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Old Dec 28, 2017 | 07:16 PM
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Default One piston super clean

Pulled by heads because I was pushing coolant under boost... Found #7 piston to be almost perfectly clean, some slight carbon/discoloration, while all of the others had various levels of carbon buildup... Some of the buildup could be explained because my turbo scavenge pump wiring had an issue and my pump turned off and i got oil in my intake... But why is 7 so clean? Plugs were almost brand new as i changed them a few months before which cleared up a rough idle/miss under boost issue.

Thoughts?

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Old Dec 28, 2017 | 07:19 PM
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You’ve had water/coolant in the cylinder. Have you noticed a loss of coolant under regular driving conditions?
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Old Dec 28, 2017 | 07:27 PM
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I pressure tested the radiator, only to 15 psi, and didn't have any leak down but i was definitely pushing coolant under boost. It was pushing it out of the overflow bottle.
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Old Dec 28, 2017 | 07:41 PM
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Yep water. Seen it too many times to count. Figure out your pushing coolant issue, check your surfaces (block and head) stick it back together and you'll be golden. There's probably a 99% chance or better that whatever was causing the water push is also what caused the water in that cylinder. So when you fix one you'll likely fix both.
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Old Dec 28, 2017 | 08:01 PM
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Originally Posted by 00pooterSS
Yep water. Seen it too many times to count. Figure out your pushing coolant issue, check your surfaces (block and head) stick it back together and you'll be golden. There's probably a 99% chance or better that whatever was causing the water push is also what caused the water in that cylinder. So when you fix one you'll likely fix both.
Agree 100%. Can you post up a close up pic of that head gasket, particularly that cylinder? Both sides if you can.
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Old Dec 28, 2017 | 09:18 PM
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I was running copper gaskets with orings in the heads... I'm 99% of scraping that setup and moving towards LS9 MLS.



Head side. cylinder is on the left. big issue on the 2nd from the right



Block side, far right

Last edited by MonochromeSS; Dec 29, 2017 at 03:26 PM.
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Old Dec 28, 2017 | 09:46 PM
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How did you loosen the stud nuts
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Old Dec 28, 2017 | 09:59 PM
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Originally Posted by A.R. Shale Targa
How did you loosen the stud nuts
I assume you mean pattern? more or less inside out.
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Old Dec 28, 2017 | 10:16 PM
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Originally Posted by MonochromeSS
I assume you mean pattern? more or less inside out.
Did you use a ratchet/breaker bar ?? By hand ?? Or impact ?
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Old Dec 28, 2017 | 10:17 PM
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Originally Posted by A.R. Shale Targa
Did you use a ratchet/breaker bar ?? By hand ?? Or impact ?
Oh. 1/2" Breaker bar until they were loose enough to get with the 3/8 rachet. Why do you ask?
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Old Dec 28, 2017 | 11:42 PM
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I used to work at a speed shop that did failure analysis testing for Fel Pro
I NEVER use impacts to disassemble an engine. You need to “feel” consistency in the loosening process to understand what’s going on
Reverse torquing after intentional over heating is something we measured to report the gasket distortion characteristics.
I always pull torque bolts/studs up in four sequences
Twice through the initial 45. Then 55,65 etc. or 50,60,70. So the stepping up process is both equal and consistent
I do agree that the soft copper should be upgraded to MLS style where the outer layers can grab their respective surfaces and move around under boost. However you may need a fresh AND specific RA finish to be effective. Do your research and coordinate with your machinist
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Old Dec 29, 2017 | 12:04 AM
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Originally Posted by A.R. Shale Targa
I used to work at a speed shop that did failure analysis testing for Fel Pro
I NEVER use impacts to disassemble an engine. You need to “feel” consistency in the loosening process to understand what’s going on
Reverse torquing after intentional over heating is something we measured to report the gasket distortion characteristics.
I always pull torque bolts/studs up in four sequences
Twice through the initial 45. Then 55,65 etc. or 50,60,70. So the stepping up process is both equal and consistent
I do agree that the soft copper should be upgraded to MLS style where the outer layers can grab their respective surfaces and move around under boost. However you may need a fresh AND specific RA finish to be effective. Do your research and coordinate with your machinist
I'm gonna have the heads checked out just to make sure everything is kosher... the block is an iron truck block that doesn't have a lot of miles on it and it was machined before it was put in the car. I don't know the exact Ra but the visual / fingernail check says its less than the 50Ra required for MLS gaskets.
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Old Dec 29, 2017 | 09:51 AM
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Were you using any kind of water injection system?
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Old Dec 29, 2017 | 11:41 AM
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To me this looks like the issue. The way that the copper appears to have discolored makes be believe it saw combustion gases and it goes around both water jacket passageways. But accoring to your description thats not the correct side? Is it possible that the picture is upside down and this is between 5 and 7?
Attached Thumbnails One piston super clean-gasket.png  
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Old Dec 29, 2017 | 01:07 PM
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Default Stud Tech

Hi SS, yes we had the same problems with the Ford's cars that ran in France.
The first engines used copper gaskets that would leak water until the engine came up to temperature.
The cause, determined by FORD Engineering, was the fact that the Iron block/AL head growth caused the Gasket to "squeeze" Extrude itself.

The solution was the "undercut" the studs with agreement from Mike Costin (Cosworth).

I have no idea WHY ARP will make a correct stud (undercut) for many engines and NOT FOR the LSx engine ?

Lance
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Old Dec 29, 2017 | 03:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Mart00SS
To me this looks like the issue. The way that the copper appears to have discolored makes be believe it saw combustion gases and it goes around both water jacket passageways. But accoring to your description thats not the correct side? Is it possible that the picture is upside down and this is between 5 and 7?
Nope... you're right that is the area between 5&7 on the head side. i marked it wrong. 5 was probably blowing into 7. Fixed the original post.
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Old Dec 29, 2017 | 03:41 PM
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Originally Posted by RockinWs6
Were you using any kind of water injection system?
Yeah, antifreeze. Injection and ejection.
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Old Dec 29, 2017 | 03:49 PM
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Originally Posted by 00pooterSS
Yeah, antifreeze. Injection and ejection.
LOL! AND it's fully automatic!
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