Short duration, Tight LSA Cams
TECH Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 14,620
Likes: 17
From: BFE
Maybe; but you'll be changing springs every 15-25K (224 fast ramp rate)
You'll never reach the peak of the cam, unless you rev to 6800. (Over the LS1 specs for the "ROD BOLTS")
(216/220) peaks at 6100>6300, is capable of 400 rwhp and a little more
Did I forget loves N2O??
You'll never reach the peak of the cam, unless you rev to 6800. (Over the LS1 specs for the "ROD BOLTS")
(216/220) peaks at 6100>6300, is capable of 400 rwhp and a little more
Did I forget loves N2O??
Originally Posted by PREDATOR-Z
Maybe; but you'll be changing springs every 15-25K (224 fast ramp rate)
You'll never reach the peak of the cam, unless you rev to 6800. (Over the LS1 specs for the "ROD BOLTS")
(216/220) peaks at 6100>6300, is capable of 400 rwhp and a little more
Did I forget loves N2O??
You'll never reach the peak of the cam, unless you rev to 6800. (Over the LS1 specs for the "ROD BOLTS")
(216/220) peaks at 6100>6300, is capable of 400 rwhp and a little more
Did I forget loves N2O??
I got the TR 224/112. I cruise at 1100 rpms all the time with no bucking. doesn't do at 1000 either. I have a 6500 rev limiter. I couldn't see the point in putting in a small cam like your looking at. My cam has just about %0 drivability issues. A TR224/114 would have to be no issues.
If you look at a HP graph for the TR224 114, you will see that it's pretty flat from 6,100 up to 6,800 rpm. So basicaly, it has peaked by 6100 rpm or so but you have useable rpm from about 1,100 rpm all the way up to about 6,800 rpm. That's a pretty wide rpm range.
I had a cam that was way to big long ago (270/270 in a SBC,) so I was going to get a 218/218 .563 cam for my 2001 SS, but I'm glad I didn't. When you have a cam with short duration and a lot of lift, that makes more valvetrain noise and is harder on springs. Anyway, you small cam guys can use whatever you like, I was just trying to save you the trouble of having to upgrade your cam twice.
I had a cam that was way to big long ago (270/270 in a SBC,) so I was going to get a 218/218 .563 cam for my 2001 SS, but I'm glad I didn't. When you have a cam with short duration and a lot of lift, that makes more valvetrain noise and is harder on springs. Anyway, you small cam guys can use whatever you like, I was just trying to save you the trouble of having to upgrade your cam twice.
Originally Posted by PREDATOR-Z
XE-R lazy???
You are right, we can't agree on anything! LOL
Originally Posted by PREDATOR-Z
Question (because I'm puzzled)
Does it say on the cam card what lobes it has?? If so where?
216/220 is XR269HR-14 part # 54-414-11
Does it say on the cam card what lobes it has?? If so where?
216/220 is XR269HR-14 part # 54-414-11
Last edited by Cal; May 16, 2004 at 10:47 AM.
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Verdad Gallardo TECH Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 14,620
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From: BFE
I get it thanks for the info. (MyLS1Hauls). I stand corrected Sir (on the XER bit) and the 224 does make more power, but at a higher price (On Valvetrain). With 1.8 or 1.85 rockers, the 216/220 makes prety good power.(ie: 400rwhp)
I didnt mean that the off the shelf 216/220 cam was a bad choice, its just not the most recent technology. You're right, for a guy that wants a cam in his high miler daily driver, it would be great...as you'd put in some LS6 springs and never have to worry about it again...My point was just that if you're going to go through the trouble of a cam swap, get a "good" one. I've now had 3 cams, and am actually pretty satisfied...The thing about adding 1.85 rocker arms to a slow lobed cam is that you actually increase the duration, lift, and effective ramp rate, so you might as well just use stock rocker arms and order an XE or XE-R cam and call it a day...of course this is just my opinion. Higher ratio rocker arms are also harder on already stressed lifters.
Originally Posted by PREDATOR-Z
I get it thanks for the info. (MyLS1Hauls). I stand corrected Sir (on the XER bit) and the 224 does make more power, but at a higher price (On Valvetrain). With 1.8 or 1.85 rockers, the 216/220 makes prety good power.(ie: 400rwhp)
TECH Addict
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,620
Likes: 0
From: Central, MA
That's very interesting (good) to hear that the TR224 112 can pull cleanly from 1K. I never realized that.
I think my problem, is I don't have much desire shifting any higher than 6,000. I'm looking for a cam with a lot of meat in the midrange............
If I'm hearing you guys right though, even something like a TR224 will make as much, if not more power down low (from like 2K to 4K for example), even than smaller cams?
One other thing. Can anyone explain the huge torque way down low, in the following link? Is that the 2800 stall in the car? "Shirley" that's not just the cam, is it?
That's like diesel-torque.
I think my problem, is I don't have much desire shifting any higher than 6,000. I'm looking for a cam with a lot of meat in the midrange............
If I'm hearing you guys right though, even something like a TR224 will make as much, if not more power down low (from like 2K to 4K for example), even than smaller cams?
One other thing. Can anyone explain the huge torque way down low, in the following link? Is that the 2800 stall in the car? "Shirley" that's not just the cam, is it?
Originally Posted by mrr23
test 5 is swapping to the 047 cam http://www.vincihighperformance.com/...T%20GRAPH.HTML
Last edited by marc_w; May 17, 2004 at 08:17 AM.
Interesting replies & good info gentlemen. To relate 224 cam performance with M6 transmission to A4/stock stall performance is hard for me. You M6 guys have hi-stall converters in your left-foot! LOL Plus you have way tighter gear spacing than the A4. But ALL of your comments are respected and well taken. Thank you.
Mr. Vinci, ready to "CONVINCI" me on one of your cams?
Mr. Vinci, ready to "CONVINCI" me on one of your cams?
TECH Addict
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,620
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From: Central, MA
Another one for Joe (when he gets back)...
What kind of spring change interval would you recommend for your car cams?
I'm a little nervous about spring life, because I seem to manage to drive about 30K a year... and a good four of those months don't provide me with good spring changing weather under the tree in the backyard.
What kind of spring change interval would you recommend for your car cams?
I'm a little nervous about spring life, because I seem to manage to drive about 30K a year... and a good four of those months don't provide me with good spring changing weather under the tree in the backyard.
Originally Posted by marc_w
What kind of spring change interval would you recommend for your car cams?
I'm in the same boat these days
Also, anyone have any sound clips of these two or know where I could find them? I'd like to know how "Powerful, Choppy Idle" sounds
TECH Addict
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,620
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From: Central, MA
A few more:
Joe - On this page... It starts off explaining your accelerated lift rockers. It then mentions the cams, and it says that these cams we're all looking at are designed to take advantage of your rockers.
Do we need to run your rockers to take full advantage of your cams? Would there be any side effects if we don't? (lack of power down low, lazier looking/acting lobes, etc.)
Also, I see a lot of your ads are Crane ads. The specs of some of your cams look to be Crane lobes... Does Crane grind your cams?
Consensus in the truck forum is, off the shelf Crane cams/lobes don't seem to work so hot in trucks due to lazy lobes and lack of torque where trucks need it... down low and midrange. (this is all hearsay to me, I have no first hand experience.) Most truck guys prefer the Comp Cams stuff.
I'm not sure why, but Crane also don't seem so popular on the car side either. If Crane does do your grinding, are your new cam profiles designed to overcome the above issue, without the use of special rockers?
Joe - On this page... It starts off explaining your accelerated lift rockers. It then mentions the cams, and it says that these cams we're all looking at are designed to take advantage of your rockers.
Do we need to run your rockers to take full advantage of your cams? Would there be any side effects if we don't? (lack of power down low, lazier looking/acting lobes, etc.)
Also, I see a lot of your ads are Crane ads. The specs of some of your cams look to be Crane lobes... Does Crane grind your cams?
Consensus in the truck forum is, off the shelf Crane cams/lobes don't seem to work so hot in trucks due to lazy lobes and lack of torque where trucks need it... down low and midrange. (this is all hearsay to me, I have no first hand experience.) Most truck guys prefer the Comp Cams stuff.
I'm not sure why, but Crane also don't seem so popular on the car side either. If Crane does do your grinding, are your new cam profiles designed to overcome the above issue, without the use of special rockers?
TECH Addict
Joined: Oct 2003
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From: Central, MA
Originally Posted by marc_w
Also, I see a lot of your ads are Crane ads. The specs of some of your cams look to be Crane lobes... Does Crane grind your cams?
I just got around to *reading* the ads, and Crane mentions your a customer of theirs.
TECH Enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 531
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From: Helendale, Ca (SilverLakes)
My 216/220 idles pretty smooth at 750 RPM's. Good for a Daily Driver and would probably work with the stock TC. On mostly level ground with AC off; I got 29mpg.
However, if I had it to do again; I would have gone with the Comp LS6 Street Replacement Cam 212/218 .550 114 lsa (?) might be a 116lsa. which does not require any tuning.
However, if I had it to do again; I would have gone with the Comp LS6 Street Replacement Cam 212/218 .550 114 lsa (?) might be a 116lsa. which does not require any tuning.
Last edited by highgear; May 17, 2004 at 04:29 PM. Reason: LSA ????
Banned
Joined: Mar 2003
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From: L.I. NY
Do the headers first and see how she runs. It'll take a few days for the computer to learn the new mod. Should put you in the 12.4-12.5 range, maybe quicker you you get the car tuned. There's at least one guy, Jersey_Ta, on this board that's gone 12.0s bolt-on with the stock converter. PM him and see if he can shed some light on your goals.
I don't know what you guys in Hawaii pay for Nitrous, but I think that's your best bet. A 50 dry shot should get you where you want to be and the bottle will last a long time.
I don't know what you guys in Hawaii pay for Nitrous, but I think that's your best bet. A 50 dry shot should get you where you want to be and the bottle will last a long time.