TrahnZam WS6

Just thought I would point out if Cartek tuned the car via LS1 Edit he will most likely lose power switching to a different MAF.

nysbadmk8

im staying with a stock maf.. mine has a high rpm problem... the powerband and touqreband are very flat... all i want is 11.5's n/a and 10.9's on juice

Nick's WS6

what kind of dyno matters on reporting rwhp. If it was a Mustang dyno the numbers will be a bit lower than other proples who use a Dynojet.

Ragtop 99

iTrader: (7)

While you can't compare accross dynos, 390 from an A4 is a good number. More HP than I dynoed and very close to Raughammer's #. Who knows what HP we would report if we all showed up at TR's dyno, for example. 20 HP variances between dynos are not uncommon.

CHRISPY

I dynoed 385RWHP and 439RWTQ and ran 122.60mph <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
I think your numbers are pretty good, dynos dont mean **** as anything besides a tuning tool. Track results are where its at. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
Cheers,
Chris

Terry Burger

iTrader: (4)

Why was my post deleted? I simply asked how one car can dyno 440-450rwhp and the next one 390rwhp with the same packages? It doesn't seem very consistant to me!

FWIW I did 400rwhp (unlocked converter) when I first put my MMS stage 2 heads, 224v3.1 cam in. After tuning, 229 cam upgrade, and an EWP I got that up to 435rwhp. If you keep chipping away you can improve that number.

Terry Burger

iTrader: (4)

For drag racing peak power is more or less all that matters. You just gear the car so it spends most of its time close to whatever your peak happens to be.

SOON2BTA

NEWBIE POST <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">The only reason I'm making an issue of this is because if a potential heads/cam customer of one of our sponsors starts browsing this forum and sees 445 RWHP (MTI's latest result) and reads the thread about MTI and LG's dyno sheet wars, then sees 390 RWHP from a Cartek heads/cam customer, w/o further looking into the particulars of the dyno pulls (which is highly likely), they may unfairly exclude Cartek from their consideration.

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Rage your absolutely right! I've been browsing thru this website and ls1.com and Let me tell you! It's hard choosing the right head/cam package. I want a streetable car that runs 430-450 rwhp. And I want to be in the mid 11's.... And I'm still at a loss. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Sad]" src="gr_sad.gif" />

I could go with ARE, they're like 25 mins from my place. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="gr_tounge.gif" />
But I keep seeing Cartek is better or MTI is better, or abc is better <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

boy finding the right H/C package is stressing me out <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

<small>[ June 07, 2002, 01:50 PM: Message edited by: SOON2BTA ]</small>

RAGEman

iTrader: (4)

Area under the curve is what matters. If you show me a graph with say...820K RWHP*RPM of area under the horsepower curve between 4500 and 6500 RPM's with a peak @ 430 RWHP, I'll take that any day over a graph with 770K RWHP*RPM and a peak @ 440 RWHP. In other words a little sacrifice in PEAK values is all right as long as the broader curve yields more area under it. This is because no matter what your gearing, you can't possibly spend all your time down the track at your peak horsepower, you have to spend most of it below or above it.

AlonzoVersion 1.0

Good point.

Terry Burger

iTrader: (4)

These power under the curve arguments are usually just excuses. Most often a car with a higher peak will have more power under its curve. As long as you can adjust the power band I'll take the higher power peak ANY DAY.

So some one tell me why this Cartek car puts out 390rwhp and others put out 440rwhp? Must be the UD pulley right? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

RAGEman

iTrader: (4)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Terry Burger:
<strong>These power under the curve arguments are usually just excuses. Most often a car with a higher peak will have more power under its curve. As long as you can adjust the power band I'll take the higher power peak ANY DAY.

So some one tell me why this Cartek car puts out 390rwhp and others put out 440rwhp? Must be the UD pulley right? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Terry, we're not talking about the same car with two different dyno's, we're talking about the dyno's from two different heads/cam setups. As long as the entire powerband shifts up, I'll take the higher peak any day, as well. But the shape of the curves vary from setup to setup. That said, I stick with my previous statement that area under the curve matters more than peak values.

The reasons for the lower dyno are:

1) A4 tranny (locked converter)
2) no ported TB, stock MAF, no underdrive pulley
3) different car
EDIT: 4) not enough break-in mileage

That's all I can think of.

<small>[ June 07, 2002, 03:52 PM: Message edited by: RAGEman ]</small>

gojo

iTrader: (12)

Interesting how some of you have turned this post into all about your objectives. It happens alot with the same guys. It always ends up with an arguement about under the curve numbers. "just add gears to match power"? Is that what the poster wants. You can get a small block and rev 10000 rpm's with 600+ gears. Don't think you will drive it to work as this guy and most of us do.
How many A4's make 440 hp as a daily driver? 10% off 440 gets right to what this car makes. He's right on track. Talk about his car not your goals.

nysbadmk8

thanks gojo... im not here to be the fastest ls1, the best ls1, the most powerful ls1... i bought this car with intentions of having an 11.5 daily driver in FULL STREET TRIM... and i got a Nx wet kit to give me 10 second bragging rights... cause we all know a 10 second daily driver is very rare... im extreamly happy with the work cartek has done... hopefully i can pick it up soon... (had to get new head gaskets)... its dynoed 390rwhp with 554 miles on the motor... im sure a few ponies will come out when i get some real milage on this thing

RAGEman

iTrader: (4)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by gojo:
<strong>Interesting how some of you have turned this post into all about your objectives. It happens alot with the same guys. It always ends up with an arguement about under the curve numbers. "just add gears to match power"? Is that what the poster wants. You can get a small block and rev 10000 rpm's with 600+ gears. Don't think you will drive it to work as this guy and most of us do.
How many A4's make 440 hp as a daily driver? 10% off 440 gets right to what this car makes. He's right on track. Talk about his car not your goals.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">To whom are you referring?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by nysbadmk8:
<strong>thanks gojo... im not here to be the fastest ls1, the best ls1, the most powerful ls1... i bought this car with intentions of having an 11.5 daily driver in FULL STREET TRIM... and i got a Nx wet kit to give me 10 second bragging rights... cause we all know a 10 second daily driver is very rare... im extreamly happy with the work cartek has done... hopefully i can pick it up soon... (had to get new head gaskets)... its dynoed 390rwhp with 554 miles on the motor... im sure a few ponies will come out when i get some real milage on this thing</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">The motor only has 554 miles on it??!?! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="gr_eek2.gif" /> A few thousand break-in miles will put you over 400 RWHP, I guarantee it. We are well aware of your goals, sir. And, as I've already stated, with tires that will hold a good launch, you will get them. No offense at all, but we're not discussing this for your benefit. Let me reiterate what I said in one of my previous posts:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by RAGEman:
<strong>The only reason I'm making an issue of this is because if a potential heads/cam customer of one of our sponsors starts browsing this forum and sees 445 RWHP (MTI's latest result) and reads the thread about MTI and LG's dyno sheet wars, then sees 390 RWHP from a Cartek heads/cam customer, w/o further looking into the particulars of the dyno pulls (which is highly likely), they may unfairly exclude Cartek from their consideration. That's why I am trying to make manifest all the details about these results that I can.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Thank you.

gojo

iTrader: (12)

nysbadmk8
You can get estimates from 10-20% less dyno with A4's. I used 10 % to avoid arguement. Even at 10 your right in line. I've read some unhappy people
with your setup making far less power. This year I'll be modding a 2003 C5. I'll run 3.42 gears and want my hp to peak just under 6000 rpm's and torque around 4000. If I get your kind of power( I hope I do) I feel I can run in the 11's. It's not reasonable to think I can do much better and still drive every day and pass emissions AND not break down regularly. One point, everyone should post rpm's with their #'s. Have fun. It's onlu a game.

gojo

iTrader: (12)

Rageman
I was not talking about you. You seem to have become defensive. I agree it is not for my benefit. Though you appear to think that is an appropriate response. Why? This should be for the benefit of the poster. He was, as most of us would have been offended by some of the responses.

<small>[ June 07, 2002, 04:06 PM: Message edited by: gojo ]</small>

nysbadmk8

my power is very linear very flat... Hp @ 5500rpm is 375 6000rpm its 390 at 6500rpm its 388 at 6900rpm (redline) its 374

at 2500rpm im making 150hp
at 3000rpm im making 190hp
at 3500rpm im making 245hp
at 4000rpm im making 275hp
at 4500rpm im making 320hp
at 5000rpm im making 360hp
at 5500rpm im making 375hp
at 6000rpm im making 390hp
at 6500rpm im making 388hp
at 6900rpm im making 374hp

thats a nice 2000rpm flat band of power and with a 3500 vig it stays there very nicely

RAGEman

iTrader: (4)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by gojo:
<strong>Rageman
I was not talking about you. You seem to have become defensive. I agree it is not for my benefit. Though you appear to think that is an appropriate response. Why? This should be for the benefit of the poster. He was, as most of us would have been offended by some of the responses.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">You won't be surprised to know that I have been called "defensive" before. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> I don't see it as a bad thing. At any rate, believe it or not, I am interested in benefitting EVERYONE on this board as much as possible. I don't agree that this entire post should exclusively benefit the thread-originator. If he took offense, it was un-prompted - in my opinion, of course. He did not post a whole lot of details originally, and compared to 445 RWHP, 390 is very low, FOR WHATEVER REASON. All the reasons why his dyno was 55 RWHP lower than MTI's latest dyno were not known at first, and I believe it is in Cartek's best interests to expose all the reasons so that potential heads/cam customers don't unfairly take their business elsewhere. As I've already stated several times now.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="gr_tounge.gif" />

nysbadmk8

what kind of cam was used in mti's last dyno? 229? 227? etc.?