If I buy a built shortblock I am putting it in as is. If I have to take it apart to check clearances, I would just have them send me the parts ready for assembly and build it myself and save even more money..

 

I can see that we'll never see eye-to-eye on this. Good luck to you on your build.

 

Ok, this thread has turned into a stupidity contest.

Evan, If you want to check your tolerances, then you should purchase the components yourself and build your own engine. I mean honestly waht is the point of tearing into a motor that these guys have built for you?

You said yourself you are young. But you mis-spelled meticulous. Lets ask the simple question. You pull the motor down to "check it". Do you even know what to check? What exactly are you going to "check".

As for the parts pricing, I haven't had a chance to check what you've posted, but I will say that shop get a price break. So, if your pricing is retail, and their pricing is say WD. Then your numbers mean nothing.

Anyway, if y'all don't get back on track, I'm going to edit or close this thread.

 

im not trying to make any enemies nor defend sponsors or customers. But we all know that no matter how good and reputable a company is, they will make a mistake here and there. I would just rather take 2 hours to just re check a couple clearances to make sure everything is in spec. Rather then bolt everything up, go through the various hours of setting everything up and finally get it running, only to find there is a problem with the short block. I have seen reputable shops claim something as obvious as a bore size being 4.065 and it actually being 4.025. The worst part about it is that they didnt notice this until after they had the car running for a couple thousand miles. It takes 2 seconds to check the bore with a micrometer. Why not just do it as soon as you get it. I would be flip **** pissed if i got a short block speced on paper to 4.065 bore and it was actually 40 thousandths less. These are simple things to check. But like i stated in my first post. Im a do-it-yourself kinda guy. Im buying a short block to save some money and in my opinion Schwanke is offering some great deals. If they have made mistakes in the past, then i will simply rule out the fact that mine is one of them by checking it. I sound like im beating a dead horse but this is my point of view. If you want to gamble with buying a short block, throwing it in, having an issue, and then the sponsor not backing it up, then so be it. I guess thats what we have attorneys for. But as originally stated. Not trying to make enemies with customers or sponsors.

 

Well since I have personally seen the crank snout fall off an Eagle LS crank, it may not be a good deal. And the first two Eagle cranks I bought had to be machined for clearance just to fit into the LS block. Quality Control? WTF is that?

 

I have explained it numerous times. If no one can understand it then that is fine but please do not try and put me down based on my spelling or age. Regardless, there are various things to "check". Piston to wall clearance, Ring Gap, bearing clearances, etc. If sponsors offer a "non - assembled" deal then i would take that. But i dont see that offered anywhere.

 

Your point is understood. But my pricing point was just explaining the cost of buying the components listed in there build and doing it yourself vs having them do everything. Its a great amount less to have them do it.

 

Evan, Let me ask you a really simple question. Assuming you have a piston that has .004 to .005 clearance, on a 4.065 bore that would tend to indicate that the piston would be about 4.059 or 4.060. Can you tell me how you are physically going to insert that piston into a hole that is 4.025? I can tell you from my 20+ years of being in and around an engine shop it isn't going to happen.

 

sure, its called go buy the stuff yourself and build your own engine...

 

I understand your trying to make me sound foolish here in attempts to be-little me, but obviously if the bore of the block was not 4.065 then they wouldnt have used a piston that is in proper clearances with a 4.065 bore now would they?

 

Wowsa......................................

 

I must be an idiot then because I bought a shortblock from a sponser on here and its been running for three years with 7000miles on it, and countless nitrous passes, and never I checked the tolerances! You fork out the money so you don't have to check that stuff!

I want to hear on what schwanke has to say about someone going over a shortblock as you described before putting in a car, or even for that matter any sponser. To me it sounds like you have no trust in a sponser building a shortblock, and if i was a sponser and you went through my block I would be offended and would not think twice about a warranty.

 

lol o man so now im offending people if i re-check specs on a short block i spent money on. My god you sound like such a child. Thanks for the good laugh though. Anyway OP, good luck with your motor no matter what you do. She should go pretty good.

 

How do I sould like a child? Just because I have confidence in the person that puts together my shortblock, and I was smart enough to go through a sponser that has a 90 day warranty. I also did some research and made sure I knew what I was getting, and what kind of reputation the company had before I purchased. I knew that if I was one of the lucky ones to get a bad shortblock I was pretty sure that it would have gone dead before the 90 days were up.

 

you sound like a child because your saying im going to "offend" sponsors if i re-check there work. Its called PIECE-OF-MIND. The absolute best can make mistakes. I would rather find a problem (if there is one) before i spend the days putting my motor in and setting it up. I have never seen someone get so flamed for wanting to double check things. Christ

 

Evan the issue here is that you say you can't buy the hardparts for an engine for what Schwanke sell the motor for.

As I pointed out thats because the prices you list are list in most cases list, and to get WD (or better) pricing would require you to have a way to get "good" pricing. Whether its having a shop sell you parts at cost, create your own "shop", make friends with some folks in the industry, or whatever. If you had spent any real time you'd realize the ignorance of that particular part of your claim. There are a lot of people who can buy those parts cheaper than you list. The fact that you cannot does not make you the definitive subject on that matter.

Here is the issue I think which has come to light in this thread. You have taken the opportunity to come into their thread. You point out they are cheap (cheaper than you can even buy the parts for). And then you claim you'd order a motor and take it apart "to check their work".

The obvious insinuation is that these guys need their work checked by you. If you want to pull your motor down when you get it, thats your business. But you don't need to come into this vendors thread and about the need to pull a brand new engine down to "check everything". Especially when you haven't even purchased a single item from them. You also go on about how meticulous you are. Which by its very nature implies the Schwanke is not. In other words, you are more QC concious than they are.

You've cited that you've put a few motors together. But, how do we know what your credentials are? How does anyone verify the fact that you even have a clue what you are looking at when you pull the motor down? I know a lot of guy who slap motors together and don't have the foggiest clue about what to really look at...

Lets take a hypothetical. You pull the motor down. When you go to put it back together, and you make a mistake in reassembly, and the engine has a failure. Are you going to come on this site and tell us about your issue, or are you going to go back to the builder and claim its an issue on their end?

There is not an issue per se with verifying a motor. The issue is with you:

1. Coming into a thread showing no tact or courtesy to start with.
2. Questioning the ability of a shop that you've never even purchased a product from.
3. Implying your own engine building abilities are superior to the subject of this thread.

If you want to build your own motor, then I suggest you contact any one of the vendors and ask them to ship you an un-assmebled engine. I'm sure many of them will with the expressed understanding it comes with no warranty as they can't verify your abilites (or lack thereof).

 

Im not going to get anymore into it with you people because it is truly ridiculous. Everything you just said was a completely twisted version of what i said. I stated numerous times i did not think i was any "better" then any of the sponsors but you continue to put words in my mouth. Maybe its because your a site admin and you think you have the right to say whatever it is you want to people. But there is NOTHING wrong with checking the measurements and tolerances of the short block you purchase from any sponsor. My claim was that EVEN THE BEST SHOPS CAN AND WILL MAKE SOME MISTAKES. So if you think im "young" or an "idiot" or whatever you would prefer to call me for simply wanting to double check another shops work makes you either naive or just plain ignorant. Nobody is perfect in what they do. Everyone makes a mistake at some point. All im saying is that to be certain that you are not that mistake you should double check your short block or anything you purchase. All it seems you can actually do is claim i have no experience and that i have no idea what im double checking. If i make a mistake putting it back together then clearly that wasnt the shops fault. If i took it apart and found nothing out of spec then i couldnt blame the engine builder for the failure. And as far as pricing is concerned. I apologize for giving prices the average consumer can get parts for. The average customer does not get parts at cost unless they have some form of a connection in the industry. So my prices that i gave still stand for what it takes to order parts and have them shipped to your residence. Anyway. I rest my case here. Hope everyone has a fantastic day. I know i will.

 

I've never seen a negative thing deleted over there. Ever. You just have to stand by your work and argue it. Most the time the people who can't support their argument get shut out.

So yea, safe haven for posting negative results for sure. If you also have something shitty happen that is a great place to go to find answers and help. They won't let builders or sponsors bullshit and try to play the "We've done so much for the community...been doing this for 20 years...blah blah" irrelevant arguments. It gets called how its seen.

 

these are the days of ours lives......

 

Agreed, but shortblocks are tough to warranty if the builder doesn not have the heads going on, he has no way of checking P to V clearnances, and cannot verify if everything is torqued down properly. That's like buying an engine from one place, the body from another, then asking one or the other to warrany the entire build.

If it is a long-block a warranty should be included, but any shortblock should not exhibit any visible tolerance issues when arriving to the customer. There should be no need to tear down anything to ensure it's assembled properly. That was the builder's responsibility and not the customer's, nor the installers.