lowchevy2go

iTrader: (4)

Well i finished my MS3 install and added patriot duals, rollmaster double roller,tsp ported pump, comp OEM lifters, hardened pushrods.

my problem is that i will be driving down the road and my car with just out of no where start ticking super loud. I have put like 200 miles on the car so far and it has done it like 4 times and only lasts about 20 sec. I believe my lifters keep loosing prime. Is this a normal problem with these lifters. I soaked them in oil for a week before putting in car so i know they had to have been ok.

GuitsBoy

iTrader: (4)

Does anything happen to the oil pressure?

lowchevy2go

iTrader: (4)

no. it runs at 20 lbs at idle. and 40 and above while driving(hot). When ever it starts tapping i just let off the gas and let it idle for a minute and it goes away.

GuitsBoy

iTrader: (4)

That seems pretty low. For instance, Ive got 45 hot idle, and 60 cruise. Did you change the pump? Perhaps a pinched O ring is letting air in the system?

ddnspider

iTrader: (26)

ur oil pressure is WAY too low,mine is ~40-45psi at idle and 60psi driving

SUX2BU

iTrader: (14)

Sounds like your lifters are starving for oil. has your oil pressure always been that low?
What size push rods?
might get a pushrod checker to see if maybe the replacement lifters aren't shorter, thus needing a longer pushrod. it happenned to a car i worked on.

lowchevy2go

iTrader: (4)

ya its a tsp ported ls6 pump. i have checked the o-ring twice. Im tired of freakin dropin the damn oil pan to check it all out. lol I am using 7.4 pushrods. ya they are a little more sewing machine sounding than some 7.425's but they work for now. All the cam bearings are good, everything checks out fine. I did the lifter tray drill mod. I only did 3/8 holes and i did them kinda high so some oil would stay in the trays . All lifters were properly installed also.

could my pre-load be low and a lifter be spinning around?

eallanboggs

iTrader: (1)

This in not normal. The lifters can not spin around. The plastic retaners make sure of that. If a lifter did rotate you would experience catastrophic engine failure as the roller or cam lobe or both would get ground flat. The roller could fall out of the lifter or the lifter might drop out the the retainer and the pushrod would follow it. All kinds of bad stuff could happen, but that's not your problem. If you're using OEM rockers the preload is non-adjustable. You sound like you know enough to get the rockers set right from your description. I like Rs myself. They're in both my motors I did the head, cam, lifters, p rods, pump, double chain, etc. mod on. No ticking on either motor. Well there was for a couple of minutes after the key is turned for the first time after the rebuild, but that soon goes away.

PREDATOR-Z

1- Your pressure is too low
2- The trays should only be drilled in race applications. You want more oil in the tray at idle and in traffic situations.

1QUIKWS6

iTrader: (61)

The problem lies with the oil pressure issue. A stock 'idiot gage' style oil warning light comes on @ 10 lbs - you're at 20 lbs at idle - way too low.

I have a ported/polished/coated LS6 pump with an external oil cooler and my pressures are at 65-70lbs cruise/wot and 45lbs idle - both hot.

Since your OP is so low, the lifters (which are hydraulic and use engine oil pressure to maintain their 'pump up') are essentially acting as if they are collapsed which will give you the noise due to too much valvetrain slop.

The PR's have nothing to do with how much oil is making it to the lifters - the lifters pick up oil from the oil gallery passages thru the lifter body, pressurize the internal parts of the lifter to give you the hydraulic action, feed out of lifter up thru PR's, and then out onto the rocker arms. While it is true that PR's that are too long will help to collapse the lifter - the OP issue is what you need to look into.

Now why your OP is so low is another question? Was it this low before you did these mods? If not, and everything else being equal, I would say the pump is suspect. Could be the pump is faulty in the pressure relief valve. The aftermarket pumps are usually either shimmed or have a stiffer spring to effectiviely raise your OP by not allowing the excess pressure to bleed off until the system reaches a higher than stock pressure. I would concentrate your efforts into checking out the pump - since you already state you have checked the o-ring and it is OK. It is a very slight chance that the pick-up is almost totally blocked also (but not likely).

BTW, I agree with PredatorZ - I would have not drilled the trays for a street application. So many of these little 'tricks' that are posted, and everyone wants to run out and do, are not a particularly good idea for a daily street driven car - kinda like the MAF descreen mod - only good for eaking out every leetle scrap of HP in a mostly race car - not a good idea on the street and you'll never notice any difference.

Sometimes you just have to know when to leave well enough alone...

-Jay-

blacktransam

iTrader: (13)

they run those same lifters in LT1 cars with far less pressure.. that isn't the problem especially if its tapping while driving and stops at idle when the pressure drops.. sounds to me like you have a bad sender and your pumping up..

1QUIKWS6

iTrader: (61)

Well, he really didn't say whether the noise was at idle or while cruising - I guess some of us just 'assumed' that it was at idle due to the low oil pressure.

At any rate, 20lbs OP at idle for an LS1 is not good.

Are you saying than an LT1 has an idle, or cruise OP lower than the numbers he cited??????

ddnspider

iTrader: (26)

i was always under the assumption that it would tick at idle when pressures was lower,than go away while driving because the lifters would have time to pump up with oil,so no more ticking

Arcolog2

iTrader: (1)

Here is some more info to help....

I ALSO have the same sounding problem but my oil pressure is always 40 at idle and about 60 driving.

YOu can start the car and it will be fine. Wait for it and eventually a ticking will start and get really loud and then slowly dwindle back to normal after a little while. I have the old man cam from Thunder Racing. The lift is .600 on the intake side. I think the issue lies within the lifters, with higher lifts the factory lifters supposedly don't hold up well.

This problem started in the driver's side head and only sounded like one cyl. Then it started to also happen in the passenger side, I still have the problem but I am planning on tossing in the Comp R lifters.

Any further insight on this subject would be greatly appreciated.

Dave

777

iTrader: (21)

I have the same exact pump as you and I have 40-45psi warm idle 60psi cruise. Somethings wrong with your engine or pump. Even if it's not the cause of your tapping issues. I would address that.

Arcolog2

iTrader: (1)

Yes I would solve your oiling issues to begin with, or find out of the gauge is not reading properly.

I have the proper oil pressures and have the noise, so we have to figure that part out too, my best assumption is the lifters, I plan on swapping out soon, so If I do I'll let ya know

Doc

iTrader: (9)

Flame suit on. Ok guys, I have a 98 also and have done similar mods recently and have replied in another thread similar to this one. https://ls1tech.com/forums/generation-iii-internal-engine/492433-knocking-after-cam-install-advise-please.html
Basically, I believe his oil pressure Indication of 20 psi at warm idle is nothing to get all rilled up about on a 98 car that gets the reading directly from the sensor-not the data bus as on newer Fbodies. Not unlike the reason why GM went with the idiot data bus temp gages too many old skewl peeps freak at the indications of these 98 gages.

As I said tho, with similar mods and similar tribulations I ended up with 7.350 hardened pushrods and spark table adjustments eliminating the metallic tapping noises that occured with some sustained 2500k rpm driving. Not necessarily high (5-6k) or anything like that-just over 2500 for a few minutes and bingo-tapping. Now that I have the problem resolved, I can flash the old (stock) timing tables back in the car and viola-more tapping.

This is not by no means an answer for the what seems like myriad of Tapping threads I have seen lately but, it did solve my problem.

Besides, If you went to the trouble of verifying the integrity of the oil pump pickup tube o-ring...

Tuning

GuitsBoy

iTrader: (4)

Having previously owned a 98 fbody, I know how well those gauges responded in terms of tach and temp, however I believe the oil pressure in the newer cars is just as accurate. When i blip the throttle, the gauge reacts immediately. It does not lag like the tach does. Also, you can clearly see subtle differences in oil pressure after a pump swap, valvetrain work, or even changine oil brand / viscosity.

How was the pressure before the oil pump swap?

-Joseph-

iTrader: (12)

If the lifters are bleeding down with 20psi then its almost got to have air in the oil (cavitating), hydraulic lifters can run on much less without bleed-down problems. Most likely the air is from a leaking o-ring (or having the wrong o-ring with the older style pickup tube). All of our pumps are shimmed about .075" which should be good to add about 5psi to what a stock good-condition pump does, sometimes more... sometimes a little less depending on engine bearing clearances. Oil pumps are really a simple design, and the oil pump gears themselves do not fail unless starved of an oil source. I've seen a few sticking relief valves from trash/shop towels/grease, but it doesn't sound like thats what your problem is.

I do about 15 pumps a week exactly like each other.

lowchevy2go

iTrader: (4)

I guess i will drop the pump once again and go buy a new seal.
Before i did the heads and cam my oil pressure stayed at 40 and above always.
Mabye i should try just a regular ls6 pump.

The ticking will come out of nowhere . I have noticed it happeds when i ride the rpms slowely up to like 3500 or 4k and shift.It goes away after i let it idle for about 20 sec. then its fine again. Basically when i ride the gears out a little more.
But oil pressure is at like 45-50 when i do that. I saw in a thread that 10psi per 1000 rpms is ok. And its doin better than that. Mabye thats not correct.

And about drilling the trays. , This isnt a daily driven car. I prolly put 200 miles a month on it . I have just been driving it the past few days to get it heat cycled and to get it broke in good so i can rag it at the track.