JC

I wanted 400rwhp sooooo bad. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Sad]" src="gr_sad.gif" /> LOL

388/382.

Mods: 98TA,M6,lid,LS6 intake,crank pulley,MAC/ORY,stock catback w/ cutout,315s on
17x11 TTIIs

Temp 95* and humid.

I'm tempted to go get me a ported TB and bring my shortbelt. LOL!

Ryan K

iTrader: (11)

LOL, I'll bet you were <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> <img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_cheers.gif" />
I'd say that was pretty sweet actually! 388 rwhp/ 382 rwtq is nice. What were the before #'S? Got Graphs?

Ryan K <img border="0" alt="[Fluffy]" title="" src="graemlins/fluffy.gif" />

<small>[ July 19, 2002, 04:00 PM: Message edited by: Ryan Karasek ]</small>

verbs

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by JC:
<strong>I wanted 400rwhp sooooo bad. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Sad]" src="gr_sad.gif" /> LOL

388/382.

Mods: 98TA,M6,lid,LS6 intake,crank pulley,MAC/ORY,stock catback w/ cutout,315s on
17x11 TTIIs

Temp 95* and humid.

I'm tempted to go get me a ported TB and bring my shortbelt. LOL!</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Hmmm....how was your a/f ratio?? Was this tuned or untuned?? What were your figures before hand?

Jason99T/A

iTrader: (21)

LOL... I bet you were pissed. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="gr_tounge.gif" />

A good ported TB and shortbelt will be worth ~10rwhp.

Congrats on some nice numbers!

VINCE

iTrader: (1)

Pissed about what? That is pretty stout..

Tin Indian

JC....

I see by the mods you have listed, you have stock heads.

I can't see for the life of me that a cam (no matter how big it is) and a set of MAC headers is going to get you 400 HP. Its just unrealistic to think a cam can increase your HP that much with stock heads.

I would say with stock heads that the engine may well be over-cammed.

Its like slapping a massive Holley Dominator carb on top of a stock headed Chev small block, and then wondering why it dont preform.

I think you are lucky, you are putting down damned good numbers for a car that has just mid length headers, a catback, and a very very large camshaft.

Get some decent heads, and it will come alive.

Again, just my opinion, but the car is overcammed for the combo you are now running....

Get some heads! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />
Ron

Skelton

What Vince said. About what? With stock heads, no tuning, Macs and 95 degree's, thats damn good.

Tin Indian

Jeeze...

After re-looking at your mods, you even are running the stock catback! (well, a cutout)

Great Big CAM and a set of Mac headers..

Consider your self lucky!

P.S. I will say it again... You are overcamned!
And you are giving up ALOT of low rpm torque / throttle response with that 230 cam coupled with stock heads.

<small>[ July 19, 2002, 04:32 PM: Message edited by: Kimchee and Rice ]</small>

1999Daytona500PaceCar

iTrader: (2)

Yeah, you are real close. Just a couple little things can get you there. SLP Y-pipe (if you don't already have a 3 inch one)with a Flowmaster collector combined with a 3 inch intermediate pipe leading to your cutout, a ported TB, ported or larger MAF, some ignition upgrades, higher octane fuel, more dyno tuning - any combination of these things could get you there. You could even try different plugs or plug gaps - it could be that simple. I run the Bosch Platinum + 4's and they have shown to be worth 1 HP per plug - which could possibly get you 5 rwhp right there. Of course you could drop the cash on some SLP or FLP Long tubes, but I don't think that would be necessary to pick up that last 15HP or so that you need. Good luck, as it is all in the details now!

VINCE

iTrader: (1)

I dyno'd 372rwhp/370rwtq with 3.42's and no tuning. The cam was the T1. My mods then were Mac headers and new cam. Nothing else.. Post Ed W's tuning I dyno'd 390rwhp/380rwtq with 3.42's. I added a pulley and I picked up nothing on the dyno. I expected crazy gains from a set of heads. I picked up 12rwhp. All of my dyno's did not include a cutout. Consider yourself lucky and stop complaining. By the way.. Make sure you pick a good set of heads to go with your cam. I suggest going with what Thunder Racing recommends to go with their cam..

2000 ws6

iTrader: (10)

Nice Numbers <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />
I havent put mine on the dyno yet but will soon.
Im hoping for the same numbers or a bit more.

Kimchee and Rice- I will tell you I have stock heads as well,and haven't lost any throttle response or low end torque. This ***** F--er pulls hard through the whole powerband and beware past 6K good lord. Even if someone did lose a bit of low end torque, you make it all up in the Higher Rpm range by far, you dont race below 3K. If you do I would expect a slow and long race <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> .

This is a Fu--ing Awesome cam!

Its all in the tuning. I have been tuning mine via ls1 edit and by all means I am no where near getting the car tuned perfect, but when I do I can't wait to feel even more power <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> .
This cam added was enough for me to pull on a 2000 ws6 like mine equipped Powerdyne s/c 6lbs,longtubes all the other mods as me by 3-4 cars <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> We raced twice and both times I won by 3-4 cars heheh.

Needless to say The other guy was quite pissed in his 2500$ more investment <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

gator's 99TA

iTrader: (2)

Kimchee and rice - or whatever i believe you are so wrong about big cams.

here you see the list of mods (remember to look to the Moser with 4.10 gears) which most on the board know to suck down about 12-15 RWHP. well i pulled 381RWHP with a STOCK LS1 intake, NO PULLEYS, and factory catback with no muffler (same as a cutout) and this was with the driver side oxygen sensor DEAD! LOL! i know this car if it had a stock rearend, even with the bad sensor (the sensor was registering 0.000 mv!!!!!! so the bank one was pushing TONS of fuel on that one side of the motor!) that my car would pull more dyno power.

if i had a stock rear 400 RWHP would have been easy! hell, i might have it with the intake and pulleys! big cams are for guys that want the big power. sure there are a lot of people that make big power, but look to their drivetrane. most DO NOT look there. they are just owwwed, and awwwwed with the final number.

the 230TR cam is very stout. i would like to remind you that Jayson's car is the TRs shop's car (virtually) and has had tons of hours on the dyno tuning and has every damn bolt on (though he does have the big power sucking rear). i would not suggest people look to the freakish every bolt on sponser cars as par, more like the pinicle!

by the way, i do not have the TR cam, but the Raging motorsports 230 cam (very differnt, but same idea of large cam).

gator's 99TA

iTrader: (2)

oh i failed to mention you have nothing to be ashamed up with 38x RWHP - you need to get that puppy tuned right and she will pull harder! the big cams need tuning. but when you put on a big rear, bye bye 15 RWHP!

Jason99T/A

iTrader: (21)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by gator's 99TA:
<strong>i would like to remind you that Jayson's car is the TRs shop's car (virtually) and has had tons of hours on the dyno tuning and has every damn bolt on (though he does have the big power sucking rear). i would not suggest people look to the freakish every bolt on sponser cars as par, more like the pinicle!

</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">gator, the tune on my car hasn't changed since I installed the TR224 cam. It has been identical through the 227/224, and the current 230/224 cam that is in my car. I don't know where you came up with that since I saw you post that in another thread. Do have I have some hp/tq to be gained with some tuning? I think so, but I don't expect more than 5-6rwhp.

Once I get the car back on the road (tranmission blew up again), I plan on redynoing it to see if there is anything left with some fine tuning.

ChrisB

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Kimchee and Rice:
<strong>JC....I would say with stock heads that the engine may well be over-cammed.
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Just in general - poorer heads actually need "more cam" than a well ported set of heads to make power - simply because you have to keep the valves open longer to get more air in. Look at stock eliminators - tremendous duration values.

Chris

The Juggernaut

iTrader: (7)

I don't think a 12 bolt sucks power.
With a moser 12 bolt w/4.10 gears my stock internal (no heads, no cam)
M6 put out 365RWHP/380RWTQ.
It is just a theory though.
Maybe a 9"?

gator's 99TA

iTrader: (2)

jason, first, i have absolutely no beef with you or TR. i think you all have a 1st rate company and great knowlege. you guys are certainly one to lead the pack. the thing i am saying is you have extensive dyno tuning time i am very sure, since TR backs your car. also, you are around a group that is at the leading edge of LS1 technology. your advantage most do not have.

the thing i have a problem with is that you and TR are (very loosely here, so dont be mad) misleading people into thinking 400 RWHP is easy or even the par number with stock heads. yes you did get that number (actually well over 400) through a very beefy drivetrane, but what many do not understand is your car has every possible reasonably bolt on while most people do not. most do not understand with an LS1 intake and no pulleys, stock TB, etc you are not going to make that kind of power. most do not have all these small bolt ons, which in the end, really help out the final result.

again, i am not taking anything away from you, but i see these posts lately about how people are "disappointed" with ONLY 380ish RWHP with the 230 cam. well, i think this is very within normal range, they just dont have all the mods your TR shop car has. people do not understand it takes every little bit to achieve a huge )for stock heads) horsepower.

hopefully i will be close to 400 RWHP with a good tune and more bolt ons (damn i need an intake and pulley!) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

and to the reply above, yes a moser does eat up dyno power. the roller dyno does not adjust for the 4.10 gear well and it takes more power to turn a heavy duty moser than it does to turn the wimpy little 10 bolt. that is positive. many (including TR) have documented as much as a 12-15 RWHP difference with moser 4.10 geared rearends.

<small>[ July 19, 2002, 09:42 PM: Message edited by: gator's 99TA ]</small>

MelloYellow

True, but rougher idle.
Is this a 112 or 114 LSA?

112 would have ok bottom end.
A 230/114 would be weaker than I'd like down low. Great results no matter how you look at it.

Actually, when I had a 224/224 Cam and S2 Heads with 2.055's I lost a LOT of bottom end. Maybe it was the Intake Valves.. dunno..

Street Racer

iTrader: (65)

JC, those are some great numbers for stock heads I would be happy <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

verbs

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by 01-Z:
<strong>I don't think a 12 bolt sucks power.
With a moser 12 bolt w/4.10 gears my stock internal (no heads, no cam)
M6 put out 365RWHP/380RWTQ.
It is just a theory though.
Maybe a 9"?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I will say this. And yes it is speculation.

I dynoed 357/366 with bolt ons through 4.10 gears on a stock 10 bolt.

I had a steel driveshaft at the time of that dyno, and along w/ my 12 bolt, switched to a carbon fiber driveshaft, and added an aluminum flywheel.

I then redynoed with a 12 bolt and 3.73 gears, and the two mods above and was at 363rwhp/372rwtq.

Now, just from switching from 4.10's to 3.73's it should have added 5rwhp to my dyno, giving me 362rwhp/371rwtq....

so even though I swapped my 19lb steel driveshaft for a 9lb carbon fiber, and swapped my 30lb flywheel for a 15lb one in addition to going to taller gears, I only ended up with a total of 363rwhp/372rwtq because of the 12 bolt.

There is no way the c/f driveshaft and alum flywheel mods only gave me 1 rwhp and 1 rwtq in addition to the 5rwhp I should have gained from going to taller gears.