JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

I'm waiting on replies from Tick & RPM, but I thought I'd throw it out here also. I’m researching whether I need additional upgrades to my T56 transmission. I'm currently using a LS7 clutch with a Fidanza flywheel, but I plan to change to a RPS BC2PK-04LSX-AL this year.

Goals:
• Staying naturally aspirated, I’ll be happy with 450-500RWTQ and 500-600RWHP.
• Daily driver, with limited autocross and road race track days (aka HPDE, not wheel-to wheel competition, but controlled passing). No plans for formal drag racing.
• Minimizing weight yet remaining reliable

Looking at my receipts, these are the tranny parts I've replaced since the car was new:
2002, from D&D Performance
5-6 synchro assy
5-6 fork
2.66 5/6th driven gear 37/29T
3-4 fork (Steel)

2007, from Six Speeds Inc:
Billet Slider Keys
Carbon Synchro Ring kit
1-2 slider assembly
Reverse slider assembly
shifter high hat
1-2 bronze fork pads
3-4 bronze fork pads

I’ve read that a T56 Magnum adds roughly 20lbs over a T56, and I’d like to avoid adding that weight if I don’t need that strong of a transmission. I also don't want to spend $$$$ unnecessarily.

Thanks!

stevieturbo

If yours is working fine, then there arent really any upgrades that are going to make it stronger without actually replacing the gears.

And when most gears available now are not genuine Tremec....it'd be hard to see that any standard replacements would be any better. Although some places do sell what they claim is a Viper type input shaft which is a larger diameter, where the normal input steps down.

Floorman279

iTrader: (11)

the viper shaft is better but not a strong in a nobody as it is in a viper from the trimming. a bone stock 2000 and up t56 doesnt beginning to become questionable until 5000 plus sticky clutch dumps with 550- 600 hp........very good trans for our cheap cars. one thing gm did right with our cars is that trans.

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

The shifting has become a bit notchy the last few months, but I'm notoriously lazy on tranny/rearend fluid changes and the rear end has been howling for months. The last time I had the tranny rebuilt locally it was $250 for the R&R and $250 for the rebuild (plus parts I provide), that's easier than $2-4K.

I'll get the rear end rebuilt, the rear main seal leak fixed when the clutch is upgraded and see if the shifting improves. Maybe I'll change out the tranny fluid for some Amsoil Torque Drive.

stevieturbo

Shifting could be oil, clutch or the trans.

If you wanted to do a rebuild, it'd certainly do no harm to throw new blockers etc in and inspect the syncro hubs etc. Although if it gets to the stage of needing new gears etc, it could get pricey. Depends how fussy you wanted to be really.

But new oil is a cheap easy option.

Darth_V8r

iTrader: (4)

Your planned lighter clutch can help with the shifting too by taking MOI off your input shaft

gnx7

iTrader: (28)

You are going to put a $2400 clutch behind the combo you propose to build but concerned about the T56 Magnum cost? Get an aluminum flywheel and McLeod RST and never look back.. Great daily driver setup..... super budget friendly.

Go drive a 2008+ Z06 or 2010+ Camaro with the TR6060 which is basically a T56 Magnum (the internals) for smoothness/shifting purposes.... if you don't like how buttery smooth that trans is.... then keep rebuilding yours. There is NO comparison to an older T56 and a new Magnum. It sounds like you really enjoy your car and plan to keep it for the future.... the newer style transmission really modernizes any LS setup running the other older T56 developed in 1991 and released in the LT1 cars.
$250 rebuild labor is insanely cheap though..... haha

Floorman279

iTrader: (11)

i might be wrong but the magnum ratios are cookie...........i like my .50 6th gear and the 2.66 first.....id go taller before i went shorter....i mean i guess i could bandaid it a little by running 3.55s but...

stevieturbo

Then buy a 2.66 Magnum and have the taller 5/6 fitted to it.

I did like that gearset myself, but on cost etc I just opted for the cheaper Magnum with the 2.66 but shorter 5/6.
It leaves 5th gear shorter than I would like, but as most speed events I might attend here have reduced distance to 1/2 mile, it's not so much of a concern. At a push 5th should still see 200mph for me and I doubt I'd ever pull that in a 1/2 anyway.

Floorman279

iTrader: (11)

they did discontinue the off the shelf .74/.50, so yea like you said it would have to be an add on. i currently have a 32 spline t56 so pretty tank worthy, but still shifts shitty even with the triple syncros and 1000 miles on it......5th is a notch....tick master, monster clutch and all

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

I don't mind buying the T56 Magnum if the subjective benefits are there for my application. It doesn't appear I need it from a reliability standpoint and it's a big expense simply for improved shifting feel. I have looked into the different tranny gearing combos but I don't recall which combo of gears I felt was best for my application.

I'm still leaning towards the RPS, but I just read an opinion that "The RPS ... will be a bit of an on/off switch with carbon(?) discs - and that will get old fast on a daily driver. " I basically wanted this RPS based upon Darth's and Tony's earlier reviews. I seem to recall Darth saying his RPS drove like stock after getting the correct master bore? Darth?

My Tick adjustable master was purchased in 2009 and short of removing it I have no idea what the bore size is. Not crazy about 1) removing it just to check or 2) buying a new one outright just to make sure I have the right bore size, but at this point I'm leaning towards buying a new unit with the 11/16" bore to minimize shop time.

Floorman279

iTrader: (11)

the problem with darth is he takes a ton i mean a ton of time to dial in his car and get it to where he wants it to be. i say this because i read quite a few of his posts and can kinda tell he has the knowledge to make just about anything work, within reason, due to being a car guru and semi relentless to get it the way he wants it. something many forum members including myself dont have the patience to do. honestly i think the mcleod suggestion earlier would be good for you.....ill be getting an rps eventually cause mines not a daily

stevieturbo

A full face carbon clutch should drive just fine.

Che70velle

iTrader: (6)

Floorman279

iTrader: (11)

at that time they definitely were using 1 size bore, and i believe it was the 7/8". i would recommend that as well, but mamo also has stated the rps doesnt need much fluid travel and will work on stock hydraulics just fine. honestly i would think most twin disks could work with stock masters under 7000 rpms

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

I spoke with Nate @ Tick.
* Agrees that the Magnum is a much better all around design, but is overkill for my application
* He isn't ecstatic about McLeod & RPS due to customer complaints, but likes the Monster line
* My current adjustable bore is 7/8". I can buy just the cylinder separately @$175 with the bore of my choice and just swap the cylinder.
* He recommends 7/10" bore on 7.25-9" clutches, but thinks it would be fine for larger clutches also
* I shouldn't have any street driving problems on the twin carbon/carbon or twin carbon/organic clutches we discussed
* He suggested looking at the Monster Level 1 Twin

The Monster LT1-S (~$1000) is advertised as 54lbs
The Monster Level 1 Twin (~$1500) is advertised as 44lbs
I'm guessing my LS7 clutch with 13lb flywheel is ~42lbs
The McLeod RST (~$750) was weighed at ~37lbs in another post here
The RPS BC2PK-04LSX-AL (~$2400) is advertised as 25lbs.

I'm leery about going back to the stock master cylinder. Having dealt with the pedal sticking to the floor high RPM shifting problems when the car was brand new new leaves a bad taste in my mouth, and I've not had any problems with the Tick unit since it was installed in 2009.

Floorman279

iTrader: (11)

did you happen to ask him what RPS problems he is aware of? this is news to me.....the mcleod one i believe he is referring to the disk destroying input shafts but i thought that is done with now

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

Primarily complaints about slipping within a few hundred miles. He's had more complaints about McLeod than RPS, but he rarely sells an RPS clutch.

Floorman279

iTrader: (11)

maybe because its a 2000 dollar clutch, and you mine as well go with the lightened version for a few hundred more from the one person who does it. i find the slipping part hard to believe tho, but im not clutch expert

Darth_V8r

iTrader: (4)

Hope all this info helps...

I had the RPS BC2 with the tick master, and it was a bit of a heavy light switch. The standard tick master is 7/8" bore vs stock 3/4" bore. However, the tilton master format is pretty standard, so once you put that wedge thing in there, swapping to a smaller master cylinder isn't bad. Word of advice -- pull the brake booster. I tried doing it under the car and was getting quite frustrated. Remove the booster, and it's a fairly quick swap. I went to what is advertised as 11/16" bore, but is actually a 0.700" bore. I had to lengthen the rod about as far as it will go, but pedal effort and clutch modulation are great with the smaller bore.

In general, I think that as the diaphragm diameter gets smaller, travel of the PP fingers will reduce, so you can get away with moving less fluid - i.e. smaller master.

If I pull the transmission apart again, I'll end up putting in the tilton HRB. I drove LazerLemonTA's vette with the RPS and that tilton release bearing, and it is far better than the F body stock unit. Far more consistent release point under spirited driving. Within ten minutes I was quite jealous. And he still has the stock vette master cylinder on his. I want to say Lazer has the aluminum flywheel too, but not 100% sure.
LOL, thanks (I think).

I have no hesitation recommending the RPS, and I'm approaching 20K miles on it now. I will say, go easy on the ARP flywheel bolt lube or you will have slipping issues, but that's any clutch really. But I also understand, it's expensive, so it's a big risk to those buying it if they don't like it. If I was to go back and do it again, I'd do it again. I would get the aluminum flywheel vs the steel flywheel next time around, but be prepared for some tuning "fun".