Beast96Z

iTrader: (21)

i didn't say anything about numbers. Just what one could expect the curve of the cam to look like. Numbers don't matter when your looking at RPM's.

dame

iTrader: (3)

???

dame

iTrader: (3)

So let me understand this.... You have a 244/248 115 LSA cam in your 408 that makes 469 rwhp....... But can't see the added benefits of a head that makes MORE POWER (480RWHP) with LESS CAM (231-235 110 LSA vs 244/248 115 LSA) .............. how much MORE cam do you think YOU would need to match the power of this "subpar" combo that you were talking about buying just a month ago?

StingrayCrazy

iTrader: (5)

Ditto...

2c5s

iTrader: (11)

:
Originally Posted by PowerShift408
I'm not sold on these L92s yet. I know they flow great numbers and all, but saw a thread the other day where a guy put 480 to the wheels with these heads. He had a smaller cam (230s duration, cant remember lift), but he only put down 11 more ponies than I have on stock 241s...

So both engines have stock heads, similar cr and headers. Only major difference is the cam..... you have 13' more intake duration and 13' more exhaust duration and you make less power. Yeah, those L92's suck.

gtovan

Small detail. At .050" but much less at .200" and lifts above that w/ LSK lobes plus you chose a better (tighter) LSA for making more torque. BTW, nice numbers w/ your setup.

JakeFusion

iTrader: (7)

One thing to consider, the L92s flow 330cfm out of the box. The LQ9s flow what, 260-270? Sure, 13 degrees @ .050 seems like a lot, but since it's LSK vs XE-R, it's more like an 8 degree difference because the LSK is 4 degrees bigger where it counts, after .050".

With that said, if the guy with the 244/248 were to throw some AFR 225s on his combo (320cfm), he'd make roughly another 40-50rwhp, putting him close to 510-520rwhp. I'm sorry, but 8 degrees of effective duration can't overcome a 30-40rwhp difference, especially when overlap appears to start hurting the L92s' power production.

The L92s make good power out of the box. So, they'll be a great, cheap way to make close to 500rwhp on a 402. In time, I'm sure 530-550 can be had like the 225s from AFR/ETP/TFS. However, the L92s should compete and sometimes beat those other heads box stock, because the low lift numbers are so strong and the high lift numbers are on par. It should out power them, but it may take a fully ported setup to get them there (where flow would be 20-30cfm better across the board).

dame

iTrader: (3)

I guess im the only one here that refuses to forget that it doesn't matter if your heads flow 400 cfm: ONCE YOU ATTACH Your BEST intake (a ported 90/90 setup) its going to net you LESS than 300...
If the above statement is wrong please correct me.

Considering that L92 heads flow WITH AN INTAKE ATTACHED what MOST of the good heads flow WITHOUT an intake should put things into perspective..... Am i wrong? if so please educate me.

JakeFusion

iTrader: (7)

I haven't seen flow numbers on the L92 with the L76 attached. If it's still around 320 and the AFR 225 with a FAST is at 295, then the L92 should beat it box stock.

ScottyRocket

Your biggest gains are going to be putting these(with matched intake) on a big cube engine or a 377+ that spins to 8500rpm. That's really all you can do. The heads flowing under 300cfm are about the ideal size for torque band(NA street) most of you are looking for. If you are going to run your engine to 7500rpm, then the L92's should be fine on anything larger than a 377 and make really good power. If you engine can only use say 300cfm, then the only way you can rev it the same And make more power is the increase the cubes or compression and maybe a cam change.

Typically, you can't just bolt on the highest flowing set of heads you can find and make more peak power without making the engine "want" more air. All else being the same(besides the heads), you won't see any real big gains....the engine still only uses what it wants to based on the size and RPM of the engine. Yes, there are some gains in chamber and port efficiency, but the gains being made year to year now are fairly small. Don't forget the Intake, it must be able to flow what the engine "wants" as well.

Now, if you built say a 427 with these heads, use good parts top to bottom and could spin it to a higher RPM, then you might just see 600rwhp. Run race gas and more compression (14+ to 1), then you'll see 700+. With the LS7 heads, you would probably see 750+....and probably some broken parts(all hp is NA est.)

There is no one magic cam that is going to make crazy HP with these heads and all other cams don't. It's still a V-8 engine with 8 intake valve and 8 exhaust valves, pushrods, rocker arms and a cam.

dame

iTrader: (3)

https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...&highlight=L92

2c5s

iTrader: (11)

I think my combo with some break in miles will be VERY close to 500 rwhp as it sits. The car was road tuned for 1/2 hour and driven straight on the dyno and power tuned, HOT. 500 rwhp was my initial goal with this top end package. Is it the optimum camshaft, no. It was left over and new from a another project, so I used it. But it is much smaller than the 244/248 XER everywhere except peak lift. The .200 numbers are still down 9', to me, that's not a small figure. Concerning LSA, sure it matters, but not to the degree people think. BTW, this car was tuned on Costco 91 octane fuel.

$ for $, I'm happy with the results.

dame

iTrader: (3)

Agree 100%

Beast96Z

iTrader: (21)

You also have to look at the what the L92 size is as compared to these other heads. The heads use much bigger ports and valves to get similar results from other catings. 265cc ports and 2.16 intake valves to net only 330 cfm. My heads with the same port volume and smaller valves flow almost 390 cfm. I'd take the box stock AFR 225's over the L92 any day of the week. Like I said before, you gunna need some big cubes or forced induction to fully utilize these things.

dame

iTrader: (3)

I'd say the same thing if I had the heads you have and a harrop intake What would those ET 265's that flow almost 390cfm do through a PORTED 90/90 setup? MOST people on here dont have $3000 on top of everything else to go with a harrop style intake.... so the "masses" have 2 choices a ported 90/90 setup that at BEST will flow what? 300 cfm (through the manifold) .... or go L92/L76 and get a head that flows 320+ (through the manifold)

Trust me If I just spent $3000 for heads plus another $2xxx (if not more) on a manifold I would probably be skepticle of a setup that cost a FRACTION of that. The simple truth is there are alot of guys on here that have 402/408's (6 speeds) that have 24x duration cams that are NOT getting 500 rwhp ..... you have a couple of guys that went out of there way to post up their results with a NEW product that happen to have cams smaller than what guys are putting in their 346's these days that are right at 500rwhp, and people say these heads aren't what they were cracked up to be ...... Its hilarious really.
Let me also add that if money wasn't a factor i would have duplicated your head and intake choice in a heartbeat.

SDB

iTrader: (7)

all I know is that $2400 will get you the best L92 heads/parts/L76 intake/90mm stock TB/fuel injectors/rails, etc. that will flow 360 cfm and handle a big nasty cam. On a $4600 short block (i.w., ScrogginDickey) 416 cube plus the 2400 for the top end, you have approximately $7000 you will have a badass motor....I would have to think that it would make 700 crank hp with a big enough cam.

SDB

Beast96Z

iTrader: (21)

True, my set-up isn't the most cost effective. I'll admit that, but all things aside, until some people start testing these things, who's to say what is better? Sure the L92 set-up will cost less, but will it make more power than a ported 90/90 on top of some AFR 225's? Surley the AFR's with their smaller ports and valves will make for a more efficent port. As far as the results on the L92's, I've only seen one, and that's 2c5s V. For the smaller cam, yea, they did ok and made a nice TQ curve. Then again, I've seen 408's with STOCK 6.0 heads and a LS6 intake make 460ish to the wheels, so I try not to make judgments off of one result. I think they will be a good dollar for dollar head, but doubt that they will be the end all, like some are making them out to be.

White_Hawk

iTrader: (3)

Like those guys above me said, you are really missing the point. My whole long block is going to be cheaper than your heads and intake. If you want to have a pissing match, then post up how much your setup cost, then we will figure out $/HP.

-Geoff

dame

iTrader: (3)

Guess you forgot about this one ....

https://ls1tech.com/forums/generation-iv-internal-engine/622014-first-impressions-my-l92-l76-408-little-long.html

Dyno is in the dyno section

Beast96Z

iTrader: (21)

I don't play $/HP, I play HP. Everyone has to go by a budget, including myself. It just so happens that my budget allowed for more. I'm not looking for a pissing match, just making resonable conversation. If you don't like my talkings of port efficency vs. castings then skip my posts.

Saw the post, but quit reading after the second page of no results. My fault for not going back and checking. I'd like to see the graph plotted in dynojet form. Those dyno pack graphs always look funny to me. Looks nice for a small 116 LSA cam.