Tuning with Granatelli???
10-21-2003, 09:27 PM
#1
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Tuning with Granatelli??? This weekend at the track my car went the slowest it ever has...13.32 @106.6..........Turns out i have a bad MAF sensor...thinking of just buying a Granatelli...since its a 85 mm will i need tuning when putting this on my car?? Also i put a stock MAF on it off a 98.....but the SES light still came on...got to looking at the part # for it and it was different, so hopefully it wasn't the right one for my car.....So will i need tuning or not.....
10-22-2003, 06:55 PM
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Re: Tuning with Granatelli??? Granatelli makes several versions now.
The old ones used to lean out the car
a fair bit. Those helped the '98-'99,
maybe but hurt the '00-'02s. You want
to have a good understanding of which
one you're buying, or you want some
more time spent with Edit.
It's not the diameter, it's how they
jack with the electronics that makes
tuning necessary.
With only headers on that car you should
have negligible HP loss in the stock MAF.
The stock MAFs are pretty cheap. How did
you know the MAF is actually bad, anyway?
The old ones used to lean out the car
a fair bit. Those helped the '98-'99,
maybe but hurt the '00-'02s. You want
to have a good understanding of which
one you're buying, or you want some
more time spent with Edit.
It's not the diameter, it's how they
jack with the electronics that makes
tuning necessary.
With only headers on that car you should
have negligible HP loss in the stock MAF.
The stock MAFs are pretty cheap. How did
you know the MAF is actually bad, anyway?
10-22-2003, 09:23 PM
#5
TECH Senior Member
Re: Tuning with Granatelli??? BTW, you could use a MAFT and Autotap to dial in any MAF. Just set it so that the Ltrims at idle are just on the negative side. Then set the WOT mixture to suit you.
10-23-2003, 11:22 AM
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Re: Tuning with Granatelli??? One reason i think its bad is because i had my car scanned about a 2 weeks ago by auto zone. There were 4 codes that were being tripped. 1 was skip shift solenoid(P0803), 2 Heater circuit for Oxygen sensor 1 in bank 1(P0135, 3 Heater circuit for oxygen sensor 1 in bank 2(P0155) I changed both of the Oxygen Sensors and the light was still on so that why i think its the MAF, because it set the code P0102 Mass air flow input is lower than expected for the current engine operating conditions..FYI i just switched out the rear Oxygen Sensors to the front...I'm kinda new at this Colonel what is DTC..Thanks alot
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10-23-2003, 11:48 AM
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Re: Tuning with Granatelli??? DTC is the code # you are showing. Did you buy new 02 sensors? Just moving them around will not help, but you should see the code come back after a few driving trips
Now for the maf code try cleaning the small sensors in the maf. You will find three of them. Use a spray carb cleaner; make sure you get both sides of the sensor. Easiest way is to remove the maf ends. Let them dry before putting the maf back on. If you still have the maf screen you might want to try and clean it to.
What about your air filter? When’s the last time you changed it?
Have you check all your fuses? I might be wrong but are there fuse’s that run the maf and the heaters in the o2 sensors?
Now for the maf code try cleaning the small sensors in the maf. You will find three of them. Use a spray carb cleaner; make sure you get both sides of the sensor. Easiest way is to remove the maf ends. Let them dry before putting the maf back on. If you still have the maf screen you might want to try and clean it to.
What about your air filter? When’s the last time you changed it?
Have you check all your fuses? I might be wrong but are there fuse’s that run the maf and the heaters in the o2 sensors?
10-23-2003, 12:18 PM
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Re: Tuning with Granatelli??? dissonance that you said something about fuses...it does keep blowing the engine sensor fuse which runs those 4..i have cleaned the sensors twice, and i don't have the screen..my air filter is in good condition...
10-23-2003, 01:18 PM
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Re: Tuning with Granatelli??? The headers are what's making the O2 heater codes
and probably this means your closed-loop mixture
is having trouble and carrying that trouble over
to WOT.
GMAF airflow improvement is going to give you a
very small potential gain. GMAF mixture effects
may put you better (naturally-over-rich tune) or
send you to pining hell (naturally-lean tune). On
an '00 I'd bet the latter, but until you have your
O2s working right all bets are off.
Header wrap on the collector and all except the
first couple of inches of primaries might keep
enough heat to light up the O2s without hurting
any welds. Like, wrap whatever you can't see.
Otherwise, I think running the O2 heater power
full time (and making the PCM like it) is the way
to fix it. That's harness rewiring. Somebody ought
to make a kit....
Dunno how long O2 sensors' heater elements last
under continuous power, but seems like it's a
thing to try. I figure it would involve giving
the PCM some dummy loads and putting either
IGN or ballasted IGN to the heaters.
and probably this means your closed-loop mixture
is having trouble and carrying that trouble over
to WOT.
GMAF airflow improvement is going to give you a
very small potential gain. GMAF mixture effects
may put you better (naturally-over-rich tune) or
send you to pining hell (naturally-lean tune). On
an '00 I'd bet the latter, but until you have your
O2s working right all bets are off.
Header wrap on the collector and all except the
first couple of inches of primaries might keep
enough heat to light up the O2s without hurting
any welds. Like, wrap whatever you can't see.
Otherwise, I think running the O2 heater power
full time (and making the PCM like it) is the way
to fix it. That's harness rewiring. Somebody ought
to make a kit....
Dunno how long O2 sensors' heater elements last
under continuous power, but seems like it's a
thing to try. I figure it would involve giving
the PCM some dummy loads and putting either
IGN or ballasted IGN to the heaters.
10-23-2003, 01:31 PM
#12
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Re: Tuning with Granatelli??? WoW, jimmyblue you really lost me there.....To fix this problem that i am having should i just replace the O2s with brand new ones to see if that fixes it....
10-23-2003, 01:42 PM
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Re: Tuning with Granatelli???
10-23-2003, 07:06 PM
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Re: Tuning with Granatelli??? Like I said, the problem is the headers let the
O2s run too cool. You can change the O2s and get
temporary relief but it won't last indefinitely.
You have to keep more heat in or supply heat
power, if you want them to work long and happy.
O2s run too cool. You can change the O2s and get
temporary relief but it won't last indefinitely.
You have to keep more heat in or supply heat
power, if you want them to work long and happy.
10-28-2003, 09:15 PM
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O2 sensors on the LS1's have a heater circuit to keep the sensor heated up, so I don’t think the problem is the fact you have headers. You also said you have blown a fuse? Seems to keep blowing it? I would think that you might have crushed a wire and have a short.
When did this problem start? After header install? If so how many miles after the install? Did you get the headers jet-hot? Or some kinda protestant?
A lot guys run headers with out heater circuit codes, me included… "it's not normal with a header install" you can tell if you have a problem with the heater in the o2 by letting the car cool over night then turning the key to run but don’t start the car, then get under the car and put your hand around one of the o2 sensors that’s getting the code and see if it starts to get hot. Should take less then 2 minuets. I’m not sure how hot they get but it could be very hot. If it’s not heating up check the others. You should find some heating up “if you still have your rear’s check them to. Oh make sure your fuses are good before you do this, also check them after words
If you have autotap do the same thing and watch the o2’s while the car is in run but not running you should see the O2 mv go down slowly as the o2 sensor heats up.
I think wrapping headers is a good idea but if you have a jet-hot coating then it is point less. Wrap can cause rust because water gets trapped in the wrap. It can also over heat the metal and could cause it to crack.
When did this problem start? After header install? If so how many miles after the install? Did you get the headers jet-hot? Or some kinda protestant?
A lot guys run headers with out heater circuit codes, me included… "it's not normal with a header install" you can tell if you have a problem with the heater in the o2 by letting the car cool over night then turning the key to run but don’t start the car, then get under the car and put your hand around one of the o2 sensors that’s getting the code and see if it starts to get hot. Should take less then 2 minuets. I’m not sure how hot they get but it could be very hot. If it’s not heating up check the others. You should find some heating up “if you still have your rear’s check them to. Oh make sure your fuses are good before you do this, also check them after words
If you have autotap do the same thing and watch the o2’s while the car is in run but not running you should see the O2 mv go down slowly as the o2 sensor heats up.
I think wrapping headers is a good idea but if you have a jet-hot coating then it is point less. Wrap can cause rust because water gets trapped in the wrap. It can also over heat the metal and could cause it to crack.
10-29-2003, 01:32 PM
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Many systems only run O2 heat during warmup and then let it go off.
I don't know whether the LS-1 does this or not, but suspect that
it's the same deal, after the O2s are -expected- to be hot the
heater power may be removed for efficiency's sake and heater
element life.
What does the heater code mean? Maybe it means that the PCM
has reapplied heater power because without it the O2s read too
low, and it thinks this is a fault?
I would like to know for sure about this, the heater control
scheme & trouble codes about it.
I don't know whether the LS-1 does this or not, but suspect that
it's the same deal, after the O2s are -expected- to be hot the
heater power may be removed for efficiency's sake and heater
element life.
What does the heater code mean? Maybe it means that the PCM
has reapplied heater power because without it the O2s read too
low, and it thinks this is a fault?
I would like to know for sure about this, the heater control
scheme & trouble codes about it.
