Cam degreeing question. Cam is off.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 55
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Cam degreeing question. Cam is off. Hey guys! I'm degreeing my cam and I have the SNS stage 2. It has a 110+3 and after measuring I'm getting a 104. How do I fix this with my adjustable timing set? Do I just add +6 in timing?
Thanks for all the help in advance.
Thanks for all the help in advance.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 55
Likes: 0
I bought the ls comp degree kit and after finding TDC on piston 1 I lined up the dial indicator to the piston 1 intake lifter with the heads off and measured the degrees .05 from max lift both ways and after adding them together and dividing them my 2 I got 104. I'm not sure if that helps answer your question. I'm sorry if it doesn't. :/
How did you find TDC? Did you use a piston stop?
It sounds like you're trying to find your intake centerline. This has nothing to do with your LSA, which is the 110+3 number you listed. The ICL should be listed on your cam card.
When I measure for ICL I usually measure at several points. Starting at .030 before and after peak lift, then go to .050, then usually somewhere around .070.
Remember that ICL is usually just theoretical. Oftentimes cam lobes are asymmetrical so when you see .070 on the closing side it could be a few degrees past what you saw on the opening side.
It sounds like you're trying to find your intake centerline. This has nothing to do with your LSA, which is the 110+3 number you listed. The ICL should be listed on your cam card.
When I measure for ICL I usually measure at several points. Starting at .030 before and after peak lift, then go to .050, then usually somewhere around .070.
Remember that ICL is usually just theoretical. Oftentimes cam lobes are asymmetrical so when you see .070 on the closing side it could be a few degrees past what you saw on the opening side.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 55
Likes: 0
How did you find TDC? Did you use a piston stop?
It sounds like you're trying to find your intake centerline. This has nothing to do with your LSA, which is the 110+3 number you listed. The ICL should be listed on your cam card.
When I measure for ICL I usually measure at several points. Starting at .030 before and after peak lift, then go to .050, then usually somewhere around .070.
Remember that ICL is usually just theoretical. Oftentimes cam lobes are asymmetrical so when you see .070 on the closing side it could be a few degrees past what you saw on the opening side.
It sounds like you're trying to find your intake centerline. This has nothing to do with your LSA, which is the 110+3 number you listed. The ICL should be listed on your cam card.
When I measure for ICL I usually measure at several points. Starting at .030 before and after peak lift, then go to .050, then usually somewhere around .070.
Remember that ICL is usually just theoretical. Oftentimes cam lobes are asymmetrical so when you see .070 on the closing side it could be a few degrees past what you saw on the opening side.
You can't degree your cam correctly using a dial indicator. There's about 4 degrees of dwell time where the piston is at TDC while the crank is still rotating. Use a piston stop to find true TDC. They're pretty cheap.
I would see if you can get the cam card for your cam. I'm assuming since you don't have one you bought it used?
I would see if you can get the cam card for your cam. I'm assuming since you don't have one you bought it used?
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I use a deck bridge with a dial indicator to find TDC. I find TDC the same way as lobe centerline; I note the degree at a certain value before and after TDC but then set the pointer to split the difference.
For example, if I see the piston is .050" in the hole on the way up at 10 degrees BTDC and again on the way down at 2 degrees ATDC, I'll set the pointer to 6 degrees ATDC when it's .050" on the way down.
For example, if I see the piston is .050" in the hole on the way up at 10 degrees BTDC and again on the way down at 2 degrees ATDC, I'll set the pointer to 6 degrees ATDC when it's .050" on the way down.
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I used KCS method when I did mine.
OP asked a question - If I'm getting 104 and should be at 107, do I just add three degrees?
Answer (for the sake of argument, assume OP numbers are perfect) -- No. When you see +3 on the timing set, that advances the cam, so your 104 would go to a 101. You'd want to go -3 to retard the cam to get from 104 to 107.
Side bar -- I'm not a fan of the "adjustable" timing sets. I much prefer the multi-keyed sets, which allow you to set the timing by clocking the crank pulley. These don't slip. But that's probably more of a personal preference.
FWIW to Happy Salesman's point: Most of Tick's shelf cams were designed by Martin Smallwood, and he definitely uses assymetrical lobes. In a perfect world, 110+3 is telling you that the LSA is 110, ICL is 107 (The +3 means advanced 3 degrees), and the ECL is 113. Also, though, I thought tick switched from comp to cam motion for their grinds. If your cam is a cam motion grind, then the cam should have come with a cam Dr report. If it did, you should be able to install it straight up, since the cam was verified on a different machine after it was ground.
OP asked a question - If I'm getting 104 and should be at 107, do I just add three degrees?
Answer (for the sake of argument, assume OP numbers are perfect) -- No. When you see +3 on the timing set, that advances the cam, so your 104 would go to a 101. You'd want to go -3 to retard the cam to get from 104 to 107.
Side bar -- I'm not a fan of the "adjustable" timing sets. I much prefer the multi-keyed sets, which allow you to set the timing by clocking the crank pulley. These don't slip. But that's probably more of a personal preference.
FWIW to Happy Salesman's point: Most of Tick's shelf cams were designed by Martin Smallwood, and he definitely uses assymetrical lobes. In a perfect world, 110+3 is telling you that the LSA is 110, ICL is 107 (The +3 means advanced 3 degrees), and the ECL is 113. Also, though, I thought tick switched from comp to cam motion for their grinds. If your cam is a cam motion grind, then the cam should have come with a cam Dr report. If it did, you should be able to install it straight up, since the cam was verified on a different machine after it was ground.
Staging Lane
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 52
Likes: 0
From: central ky
I actually just ordered this exact cam a couple weeks ago, havent had the chance to put it in yet though. But they are a cam motion grind cam. I could post a copy of my cam dr report if you would find it useful
