JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

I stumbled across a Procharged Coyote a few days ago and I temporarily had dreams of a PD blower, before I noticed the price, possibly having to change accessory drives, dealing with the limited '98 PCM, etc. So maybe it's back to just seeing what else I can squeeze out of what I currently have.

Motor is a hand built 377ci LS3. K1 rods, ARP2000 rod bolts, Clevite rod bearings, ACL main bearings, SRP 4032 pistons (5cc, .01 above deck), & 222/230 112+2 cam by PatG. My top end is FastToys Lid (I think it's an 85mm) > TSP 100mm MAF w/ screen > Nick Williams 92mm TB > stock LS3 intake > stock LS3 heads milled .020 with stock hardware except PAC 1518 springs. Only street tuned w/ mail order tune from Frost at this time. Static compression right around 10.8, I think DCR is around 8.2. Not interested in larger displacement, but I'm open to higher compression so long as it's compatible with 92-94 octane fuel.

Fuel system is stock LS3 injectors, Racetronix harness kit & Racetronix 255lph Walbro pump.

Exhaust is ARH 1.75" headers > ARH 3" catted Y-pipe > SLP dual-dual (with cutout). I don't like the sound of the exhaust without cat's.

Drivetrain is a T56 with basic upgrades, LS7 clutch with Fidanza 13.5lb flywheel, OEM AL driveshaft, OEM 10-bolt with 3.73 gears. I have considered going back to a 3.42 final drive if I could get the tip-in bucking resolved.

It's a daily driver which needs to remain reliable and low maintenance, don't want to worry about checking/replacing valvesprings, would like better fuel economy at cruise, max average torque between say 2500 & 6000. No drag racing, spirited street cruising, perhaps I'll get back into autocross or someday try my hand at a HPDE but I worry about the poor LS3 oil drain back for those activities.

I feel I lost some of the snappiness in the throttle when I switched from the LS1 to the LS3, and I've read that is a result of going from cathedral to wide rectangular intake ports. But I've also read that the there aren't any real gains (except a much lighter wallet) to be had with the Fast cathedral intake on a stock displacement LS3. Not interested in nitrous.

I was considering a BER or PeakSpeedShop ported LS3 intake and maybe better heads and a matched cam, but are there any other changes I could consider to raise my area under the curve in that RPM range and help with the other desires also?

CamanLS1

iTrader: (2)

Bigger cam. Youre leaving a lot on the table with what you have in there now. Stock intake manifold is fine for stock displacement. Look into a cam in the 230/245 area and some PRC255 heads.

newschool72

iTrader: (12)

I don't think going much bigger on cam is going to do much for the OPs daily drive status, LOL. I came across a combo that works great on my LS3, but I think my combo leans heavily on my GMPP dual plane carb intake. It has bosses that can be drilled and tapped for EFI, but would cause cowl clearance issues with your 4th gen. Anyway, it runs a cam very close to your specs but has the beans to go deep 11, maybe 10.9x with a solid 1.5ish 60ft. I did a 1.876 spinning , part throttle, feathering 60ft last weekend, and ran 11.65 at 118. That's in a 3500lbs car with a 2800 stall and 3.42 gears, AC and power steering dragging the front of the engine down. It has 16+" of vacuum and cruises effortlessly at 1750rpms with the converter locked at 55 mph. Its not FI, but for an NA setup that acts stock in daily driving, it runs hard enough to keep a smile on my face.

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

Yeah, even with the TFS255'x being so new and barely any combo dyno results, I think that a cam near 230/245 cam would be too large for my daily driver goals.

TurboAv

iTrader: (6)

Centri blower if you like HPDE.

Here's my LS3.

Daily driver tune with 14* timing up top:







Race tunes:

16* and 18* of timing respectively.

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

The PD blower options seemed to be very expensive, $10K+ all in after the kit and supporting mods (possibly having to change accessory drive, wondering if the fuel system is adequate, custom fabrication, etc.) there's out of the ballpark. I've heard the blowers cause cooling problems on the track, which would require even further cooling mods. But in addition, it's likely I won't attend a HPDE or any sort of ORR due to the notorious block oiling issues.

Would there be such a thing as a complete boost solution (which includes all additional supporting mods) that meets my goals but would be maybe closer to $5K?

newschool72

iTrader: (12)

Depending on your talent, a single turbo w a cheap air to air cooler and a Feabay hair dryer? I wish I had taken up welding in my younger days. It would make fabbing a home made turbo setup very affordable ! If you don't have the skills, that's probably out too.

TurboAv

iTrader: (6)

ECS and A&A kits can be had for $5500 on sale usually. There will probably be a Black Friday or holiday sale from them both.

A&A also sometimes sell a "newsed" kit. A rebuilt blower with all new everything else. Those are usually around $4500 if they have some.

cabel1

iTrader: (3)

How about finding a good tuner and putting it on the rollers

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

I haven't found any 1) within a few hours drive that has a Mustang load bearing dyno 2) with a tuner I'm comfortable with and 3) who bothers to call/write me back to schedule a visit. I've had four different 'tuners' work on various stages of the car in person since I bought it new and they've not been experienced enough to resolve drivability concerns. Frost was too far away to take it to him.

TurboAv

iTrader: (6)

What about Matt Sorian at FSP? He's in Bradenton. He just sorted out some issues on my buddies 1000rwhp+ 5th Gen Camaro.

newschool72

iTrader: (12)

Stuff like this makes me glad I wimped out and did the Fast EZ EFI on the GMPP dual plane intake. I don't need anyone but the brain in the ECU and myself to decide what I want the AFR to do. The ignition is handled by my MSD6012 box and gives me complete control of spark. So much easier to make changes and I don't have to keep on paying someone else to keep my car running right.

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

Haven't heard of him. Tell me how to contact him and I'll do so if The Tuning School doesn't work out.

TurboAv

iTrader: (6)

www (dot) floridaspeedandpower.com

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

Just putting together some sample pricing for this project. What are the best options for heads on a 4.07 bore, both cathedral & rectangular? Relatively small intake runner volume but high flow, proven performers, etc.? How much benefit is there of a 11 vs 12 vs 13 valve angle?

Rectangular:
TFS GenX 255, 255cc (12 degree)
Mast 510-202 (LS3 12 Degree 4.000" - 4.070" Medium Bore CNC), 255cc
PRC 199-265LS7SB LS3 (LS7x 265cc CNC Small Bore Heads), 250,255,260c
SDPC LS3 CNC Ported
???

Cathedral:
AFR 215/230/245cc Mongoose
Mast 215/245cc
PRC 237/247cc
TFS 235 - scratch that, needs min bore of 4.125
???

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

Well I picked up a Rick Crawford modified LS3 intake so I'm taking the switch back to cathedral off the table for the forseeable future. I doubt I'll take the time to dyno before and won't dyno until it's tuned. Waiting for some other minor parts to install at the same time, most likely will install weekend of 11/30.

Not getting my questions answered by PRC nor TFS.

KCS

iTrader: (20)

So no nitrous, no blowers, no stroker, you want make more power, get better fuel economy, keep the cats, and you want it to be reliable and maintenance free? That doesn't leave you a whole lot of options...

I'd say mill the heads some more to get around 11.5:1 compression.

newschool72

iTrader: (12)

Then up the cam specs a little to keep the dynamic compression from getting too high for pump gas.
Im running a 220/230 at .050, 108+4 cam in my stock GM crate LS3 and am right at 228 lbs of cranking compression. It likes pump 93 ok at 34* max timing, but I wouldn't want to push it any farther than that.

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

Although I didn't explicitly state it in the original post, I'd like max average torque between 2500-6000RPM but not have the curve fall like a brick after 6000. When I requested the current cam from Patrick, I told him I wanted as close to 400rwtq between 2500-6000RPM as possible for a strong street/autox car, and I feel what he spec'ed was right on. In fact, even though he recommended something a little larger for the TFS 255's, I'm inclined to stay with the current cam.

So I guess I'm interested in shifting my curve straight up as much as I can with the modified (not to be confused with ported) LS3 manifold, heads, valvetrain (higher lift rockers?) and matching cam. If I can get a bit better fuel economy below 2000 by shifting the curve to the right a bit I'd be all right with that.

Not sure how much I can mill before worrying about PTVC. Without a cam change, dropping to a 60cc chamber would put me at 11.5 SCR and 9.0 DCR with my current AIVC of 65.5. I'd need an AIVC of 70* or later to keep DCR around 8.7 or less.

DietCoke

iTrader: (18)

Port the heads and give it more cam. Easy 50hp.