TR230 in a 6.0 LQ9
09-07-2010, 09:11 AM
#1
TR230 in a 6.0 LQ9 Just a quick question for you cam guys, I am currently running a Lunati grind 228/232 590 .590 112 cam in my LQ9 with 317 heads milled .020 and a M6. The cam pulls really hard after 3500-4k RPM's but I am looking for something that has a little more low end tq and have read good things on the TR230. I am looking to stay under .600 lift because I am running PAC springs and really dont want to have to change them and the car is my DD. I really think I can get alot more out of this 6.0.
09-07-2010, 09:24 AM
#2
The TR230 was formulated to work well with the LS1 intake back when we had very few intake options. There are better options for your motor IMO. The TR230 is a good cam, but wrong for that application.
I'm not sure how a 228/232 in a 6.0L couldn't make all the TQ you wanted down low, unless it's just lack of compression causing the soggy feeling.. With 317's milled .020 on an LQ9 you're barely eclipsing 10.5:1 compression.
Your sig said you're working on doing your own tuning. Do you have a file to post? It could be an issue with your tune. That setup shouldn't have any problems blowing your skirt up below 4K IMO.
I'm not sure how a 228/232 in a 6.0L couldn't make all the TQ you wanted down low, unless it's just lack of compression causing the soggy feeling.. With 317's milled .020 on an LQ9 you're barely eclipsing 10.5:1 compression.
Your sig said you're working on doing your own tuning. Do you have a file to post? It could be an issue with your tune. That setup shouldn't have any problems blowing your skirt up below 4K IMO.
09-07-2010, 09:46 AM
#3
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I would also stay away from the TR230 for that application. You wouldn't want a reverse split cam with a BBK SSi intake. The cam you have now should be perfect for what you want. It should be acting like a 223/227 cam in a LS1 compared to the 6.0L so it shouldn't be giving up any low end for more peak hp.
09-07-2010, 10:01 AM
#4
Damian, thanks for the reply. I milled the heads. 020 so I could get the compression to 10.5:1 and was worried about going any higher but looking back I could have done more. I guess I am asking the questions now because I am really thinking of selling it because I am just not all that happywith the performance LOL. Tune I am sure is hosed up but it starts and runs fine most of the time and I have wot set around 13.1. I have done the tune and being a novice makes me wonder how much I am leaving on the table with the tune but I wouldn't think more than 10-15 HP but I may be wrong. I can and will post a tune when I get off work and maybe you or someone can glance at it and see anything terrible in it, I have thought about selling my HP tuners and just let someone tune it for me but you just never know what they are going to do to the tune and I am worried about getting a copy and paste tune for 300.00. I thought I did enough research when I built the engine the first time and I was hoping for a lot more than I have but either I have a bad combo of parts or it is just all I am gonna get out of it. Friend has a ls6 98 camaro with long tubes, all bolt on and a Crane 224 .555 lift Cam that put down 395/385 on a dynojet and I can hang with him, so I figure I am in the 400 HP range and the preswap HP/TQ.when I was an automatic was 335/365. Guess I should go find a synopsis and see where I am.
09-07-2010, 10:16 AM
#5
It's good that you milled the heads cause stock compression on the LQ9 is low, it's just unfortunately that it takes a LOT of milling to get any kind of compression out of them.
There is a LOT more to tuning than just setting the A/F to 13.0 and calling it a day. A novice tuner can definitely leave a ton on the table for the potential of a good setup. Post your tune file when you get a chance.
There is a LOT more to tuning than just setting the A/F to 13.0 and calling it a day. A novice tuner can definitely leave a ton on the table for the potential of a good setup. Post your tune file when you get a chance.
09-07-2010, 10:34 AM
#6
I did work on the maf and ve tables but again I am learning and I know they probably are not even close. I had a supposed friend that owned a local speed shop tune it for me a long time ago and he says don't do this and that but it is completely opposite of what HP tuners web site and the guys on there post. That where I got lost and gave up. That site is just like this one where half of the posts conflict with the other half! I will post a tune as soon as I get home, again thanks for the reply's guys because I am sure you know what its like to get so frustrated you wanna give up on it. Hell I have thought about buying a Hyundai to drive around, LOL.
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09-07-2010, 11:47 AM
#8
That is what I have read about the LS1, 6.0's can handle a little morte cam and be fine. I had a crane 224 .550 114 cam in my ls1 and figured it would be too small, I did a ton of research just trying to figure out what I need to do now for some low end grunt!
09-07-2010, 01:34 PM
#13
You should have more bottom with that cam in a 6.0. We did a 5.3 with a TFS 228/230 112 .588, so very similar basic cam specs, 10.5 comp and it starts to pull hard at 3500.
You should really consider more compression, guys here are using upwards of 11:1 with 91 and a good tune. It will help out the bottom a lot, and gas mileage will get better (slightly). I'm thinking theres a lot of work (and power) left in your tune as well. Engines don't care exactly what # afr they have, they just want the one that works. And its not linear all the way across either. Most want a bit more fuel around peak torque, while peak hp will want something slightly leaner than pk torque.
You should really consider more compression, guys here are using upwards of 11:1 with 91 and a good tune. It will help out the bottom a lot, and gas mileage will get better (slightly). I'm thinking theres a lot of work (and power) left in your tune as well. Engines don't care exactly what # afr they have, they just want the one that works. And its not linear all the way across either. Most want a bit more fuel around peak torque, while peak hp will want something slightly leaner than pk torque.
09-07-2010, 01:58 PM
#15
I may be wrong but going from a 228/230 to a 230/227 doesnt seem like it will net me much of a gain if any because they are so close to each other. I do have the BBK and a 85mm TB so I didnt think I needed a reverse split cam at the time I built the engine, my basic understanding of the reverse split was if you lacked on the intake side the lsa should be bigger and the other way around. I saw a guy selling the TR230 and was thinking if my intake can handle more flow why not give it more and the 317 heads flow pretty good I may pick up some low end. I just need to post my tune and go from there, hopefully its pretty fked up and I can get more out of it there! I am sure it is though,I have thought about 243 heads to build the compression up and get a smaller chamber, I fought for two weeks if I should mill the heads and keep them or go with some better ones but at the time I was maxed out on the amout of money the wife would let me spend 
. Either way I am a mechanic and so all the work so labor is not an issue its just I dont know how to pick a damn combo!
. Either way I am a mechanic and so all the work so labor is not an issue its just I dont know how to pick a damn combo!
09-07-2010, 02:09 PM
#16
I may be wrong but going from a 228/230 to a 230/227 doesnt seem like it will net me much of a gain if any because they are so close to each other. I do have the BBK and a 85mm TB so I didnt think I needed a reverse split cam at the time I built the engine, my basic understanding of the reverse split was if you lacked on the intake side the lsa should be bigger and the other way around. I saw a guy selling the TR230 and was thinking if my intake can handle more flow why not give it more and the 317 heads flow pretty good I may pick up some low end. I just need to post my tune and go from there, hopefully its pretty fked up and I can get more out of it there! I am sure it is though,I have thought about 243 heads to build the compression up and get a smaller chamber, I fought for two weeks if I should mill the heads and keep them or go with some better ones but at the time I was maxed out on the amout of money the wife would let me spend . Either way I am a mechanic and so all the work so labor is not an issue its just I dont know how to pick a damn combo!
. Either way I am a mechanic and so all the work so labor is not an issue its just I dont know how to pick a damn combo!
09-07-2010, 02:40 PM
#17
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http://www.texas-speed.com/shop/item...=1067&catid=44
^^^thats how you make torque in an M6. That and 4.10s or higher. Also, LTs take away torque. Consider (hear me out) the Hedman Tork-Step header. Its a 1 5/8 primary that steps to 1 3/4 into a 3 inch collector. The midrange on these is insane. I swapped to a full 1 3/4 header and I felt a huge drop in mid-range torque and throttle response.
For 3-4k+ and up power: LTs, big exhaust (3 inch+), LS6/FAST intake, 224+ cam
For torque: Mid length or Hedman Tork-step headers, smaller exhaust pipes (2 1/2), 220 or smaller cam, ls1/truck intake.
^^^thats how you make torque in an M6. That and 4.10s or higher. Also, LTs take away torque. Consider (hear me out) the Hedman Tork-Step header. Its a 1 5/8 primary that steps to 1 3/4 into a 3 inch collector. The midrange on these is insane. I swapped to a full 1 3/4 header and I felt a huge drop in mid-range torque and throttle response.
For 3-4k+ and up power: LTs, big exhaust (3 inch+), LS6/FAST intake, 224+ cam
For torque: Mid length or Hedman Tork-step headers, smaller exhaust pipes (2 1/2), 220 or smaller cam, ls1/truck intake.
Last edited by 01ssreda4; 09-07-2010 at 02:47 PM.
09-07-2010, 05:49 PM
#18
http://www.texas-speed.com/shop/item...=1067&catid=44
^^^thats how you make torque in an M6. That and 4.10s or higher. Also, LTs take away torque. Consider (hear me out) the Hedman Tork-Step header. Its a 1 5/8 primary that steps to 1 3/4 into a 3 inch collector. The midrange on these is insane. I swapped to a full 1 3/4 header and I felt a huge drop in mid-range torque and throttle response.
For 3-4k+ and up power: LTs, big exhaust (3 inch+), LS6/FAST intake, 224+ cam
For torque: Mid length or Hedman Tork-step headers, smaller exhaust pipes (2 1/2), 220 or smaller cam, ls1/truck intake.
^^^thats how you make torque in an M6. That and 4.10s or higher. Also, LTs take away torque. Consider (hear me out) the Hedman Tork-Step header. Its a 1 5/8 primary that steps to 1 3/4 into a 3 inch collector. The midrange on these is insane. I swapped to a full 1 3/4 header and I felt a huge drop in mid-range torque and throttle response.
For 3-4k+ and up power: LTs, big exhaust (3 inch+), LS6/FAST intake, 224+ cam
For torque: Mid length or Hedman Tork-step headers, smaller exhaust pipes (2 1/2), 220 or smaller cam, ls1/truck intake.
Here Is my current Tune
09-07-2010, 06:14 PM
#19
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What you aren't getting is simply this: you don't get torque and hp too. You get one or the other or a blend of the two. Now adding compression has been suggested but to me that's the more expensive route, as is more cubes and stroking the motor. ALL the things I listed WILL increase torque at the expense of HP. Dude thats just the way it goes. I dont make the rules, I just play by them. The advice around here is hp, hp, hp. Thats why you're car has no ***** down low and would get stomped by a stalled A4 with less motor and less hp.
Last edited by 01ssreda4; 09-07-2010 at 08:49 PM.
