BCook839

I'm doing a CC503 cam swap. I was refered to these springs by a user on this forum and by finding that Lloyd Elliot recommends them also.

They are supposed to work with all the stock hardware from what I am told, but they don't unfortunatly. They valve spring bottom retainer does not fit properly into the spring (like the sping is slightly to small in diameter). The upper retainer does fit into the spring properly.

And also, these springs are a dual spring with an inner and an outer spring. The stock springs are a single spring. I am thinking this also is problem because the stock retainers dont look like they have a seating surface for the inner spring of the vs2700's.

Any thoughts?

In the morning I am going to call Bullet and see if they can help me out at all, but I thought I would get some of your guys' opinions on what to do. Any body else running these springs?

Thank you,
Ben

gregrob

iTrader: (8)

Dual springs def won't work with the stock seats. Didn't think the 2700s were dials though. I would call bullet...

BCook839

Well I just got off the phone with a really nice laid back gentleman at Bullet. He says the inner spring that I am seeing isnt actually a spring. It is just a dampener that is there to aid in the harmonics of the spring and in vibration reduction of the spring. He told me that this dampener is fine riding on the stock retainers. It has so little tension that it wont hurt anything. I could take it out even if I wanted to, and it wont effect spring rate at all but I should just leave it in there for good measure.

As far as the main spring's inner diameter, he told me to just trim it up alittle with a grinder so it falls down flush with the retainer. As long as I am triming the part that sits on the retainer it will not effect the tension of the coils of the spring that are responsible for its overall spring rate.

So I'll try alittle triming...

RamAir95TA

iTrader: (2)

I don't like that one bit. If you've got to grind on your springs to get them to fit, there's obviously a problem. Not to mention grinding on one of the most stressed parts of the engine?

I'll pass.

fergymoto

iTrader: (129)

It's actually pretty common and isn't a big deal if you do it right.

BCook839

The fella I talked to said it is this or a $60 set of retainers. Generally I am one to spend the extra cash for peace of mind. But in this case, he said that they do it in their company's shop on a regular basis. And the part of the spring that I am grinding isn't part of the area that moves with the occillation of the valve/spring movement. It is seated on the bottom retainer at all times through the movement of the valve/spring. It is actually the very end ( last half inch or so) of the wire that makes up the spring that will be ground down slightly on the inner section of the wire. Just a smidge. We are talking a very small amount.

ryanisfast

you should take out the dampener. I was told that with the LT1, the dampener will bind at a low lift level, which wouldn't matter, except for it actually bottoms out on the lt1 style of valve guides, so take out the inner dampener! I burst one of my springs and warped nearly all of the pushrods in my motor because of it.

NightTrain66

iTrader: (7)

yep, remove the damper so that the damper doesn't coil bind from sitting on top of locator. This will cause the damper to break and chew up the valve seals.

They are fine with no dampers.

Lloyd

R3DLT1

iTrader: (5)

Any issues after removing the dampers?
I plan on running this valve springs vs2700 with my cc305...

JAKEJR

This issue comes up with those springs ALL THE TIME. I see it on other Forums too, with the same LAME advice; remove the damper. Hell, the engineer(s) who designed those springs concluded they need a damper, so, what, now we just rep-engineer them by deleting the damper? NOT A SMART MOVE AT ALL!!

Check LS1LT1, CAMAROZ28 if you want to see other posts and the damage they've caused to other guy's engines.

You should NOT have to do any modifications to the springs, no removal of the damper or grinding to get them to fit. If they don't fit they're the wrong springs for your application and SHOULD NOT BE USED - PURE AND SIMPLE.

Someone who's bought those springs on LE's recommendation ought to pull his coat on this continuing problem and suggest he STOP recommending them. Yes, he's a great guy and all that, but don't just BLINDLY follow a recommendation that has such a terrible track record.

Sometimes you've got to think for yourself.

Jake

R3DLT1

iTrader: (5)

Thanks jake ur right!

speed_demon24

iTrader: (6)

I would see what bullet says. You might run into a harmonic issue which can valve float with out them.

ryanisfast

The VS2700 springs work fine. I've been spinning my motor up to 6400 rpm since my new tune and no issues. You MUST take out the inner dampeners. Multiple engine builders have told me the springs would work fine for the comp cc503 and even a little bigger. I've heard of more beehives breaking than any others and that's the most common one. I have even had the springs measured for coil bind and they match up with what bullets site advertises. Sometimes, if you know what you're doing you can save a lot of money. I think majority of problems people have with anything is due to improper installation.

Most people on forums aren't mechanics, including myself, and there are a lot of little common things that we wouldn't know about where as someone who works on cars and builds engines everyday knows like the back of their hand. If my local engine and machine shop tells me the springs will work and loyd elliot says they work, then why wouldn't I trust them? What do they have to gain by giving you false information?

Honestly, the cc503 is a small cam relative to what engine builders are used to seeing. even the common cc306 and gm847 are nothing compared to what shops are used to seeing.

speed_demon24

iTrader: (6)

Maybe because it would only take 2 minutes to hear what the people who designed the spring have to say. I highly doubt a local machine shop and engine shop have spintrons at their disposal.

ryanisfast

Yeah... I talked to bullet racing myself before I ordered the spring, and they told me it would work fine for the set up I have. Just sayin... People spend a lot extra on the better known valve springs, retainers and keepers, when there could possibly be a better spring for way cheaper that allows you to reuse the retainers and keepers.

It's like the pacesetter longtubes when they first came out. People were thinking they wouldn't be as good, but turns out that they perform just as good or better than some of the name brand companies for significantly less!