getting close for me to buy a cam and I want to get the best one that suits my car.
Thx,
Aaron
Im wanting to go for a good lope, but maintain an average amount of drivability. Will a MS3 cam be OK? If so, then what LSA and why. If not what would be good to mate with my 4k stall and reasons.
All input will be appreciated! The time is getting close for me to buy a cam and I want to get the best one that suits my car.
Thx,
Aaron
Well, if you already have a stall to support a bigger cam you can pretty much pick from the majority of cams out there already. I have always been a custom grind person myself. I tend to like a nitrous split over an N/A. First of all, do you want a lopey car or do you want a fast car that just happens to lope at the same time? Don't get a cam based on lope. LSA will have little to do with it, although it is a tiny part of the equation. If you give me a cam spec I can tell you what kind of lope its going to have just based on the math.
Also, even though you have a 4k stall you still have a stock bottom end. You don't want to push your limits on the PTV are too much. IF you ever got a good amount of valve float with a MS3/4 you may still have contact issues.
I would call up comp and tell them what you plan on doing and what you want in your cam and get a custom grind. There are some proven shelf grinds out there that are great.
Also, even though you have a 4k stall you still have a stock bottom end. You don't want to push your limits on the PTV are too much. IF you ever got a good amount of valve float with a MS3/4 you may still have contact issues.
I would call up comp and tell them what you plan on doing and what you want in your cam and get a custom grind. There are some proven shelf grinds out there that are great.
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On The Tree
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A lot of me is wanting the sound... Mostly because I know its gonna be fast in my eyes because of going from bolt-ons to 4k stall, LS6 Intake, and cam swap all at once. So, no im not looking for the highest power gains, but I do expect good ones.
The car is going to see mostly street use, which doesnt mean Im going to be puttin around either, and with a few trips to the track of course to see what it runs after all this...
Id like to hear some cam recommendations also. And hopefully someone with a similar setup can give me info, and pros and cons.. With real world experience of having the setup.
The car is going to see mostly street use, which doesnt mean Im going to be puttin around either, and with a few trips to the track of course to see what it runs after all this...
Id like to hear some cam recommendations also. And hopefully someone with a similar setup can give me info, and pros and cons.. With real world experience of having the setup.
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It is all about overlap, and finding the 'sweet spot' you are desiring.
For example, currently the cam I have has 10 degrees of overlap. I would consider the sound moderately aggressive. Through the GMMG exhaust and headers with cats..it will get your attention.
But, for your current mods I might suggest cams with ~ 6 degrees of overlap. About a year ago I started a thread of what is the 'sweet spot' of overlap. I.E., how much is required for ample power and sound, but is not to difficult to tune. The experts centered on ~ 6 degrees of overlap.
For example..A 224/224 112 +2 Cam has 0 degrees of overlap. a 228/228 112+2 has 4 degrees of overlap. A 228/230 112+ has 5 degrees of overlap. Someone can check my math..that is what I came up with..
So, I might not go bigger than the examples above. Matching it with your stall..might need some other cam experts to comment. There are some neat software programs (free) that you can utilize to find various cam specs and overlap amounts. Some are available in the stickies, or in previous threads on this forum.
Hey, good luck in any case. Thought I would at least give you some suggestions to look at.
Let us know how it goes.
..WeathermanShawn..
For example, currently the cam I have has 10 degrees of overlap. I would consider the sound moderately aggressive. Through the GMMG exhaust and headers with cats..it will get your attention.
But, for your current mods I might suggest cams with ~ 6 degrees of overlap. About a year ago I started a thread of what is the 'sweet spot' of overlap. I.E., how much is required for ample power and sound, but is not to difficult to tune. The experts centered on ~ 6 degrees of overlap.
For example..A 224/224 112 +2 Cam has 0 degrees of overlap. a 228/228 112+2 has 4 degrees of overlap. A 228/230 112+ has 5 degrees of overlap. Someone can check my math..that is what I came up with..
So, I might not go bigger than the examples above. Matching it with your stall..might need some other cam experts to comment. There are some neat software programs (free) that you can utilize to find various cam specs and overlap amounts. Some are available in the stickies, or in previous threads on this forum.
Hey, good luck in any case. Thought I would at least give you some suggestions to look at.
Let us know how it goes.
..WeathermanShawn..
Well, I have had small, medium, and large cams on a semi-similar setup to you minus heads and jackin with the MAF.
The more valve overlap you have the more lope you are gonna get. My 244/248 had 16° of overlap and my truck only has -4° on that 221/226. They both lope pretty hard, but the 16° was VERY inconsistent. Your MS3 would probably sound about the same. I have an idle clip somewhere. https://ls1tech.com/forums/staff-veh...peels-99s.html
That MS3 on a 112 separation has 15.5° on it. on 113 it has 13.5° and the 114 has 11.5°.
The more valve overlap you have the more lope you are gonna get. My 244/248 had 16° of overlap and my truck only has -4° on that 221/226. They both lope pretty hard, but the 16° was VERY inconsistent. Your MS3 would probably sound about the same. I have an idle clip somewhere. https://ls1tech.com/forums/staff-veh...peels-99s.html
That MS3 on a 112 separation has 15.5° on it. on 113 it has 13.5° and the 114 has 11.5°.
You're right. You can just look at those grinds without taking out a calculator if you are good with math in your head and tell what the overlap is gonna be. Its the wide splits with the uneven numbers that give that 0.5° that you can't eyeball usually.
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Thread Starter
On The Tree
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From: Smith Mills, Kentucky
Ok first off... I'm a little new to this. I know how a cam works and all, but I don't understand what any of the above means because I just straight up don't know lol.
Is there a less complicated way to suggest a cam. Like a cam kit from Comp, TSP, etc... Or if I have no choice but to go with a custom grind, custom grind is most likely out of my budget. Thanks guys for the help! I'm goin to sleep though and will post later.
Is there a less complicated way to suggest a cam. Like a cam kit from Comp, TSP, etc... Or if I have no choice but to go with a custom grind, custom grind is most likely out of my budget. Thanks guys for the help! I'm goin to sleep though and will post later.
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Verdad Gallardo TECH Enthusiast
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From: Denver International Airport, Colorado USA
Ok first off... I'm a little new to this. I know how a cam works and all, but I don't understand what any of the above means because I just straight up don't know lol.
Is there a less complicated way to suggest a cam. Like a cam kit from Comp, TSP, etc... Or if I have no choice but to go with a custom grind, custom grind is most likely out of my budget. Thanks guys for the help! I'm goin to sleep though and will post later.
Is there a less complicated way to suggest a cam. Like a cam kit from Comp, TSP, etc... Or if I have no choice but to go with a custom grind, custom grind is most likely out of my budget. Thanks guys for the help! I'm goin to sleep though and will post later.
You can always call any of the Sponsors that regularly post on this board. I know Texas Speed has done some extensive engine testing on various cams. Perhaps they can give you some suggestions, along with other forums members.
I think you can find the right cam. So, again..Good Luck!
..WeathermanShawn..
Here is a secret (well not really). A custom grind costs the same amount.
Most people don't know that.
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On The Tree
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How about this maybe..? Are there any boundaries to suggest me not go over.. To go higher or not higher than .600 lift, and a certain LSA.. That's kinda what I'm trying to figure out. Yet, I see all this other important info I'm tryn to understand which is difficult.
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Pewter:
If I read your mods correctly, you will be utilizing the LS6 manifold, correct?
If that is the case, in all reality you just need a cam that does not exceed an IVC of ~42-46 degrees. Probably closer to ~42 degrees to maximize power under the curve. You also do not need to exceed ~6 degrees of overlap.
Really no need to exceed .600 lift on your cam profile.
How about a 228/232 112 +2 LSA. That gives you an overlap of 6 degrees, and you could probably rev it up to 6400-6600 Rpm's. Any bigger, and you will just be over-camming (IMO).
I am a novice cam student..not an expert. You could always PM Predator-Z or Patrick G. They may be busy, but they are some of the best on this forum.
Keep reading. You have to do a lot of homework to successfully talk about cams and valve events..You are getting there though.
So, those are my suggestions for your current mods...
Later..
..WeathermanShawn..
If I read your mods correctly, you will be utilizing the LS6 manifold, correct?
If that is the case, in all reality you just need a cam that does not exceed an IVC of ~42-46 degrees. Probably closer to ~42 degrees to maximize power under the curve. You also do not need to exceed ~6 degrees of overlap.
Really no need to exceed .600 lift on your cam profile.
How about a 228/232 112 +2 LSA. That gives you an overlap of 6 degrees, and you could probably rev it up to 6400-6600 Rpm's. Any bigger, and you will just be over-camming (IMO).
I am a novice cam student..not an expert. You could always PM Predator-Z or Patrick G. They may be busy, but they are some of the best on this forum.
Keep reading. You have to do a lot of homework to successfully talk about cams and valve events..You are getting there though.
So, those are my suggestions for your current mods...
Later..
..WeathermanShawn..
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From: Working in the shop 24/7
Pewter, I suggest you take a look into the Torquer 2.
Specs: 232/234 .595/.598 112,113, or 114 LSA. The 112 will bring the power in more down low than the 114. I run this cam and with a good tune she has great street manners and a nice lopey idle. In my 99 M6 daily driver, I made 401 / 389 through midlengths, ls6 intake, lid, pulley, and cutout. My y pipe is only 2.5", so if I were to switch to LT's and port my tb, Id approach 410-415+ in a cam only car with stock heads. Using my car (despite being M6) should give you an example of what the T2 can produce powerwise and heres an idle clip.
T2 through a Corsa:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAr6H...eature=related
The others suggestions of custom cams are a good idea as well. Hope this helps
Specs: 232/234 .595/.598 112,113, or 114 LSA. The 112 will bring the power in more down low than the 114. I run this cam and with a good tune she has great street manners and a nice lopey idle. In my 99 M6 daily driver, I made 401 / 389 through midlengths, ls6 intake, lid, pulley, and cutout. My y pipe is only 2.5", so if I were to switch to LT's and port my tb, Id approach 410-415+ in a cam only car with stock heads. Using my car (despite being M6) should give you an example of what the T2 can produce powerwise and heres an idle clip.
T2 through a Corsa:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAr6H...eature=related
The others suggestions of custom cams are a good idea as well. Hope this helps
A Futral FMS-F11-112, or if you want to push the power range up more a FMS-F14-112 both of these would also be good options.
And BTW, a custom grind doesn't cost that much more.
You can also just give Geoff at EPS a call and have him do a custom grind.
And BTW, a custom grind doesn't cost that much more.
You can also just give Geoff at EPS a call and have him do a custom grind.
Last edited by 99Bluz28; Jan 21, 2010 at 12:33 PM.
Comp Cams XER 224/230 .581/.588 114 is what I ran in my 3800 stalled Z. Great middle of the road cam. Granted that was a nitrous converter which would flash around 3k, but this is similar to the one that Shawn mentioned earlier as well.
Anything will "work" for the most part. Mark and Patrick are great people to ask. I learned quite a bit from Mark (Pred-Z) over some late night threads about cams that I was not aware of.
You will love what you end up with most likely anyway, but key to drivability will be 80% in your tune.
Anything will "work" for the most part. Mark and Patrick are great people to ask. I learned quite a bit from Mark (Pred-Z) over some late night threads about cams that I was not aware of.
You will love what you end up with most likely anyway, but key to drivability will be 80% in your tune.
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On The Tree
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From: Smith Mills, Kentucky
Comp Cams XER 224/230 .581/.588 114 is what I ran in my 3800 stalled Z. Great middle of the road cam. Granted that was a nitrous converter which would flash around 3k, but this is similar to the one that Shawn mentioned earlier as well.
Anything will "work" for the most part. Mark and Patrick are great people to ask. I learned quite a bit from Mark (Pred-Z) over some late night threads about cams that I was not aware of.
You will love what you end up with most likely anyway, but key to drivability will be 80% in your tune.
Anything will "work" for the most part. Mark and Patrick are great people to ask. I learned quite a bit from Mark (Pred-Z) over some late night threads about cams that I was not aware of.
You will love what you end up with most likely anyway, but key to drivability will be 80% in your tune.
Aaron
It would work. The MS3 makes great power. Driveability issues that may arise might include bucking at lower RPM (like if you are cruising at 1500), surging, and rough cold starts. You will need a good tuner with a cam that size for a daily driver. You can smooth out the idle some with a 114 but will have to spin to a higher RPM to make the power. The MS3 can be difficult to tune. Hope this helps.