projected vs non-projected plugs
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Can someone help me out here? They are recommending a tr-6 for a h/c 150 shot 6.0
Can someone help me out here? They are recommending a tr-6 for a h/c 150 shot 6.0
Worst part is the poor guy who posts up and asks the question ASSume these guys are experts and take there posts as gospel.
***** crazy
Depends on how much HP it makes on motor.
We run 7's in my motor N/A ... if we ran a 150 shot we would run 9's
A aggressive H/C motor with 150 shot I would use a 7.
There is almost no HP difference between a 6 and 7 so why not use the safer plug?
With a 7 in there you will run just as fast as you will with a 6 but may have 1 or 2 more degrees of timing.
We run 7's in my motor N/A ... if we ran a 150 shot we would run 9's
A aggressive H/C motor with 150 shot I would use a 7.
There is almost no HP difference between a 6 and 7 so why not use the safer plug?
With a 7 in there you will run just as fast as you will with a 6 but may have 1 or 2 more degrees of timing.
Depends on how much HP it makes on motor.
We run 7's in my motor N/A ... if we ran a 150 shot we would run 9's
A aggressive H/C motor with 150 shot I would use a 7.
There is almost no HP difference between a 6 and 7 so why not use the safer plug?
With a 7 in there you will run just as fast as you will with a 6 but may have 1 or 2 more degrees of timing.
We run 7's in my motor N/A ... if we ran a 150 shot we would run 9's
A aggressive H/C motor with 150 shot I would use a 7.
There is almost no HP difference between a 6 and 7 so why not use the safer plug?
With a 7 in there you will run just as fast as you will with a 6 but may have 1 or 2 more degrees of timing.
Robert
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 86
Likes: 0
From: Boston, TAXachusetts
Depends on how much HP it makes on motor.
We run 7's in my motor N/A ... if we ran a 150 shot we would run 9's
A aggressive H/C motor with 150 shot I would use a 7.
There is almost no HP difference between a 6 and 7 so why not use the safer plug?
With a 7 in there you will run just as fast as you will with a 6 but may have 1 or 2 more degrees of timing.
We run 7's in my motor N/A ... if we ran a 150 shot we would run 9's
A aggressive H/C motor with 150 shot I would use a 7.
There is almost no HP difference between a 6 and 7 so why not use the safer plug?
With a 7 in there you will run just as fast as you will with a 6 but may have 1 or 2 more degrees of timing.
so, i guess just run a br7ef and call it a day? or have a few tunes one for a br6ef and a br7ef...
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 86
Likes: 0
From: Boston, TAXachusetts
I agree. it's not really a matter of over all HP, really. It's a matter of a projected tip plug not being correct for nitrous, end of story. You could get away with the TR6 and a 200 shot, but that doesn't mean it's correct or the best route to take. I also run a BR7 as my daily plug and my motor n/a is only 430rwhp and it works fine (lower HP or VE compared to ATV's motor). The LSx has a pretty good ignition system so running a recessed tipped plug it will still ignite the mix fine, remember how good these motors are in the VE area. A motor of past and crappy inefficient heads might have issues using a recessed tipped plug in place of stock extended tip plugs. This is where some of them blanket statements that try to cover everything comes into effect. The TR6 may be the best plug for other motors when needing colder and keeping an extended tip plug, but not optimum or needed for the LSx and spray. The LSx from the get go, has a whole new set of rules when tuning for the spray, IMO, compared to the motors that fall into the old blanket statement suggestions. This includes a/f ratio, timing, and plugs...
Robert
Robert
630 or so crank hp here. i use a 7 plug. well actually i use whatever the parts store has if i dont have a back up.
i try to keep 2-3 sets of plugs just so i dont have to hunt when i need them.
i try to keep 2-3 sets of plugs just so i dont have to hunt when i need them.
Depends on how much HP it makes on motor.
We run 7's in my motor N/A ... if we ran a 150 shot we would run 9's
A aggressive H/C motor with 150 shot I would use a 7.
There is almost no HP difference between a 6 and 7 so why not use the safer plug?
With a 7 in there you will run just as fast as you will with a 6 but may have 1 or 2 more degrees of timing.
We run 7's in my motor N/A ... if we ran a 150 shot we would run 9's
A aggressive H/C motor with 150 shot I would use a 7.
There is almost no HP difference between a 6 and 7 so why not use the safer plug?
With a 7 in there you will run just as fast as you will with a 6 but may have 1 or 2 more degrees of timing.
ATVracr, he didn't mention that he daily drove the car but I have a feeling he does, would you still recommend the 7? robert, i know im beating this to death, so if the car is tuned to each plug will you see much difference in mpg and idle between the 6 & 7. i have 7s in my car now but ive been waiting on injectors for three weeks now :/
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Verdad Gallardo Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 86
Likes: 0
From: Boston, TAXachusetts
ATVracr, he didn't mention that he daily drove the car but I have a feeling he does, would you still recommend the 7? robert, i know im beating this to death, so if the car is tuned to each plug will you see much difference in mpg and idle between the 6 & 7. i have 7s in my car now but ive been waiting on injectors for three weeks now :/
I don't think this is to far from our talk on tuning and may give more insight on what we have been covering. If not forgive me for getting off topic a bit here.
Robert
ATVracr, he didn't mention that he daily drove the car but I have a feeling he does, would you still recommend the 7? robert, i know im beating this to death, so if the car is tuned to each plug will you see much difference in mpg and idle between the 6 & 7. i have 7s in my car now but ive been waiting on injectors for three weeks now :/
Robert
Robert, we have sprayed over 400 without any head gasket issues.
If the tune up is correct you wont have any issues there, detonation is what causes them to lift not cyl. pressure.
Ours is a 4 bolt set up with std. size ARP 2000 studs, cometic gaskets.
If the tune up is correct you wont have any issues there, detonation is what causes them to lift not cyl. pressure.
Ours is a 4 bolt set up with std. size ARP 2000 studs, cometic gaskets.
Really, you think only detonation will lift a head? or push water? In any case I have not pushed water, lifted head, blown out gaskets or none of that fun stuff, LOL, nor on any set-up I helped with. So I am not an expert in that arena, and hope not to find out the hard way. I didn't have any idea you guys went 400 already, congrats.
Robert
Wow, that sounds very promising. I am running the GM MLS gaskets as was rec by a GM engineer buddy. Some prefer Cometic, but I am not so sure they are superior to the GM stuff. Your thoughts?
Really, you think only detonation will lift a head? or push water? In any case I have not pushed water, lifted head, blown out gaskets or none of that fun stuff, LOL, nor on any set-up I helped with. So I am not an expert in that arena, and hope not to find out the hard way. I didn't have any idea you guys went 400 already, congrats.
Robert
Really, you think only detonation will lift a head? or push water? In any case I have not pushed water, lifted head, blown out gaskets or none of that fun stuff, LOL, nor on any set-up I helped with. So I am not an expert in that arena, and hope not to find out the hard way. I didn't have any idea you guys went 400 already, congrats.
Robert
We have sprayed close to 500 on Shiz's motor 2 years ago and not lifted the head or pushed water. We are going to a 6 bolt set up this year so that 475shot on his 4 bolt motor will be the limit that we know of on a 4 bolt set up. I honestly think that if the tune is right the head gasket/lifiting is not an issue.
Never used them so I dont know, we have always used cometic and never had an issue. We dont fix what aint broke.
We have sprayed close to 500 on Shiz's motor 2 years ago and not lifted the head or pushed water. We are going to a 6 bolt set up this year so that 475shot on his 4 bolt motor will be the limit that we know of on a 4 bolt set up. I honestly think that if the tune is right the head gasket/lifiting is not an issue.
We have sprayed close to 500 on Shiz's motor 2 years ago and not lifted the head or pushed water. We are going to a 6 bolt set up this year so that 475shot on his 4 bolt motor will be the limit that we know of on a 4 bolt set up. I honestly think that if the tune is right the head gasket/lifiting is not an issue.
Robert
Minor clarification, but you know this anyway; Detonation will cause a sharp uncontrolled rise in cylinder temperature and pressure. This higher then normal pressure and the area that it reacts on, results in a force that can exceed the limits of the head bolts/studs and lift the heads, cause head gasket failure etc.
Minor clarification, but you know this anyway; Detonation will cause a sharp uncontrolled rise in cylinder temperature and pressure. This higher then normal pressure and the area that it reacts on, results in a force that can exceed the limits of the head bolts/studs and lift the heads, cause head gasket failure etc.
Robert
Mine would be right around 500bhp. On the spray I have been to 741bhp and 824tq at the crank. The short block is built to handle 1000hp including a 300/350hp n2o shot, so i have plenty of room to grow. This leads me to my next couple questions in my quest to make 500+ RWHp n/a, like you have. On your 408 what heads did you decide to go with and intake and why? Also, what cam are you running? I studded with the L19 studs, did you do something similar? IIRC, the L19s have a clamping force of 30/40% more than the standard ARP studs. However, I have never had a head lift on any of the LSx combos I have done, but some do at the levels we are spraying. My goal is spray a 350rwhp shot, but so far have only gone to 300, have you been past this point yet? Maybe ATV stated sometime back that he did a 325 or 350, ATV? Then if either of you have gone over 300hp any insight would be welcome. It seems that at this level things need to be so close to spot on and absolutely the best race gas...
I don't think this is to far from our talk on tuning and may give more insight on what we have been covering. If not forgive me for getting off topic a bit here.
Robert
I don't think this is to far from our talk on tuning and may give more insight on what we have been covering. If not forgive me for getting off topic a bit here.
Robert
cam is a pat g spec. its fairly tiny, but runs like a bandit.
247/255 624 624 on a 108 icl.
"PRAY" is a user on here and has a simialr setup in his z06.... it put down 575/530, about the hp i figure mine would do if i wasnt eating up dyno power with this auto and big stall.
i have a set of lightweight pistons in the motor, and with the material they are forged from, im limited to around a 200 shot on this setup, but thats all i ever planned to really go anyway. still tweaking on motor. i want to get the most out of it before i put the nitrous back on this motor. i know once the plate gets bolted on, n/a times wont matter anymore.
ATVracr, he didn't mention that he daily drove the car but I have a feeling he does, would you still recommend the 7? robert, i know im beating this to death, so if the car is tuned to each plug will you see much difference in mpg and idle between the 6 & 7. i have 7s in my car now but ive been waiting on injectors for three weeks now :/
LOL wow! I only noticed a slight drop in mpg, like 1-2 with the converter locked when I went from TR6's to NGK 8's non projected plugs. I still get above 25 mpg from 60-75 mph. City sucks around 15-20 converter unlocked under 50 mph.