, if you want max effort wait for the 225's. 
Largest Cam with AFR?
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Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 307
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From: Palmetto, GA
Largest Cam with AFR? Anyone know around the specs of the largest cam I could throw on some AFR 205's?
I am looking to go with an all out cam package.. hoping to make good numbers but I was wondering what the largest cam for the AFR 205's would be? I was hoping for something much larger then a 224....
Keeping stock "internals" as pistons and such.. just want a real nice head and cam package.. if I can't go with something nice and large I am just going to go all out cam only on the stock heads...
I am looking to go with an all out cam package.. hoping to make good numbers but I was wondering what the largest cam for the AFR 205's would be? I was hoping for something much larger then a 224....
Keeping stock "internals" as pistons and such.. just want a real nice head and cam package.. if I can't go with something nice and large I am just going to go all out cam only on the stock heads...
TECH Junkie
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,726
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From: Fort Collins, CO
A big cam won't benefit you very much if you're using a stock bottom end. A big cam on these 346ci motors means turning a lot of RPM (7000+) and the stock shortblock simply isn't capable of that kind of abuse. Now, if you want to build a stock CI motor that is capable of turning a lot of RPM, a big cam might be warranted.
Picking an effective heads/cam package is a lot like give and take. The nicer the cylinder heads, the small the matching camshaft will be. Your motor only needs so much air per cylinder, which in turn means that for any given RPM and corresponding cylinder head flow through an intake manifold, one and only one camshaft will provide optimum power. Optimum power depends on your application, of course.
Picking an effective heads/cam package is a lot like give and take. The nicer the cylinder heads, the small the matching camshaft will be. Your motor only needs so much air per cylinder, which in turn means that for any given RPM and corresponding cylinder head flow through an intake manifold, one and only one camshaft will provide optimum power. Optimum power depends on your application, of course.
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TECH Junkie
Joined: May 2003
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From: its fucking cold
Originally Posted by jrp
ya thats what i meant, typing and checking out this chick patty's *** at work dont go hand in hand
that really made no sense...
6600 rpm clutch dump of death Administrator
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 4,983
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From: Texas
Originally Posted by ThackerSS
Anyone know around the specs of the largest cam I could throw on some AFR 205's?
I am looking to go with an all out cam package.. hoping to make good numbers but I was wondering what the largest cam for the AFR 205's would be? I was hoping for something much larger then a 224....
Keeping stock "internals" as pistons and such.. just want a real nice head and cam package.. if I can't go with something nice and large I am just going to go all out cam only on the stock heads...
I am looking to go with an all out cam package.. hoping to make good numbers but I was wondering what the largest cam for the AFR 205's would be? I was hoping for something much larger then a 224....
Keeping stock "internals" as pistons and such.. just want a real nice head and cam package.. if I can't go with something nice and large I am just going to go all out cam only on the stock heads...
Look at the CFM discussion thread where we talk about how much duration you need for X RPM vs the head flow.
Synopsis: Bigger isn't always better... Smarter is...
Launching!
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 200
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From: Gainesville, Florida
I emailed Tony @ AFR with my very detailed requirements for a H/C package, and he responded with a detailed solution 
You might want to do the same. I didn't get a very detailed response (if I got one at all) from the other vendors I emailed...
Remember you need to consider the car's gearing, that and the redline will determine the RPM range where need to have the most power.
The thread J-Rod is talking about is here:
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...&highlight=CFM
I notice he mentions that less duration would be needed with smaller runners. Maybe thats why Tony recommended a 220/224 110 LSA cam for me? I basically need power from 4000-6400. A low (or no) maintenance street and road course application.
PS: Does excess lift hurt velocity?
You might want to do the same. I didn't get a very detailed response (if I got one at all) from the other vendors I emailed...Remember you need to consider the car's gearing, that and the redline will determine the RPM range where need to have the most power.
The thread J-Rod is talking about is here:
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...&highlight=CFM
I notice he mentions that less duration would be needed with smaller runners. Maybe thats why Tony recommended a 220/224 110 LSA cam for me? I basically need power from 4000-6400. A low (or no) maintenance street and road course application.
PS: Does excess lift hurt velocity?
All you guys and your theories, I am getting a headache. I would say the trend has been bigger cams produce better times in the ls1 so far. You can't really over cam this motor without cutting the pistons it seems based on the 15 degree valve angle. I believe thunder racings philosophy was just put the biggest cam you can fit in there without having to flycutt the pistons and see what happens. What happened, realy fast quarter times and really high dyno numbers. I would try a T-Rexed sized cam with the 225s and see what happens.
It is all in the combination though. You must have at least 4.11 gears to run this setup effectively at the track and all supporting boltons. Even if the power band is still to high for the stock shortblock it is still smashing the smaller cams in the 4500 to 6500 range where all stock shortblocks are capable of spinning and even higher and this is where we race, not 1500 to 3500 rpm. Just my honest opinion.
It is all in the combination though. You must have at least 4.11 gears to run this setup effectively at the track and all supporting boltons. Even if the power band is still to high for the stock shortblock it is still smashing the smaller cams in the 4500 to 6500 range where all stock shortblocks are capable of spinning and even higher and this is where we race, not 1500 to 3500 rpm. Just my honest opinion.
On The Tree
Joined: Jul 2004
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Originally Posted by DAPSUPRSLO
All you guys and your theories, I am getting a headache. I would say the trend has been bigger cams produce better times in the ls1 so far. You can't really over cam this motor without cutting the pistons it seems based on the 15 degree valve angle. I believe thunder racings philosophy was just put the biggest cam you can fit in there without having to flycutt the pistons and see what happens. What happened, realy fast quarter times and really high dyno numbers. I would try a T-Rexed sized cam with the 225s and see what happens.
It is all in the combination though. You must have at least 4.11 gears to run this setup effectively at the track and all supporting boltons. Even if the power band is still to high for the stock shortblock it is still smashing the smaller cams in the 4500 to 6500 range where all stock shortblocks are capable of spinning and even higher and this is where we race, not 1500 to 3500 rpm. Just my honest opinion.
It is all in the combination though. You must have at least 4.11 gears to run this setup effectively at the track and all supporting boltons. Even if the power band is still to high for the stock shortblock it is still smashing the smaller cams in the 4500 to 6500 range where all stock shortblocks are capable of spinning and even higher and this is where we race, not 1500 to 3500 rpm. Just my honest opinion.
Then why is it a friend of mine made 410rwhp/390ftlbs with a 222/226 cam only, spec'd based on VE's, when there are others making the same with those "bigger is better" cams AND heads
.Edit: BTW the IAT's were 91 deg, I know because I was sitting in the car monitering the vitals during the dyno runs......
Last edited by -=Merlin=-; Sep 6, 2004 at 08:55 PM.
He will be running FMS ported AFRs... not exactly equivalent to a 205cc AFR head. The answer is.. depends on how much the heads are milled, and the exact specs of the cam. I wouldn't worry about it, if Allan couldn't match up combos, he wouldn't have some of the highest dynoing cars on the board.
Peace,
Josh
The answer is.. depends on how much the heads are milled, and the exact specs of the cam. I wouldn't worry about it, if Allan couldn't match up combos, he wouldn't have some of the highest dynoing cars on the board.Peace,
Josh
Originally Posted by -=Merlin=-
Theories huh?
Then why is it a friend of mine made 410rwhp/390ftlbs with a 222/226 cam only, spec'd based on VE's, when there are others making the same with those "bigger is better" cams AND heads .
Edit: BTW the IAT's were 91 deg, I know because I was sitting in the car monitering the vitals during the dyno runs......
Then why is it a friend of mine made 410rwhp/390ftlbs with a 222/226 cam only, spec'd based on VE's, when there are others making the same with those "bigger is better" cams AND heads
.Edit: BTW the IAT's were 91 deg, I know because I was sitting in the car monitering the vitals during the dyno runs......
You might have a more efficient cam if you wan't to call efficient a ratio of driveability to power but you are leaving some on the table as far as all out power.