Car has 19,000 miles on it can I safely use the stock timing set or do I need to upgrade to the double unit? Cam will be the TSP 225. Thanks

 

Pick up a Cloyes (sp?) single roller that uses the stock gears.

 

I personally think the stock unit is a POS. I changed mine at 25K and it was LOOSE! I installed a double roller and 25K miles later when I pulled the engine the chain was still as tight as the day I installed it.

 

Your stock timing set would be fine. Your car is fairly new. But if you have the extra cash.. Getting a double set would be nice..

So to answer your question...

It's not required, but it would be nice. Adds some time to cam swap also..

 

Thanks, I'll pay the xtra $$$ for the double unit.

 

About how much time does it add?

 

an hour......two if your slow......

you need to pull the motor mount bolts (one on each side) and jack the engine up by the bell housing so you can let the oil pan come down (does not need to come off). Then you can slip the oil pump (chain is behing the pump) out of the way and the change your chain.

 

Thanks for everyones input.

 

good choice

 

I just did a cam and put on the Rollmaster double timing chain ($91 from TSP). The stock chain was extremely loose and the new one was very tight. Made installing it kind of tough, but I finally got the cam gear to go on and get it dot to dot.

Now taking the oil pump on and off is another issue. Probably cost me more like 3 hours! I didn't raise the engine, even though that's not a bad idea, but probably not necessary. I loosened all the pan bolts without taking them out. I removed the two larger horizontal bolts in the back in order to get the pan to drop about 1/2". Now the trick I got from this forum was to get some lockwire pliers. I loosened the small bolt holding on the oil pump pickup tube and wrapped some lockwire under the head. Used the pliers to twist it down to hold the bolt. Now you can fully remove it with a 10mm gearwrench without worrying about losing the bolt down the oil pan. Best thing is you can just leave the bolt and lockwire on the lockwire pliers and use it to hold it in place when going back together. Just undo the lockwire after you get the bolt started and pull the lockwire out before you tighten it all the way down.

This all worked great, except I had a heck of a time getting the o-ring to fit into the pump. I bought a new blue o-ring from GM and lubed it up. First time I put it together didn't take long, but about 30 minutes later after I tightened the pan back down I noticed the part of the blue o-ring hanging out the front. So I came back down and tried it again. Thought I had it this time, but I didn't have a mirror to look behind the pump. I bought a mirror from Autozone and felt sick when I looked behind the pump and some of the blue o-ring was sticking out there. Good news is that I did not ruin the o-ring and after fiddling with it some more finally got all of it to fit into the pump. I felt like the cross section of the o-ring was proper, but the overall diameter was too large. If you had to stretch it a little to get on the tube it would fit better into the pump. Sure felt good when I fired it up and had a solid 40 psi at idle. In fact, the old o-ring that I assume was installed at the factory was cut and I now have better oil pressure than before.

Anyway, good luck,
Glenn

 

When you guys have this trouble with the pickup tube and "O" ring after installing the double chain you can just take the pump cover off and remove the DRIVE and DRIVEN gears. Now installing the "O" ring and pickup tube are a lot easier because you can wriggle the pump body around quite a bit to get everything together and start a few threads of the flange bolt. You put the gears and cover back as well as the pump shims and don't put the one on the output port side in upside down. This takes a little more work because the pump cover has 10 bolts, but it sure makes getting the "O" ring in properly and fitting the leading edge of the pickup tube into the input port of the pump a whole lot easier. This is a small price to pay because most people seem to have trouble with the "O" ring, but don't figure it out until they turn the key.

 

It also helps to put the O-ring on the end of the tube first then slide it into the pump. This way the ring is already stretched and you do not run the risk of cutting it.

Brad

 

Go buy an adjustable single so you can degree your cam but stay away from the doubles. I have a rollmaster and its over kill and a pain in the ***. Plus, if you decide on running a smaller harmonic balancer you will have to modify it for it to work. Plus you don't have to mess with the o-ring in the oil pump which is a PITA. Hell, if you don't plan on degreeing the cam use the stock one and save the money.

 

I decided to keep the stock one since my mileage is so low. If it is in poor shape I'll change it, otherwise I'll leave it in this go around. I'm not changing the timing of the cam, it's going in straight up, .to. you could say, so no need for an adjustable right now either, thanks everyone.

 

The dual setups are a PITA, especially if you have an ASP crank pulley. Some need to machine it, some dont. I've only seen 2-3 broken stock timing chains and two were caused by harmonics from a Whisper pulley. Brand new GM timing sets are loose...think about how much easier it is to mass assemble the engine if the timing set is loose. Just because its loose doesnt mean its worn out. When I replace mine, I'm just going to get an adjustable single...either the Cloyes or the Comp, which are the same thing.

 

With that many miles, I wouldn't worry. I will make cam install much easier. Loose stock is normal. BTW Le Mans C5R runs a stock chain. That part about the chain breaking fo nothing is overhyped. Also 01-01 had better chains.
If i have to change mine, I will go single roller or just J-wis.

 

I run the GM heavy duty Timing chain and the GM dampner which bolts to the block.

 

I went with the JWIS single chain and just kept the stock gears. It's a bit of a pain to drop the pan to get the oil pump off, but you don't have to jack up the motor or anything. There's no clearance issues with the crank pulley either. I degreed my cam in too, and just used an offset bushing to get it set up where I wanted it.

 

Now that I see that JWIS brand posted that is the brand of mine. I don't think there is any difference between it and the Cloyes though. I remember reading that on the side of the links.

 

Word, I used a Rollmaster Double and It's not that bad putting in. The only thing is you'll need a 3 jaw puller to get the stock crank gear off. Make sure you put the new gear on in THE EXACT SAME POSITION AS THE STOCKER! I didn't and when I went to compress the #1 spring the stem dropped! Dicked!