p1133 and p1153
p1133 and p1153 CAR: 2002 z28 A4
MODS: LSR Comp cam, 5.3 heads, fti 3000 converter, long tubes/full exhaust, and tuned with hp tuners.
Check engine lights:
P1133 Bank 1 fuel control shifted lean
P1153 Bank 2 fuel control shifted lean (after swapping sides)
Conditions:
Start up, innovate wideband pegs 22 lean and holds for 45 seconds or so before richening up.
WOT, starts at 12.5 and then pegs the innovate to 22 lean.
If I shut the car off for 5 minutes or so and turn it back on, it'll peg 22 lean for a second and then idle around 16.0 toe 18.0 for a minute before returning to 15.2 area. If I rev it more then quarter throttle it'll richen up.
Idle is 14.8 to 16.1 for the most part. Mostly 15.2.
Crusing. ^^^ Same.
WHAT I'VE TRIED SO FAR:
I pulled both 02 sensors and swapped sides. I only had p1133 at first, after the 02 swap, I then had both codes. It didn't make the condition worse or better.
This is a video of the wideband when the car starts normally 100% cold:
The way the idle is above, in my opinion is rich. Not rich enough to hurt anything. It is only on start up for 45 seconds if not less.
Here is what my 02's looked like after I pulled them out:
My questions are:
Do I replace the 02's? They look extremely old. I had the 02 heater codes pop up multiple times on cold days, but has since dissapeared with warmer days. I had longtubes way before my hc/motor build with a diable 93 tune and never had any cel's for 02's. Do I replace the 02's? Tons of threads say corvette rears or bosch sensors, but other threads end with this not working.
Is there something to do in hp tuners? I can meet with my tuner if need be. Idk if there is a fix for this. I don't mind buying 02's, but I don't want to destroy another set if that is the case.
MODS: LSR Comp cam, 5.3 heads, fti 3000 converter, long tubes/full exhaust, and tuned with hp tuners.
Check engine lights:
P1133 Bank 1 fuel control shifted lean
P1153 Bank 2 fuel control shifted lean (after swapping sides)
Conditions:
Start up, innovate wideband pegs 22 lean and holds for 45 seconds or so before richening up.
WOT, starts at 12.5 and then pegs the innovate to 22 lean.
If I shut the car off for 5 minutes or so and turn it back on, it'll peg 22 lean for a second and then idle around 16.0 toe 18.0 for a minute before returning to 15.2 area. If I rev it more then quarter throttle it'll richen up.
Idle is 14.8 to 16.1 for the most part. Mostly 15.2.
Crusing. ^^^ Same.
WHAT I'VE TRIED SO FAR:
I pulled both 02 sensors and swapped sides. I only had p1133 at first, after the 02 swap, I then had both codes. It didn't make the condition worse or better.
This is a video of the wideband when the car starts normally 100% cold:
The way the idle is above, in my opinion is rich. Not rich enough to hurt anything. It is only on start up for 45 seconds if not less.
Here is what my 02's looked like after I pulled them out:
My questions are:
Do I replace the 02's? They look extremely old. I had the 02 heater codes pop up multiple times on cold days, but has since dissapeared with warmer days. I had longtubes way before my hc/motor build with a diable 93 tune and never had any cel's for 02's. Do I replace the 02's? Tons of threads say corvette rears or bosch sensors, but other threads end with this not working.
Is there something to do in hp tuners? I can meet with my tuner if need be. Idk if there is a fix for this. I don't mind buying 02's, but I don't want to destroy another set if that is the case.
Last edited by flattusmaximus78; Dec 10, 2012 at 05:00 PM.
Actual HPTuner code details:
P1133 - HO2S Insufficient Switching Bank 1 Sensor 1
P1153 - HO2S Insufficient Switching Bank 2 Sensor 1
if you do searching on these codes I believe you will find that these are turned off, to not reported by a LOT of people. Usually after a header install or exhaust mode this happens. Either the 02s aren't far enough in the exhaust stream or something of this matter.
As far as your wideband, as long as it is reliable, it sounds like you need to tune your Open Loop fueling table and your closed loop fueling tables (MAF, VE, PE) to get your fueling spot on.
P1133 - HO2S Insufficient Switching Bank 1 Sensor 1
P1153 - HO2S Insufficient Switching Bank 2 Sensor 1
if you do searching on these codes I believe you will find that these are turned off, to not reported by a LOT of people. Usually after a header install or exhaust mode this happens. Either the 02s aren't far enough in the exhaust stream or something of this matter.
As far as your wideband, as long as it is reliable, it sounds like you need to tune your Open Loop fueling table and your closed loop fueling tables (MAF, VE, PE) to get your fueling spot on.
Actual HPTuner code details:
P1133 - HO2S Insufficient Switching Bank 1 Sensor 1
P1153 - HO2S Insufficient Switching Bank 2 Sensor 1
if you do searching on these codes I believe you will find that these are turned off, to not reported by a LOT of people. Usually after a header install or exhaust mode this happens. Either the 02s aren't far enough in the exhaust stream or something of this matter.
As far as your wideband, as long as it is reliable, it sounds like you need to tune your Open Loop fueling table and your closed loop fueling tables (MAF, VE, PE) to get your fueling spot on.
P1133 - HO2S Insufficient Switching Bank 1 Sensor 1
P1153 - HO2S Insufficient Switching Bank 2 Sensor 1
if you do searching on these codes I believe you will find that these are turned off, to not reported by a LOT of people. Usually after a header install or exhaust mode this happens. Either the 02s aren't far enough in the exhaust stream or something of this matter.
As far as your wideband, as long as it is reliable, it sounds like you need to tune your Open Loop fueling table and your closed loop fueling tables (MAF, VE, PE) to get your fueling spot on.
As you said, I do see a lot that just switch it to no report. Seems that replacing the 02's, wrapping them, or switching to the other supposed "better 02's" never works. I have about 700 miles on this tune, but over 30,000 miles on the 02 sensors. Literally before this code popped up, it never acted like this. 14.8 to 15.2 at idle/cruising and 12.5 at wot all the way to 6500rpms.
When the car pops the code up, is this was causes a change if the way the car runs. IE: If I change it to no report it will reverse the lean pattern? Or does it just keep the eye sore off the dash?
Thank you for the response btw!
LS1Tech Sponsor
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,932
Likes: 12
From: CT
those codes normally have to be disabled due to the long tube headers...
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06MonteSS / DiabLew Tune
2014 Camaro 2SS/RS - LS3, 6-speed manual, short-throw performance shifter, NPP dual-mode performance exhaust, 1LE front splitter, ZL1 rockers, Z28 Rear Spoiler, all paint-matched Red Rock Metallic, BMR strut tower brace, Cold Air Inductions cold air intake, Apex Motorsports, Inc. catch-can, Custom DiabLew Tune
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06MonteSS / DiabLew Tune
2014 Camaro 2SS/RS - LS3, 6-speed manual, short-throw performance shifter, NPP dual-mode performance exhaust, 1LE front splitter, ZL1 rockers, Z28 Rear Spoiler, all paint-matched Red Rock Metallic, BMR strut tower brace, Cold Air Inductions cold air intake, Apex Motorsports, Inc. catch-can, Custom DiabLew Tune
www.diablewtune.com -- www.diablocustomtune.com -- www.diablocustomtunegm.com
Not sure which O2's are which in your photo's, but they look like their getting alot of fuel. Almost looks like your getting a false lean and it's dumping fuel to compensate. Have you check for vacuum and exhaust leaks?
What do your fuel trims show? O2 voltages?
Jon
What do your fuel trims show? O2 voltages?
Jon
I do see what you are saying, but If it was dumping fuel it doesn't show on my wide band. The code says force lean and my wide band is lean just as you see in the video.
My exhaust is tight as a ****, everything has clamps and trz motorsports did the welds on anything welded. Shes solid, def no leaks. No vacuum leaks as well. Car was put together real well.
I swapped 02's back to where they orginally were and the p1133 came back, but p1153 did not. Leads to beleive the drivers side 02 is bad. I heard unplug the computer for a few it will reset fuel trims. Going to try that and see if it reverses the lean condition. If so then I will swap 02's and see what the tuner wants to do. Just trouble shooting before I have him or myself drive to delete the code.
Thanks guys, I always appreciate the time and answers. Any other questions that may be helpful FIRE away.
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turn off the codes and see what you get. you should be able to reset fuel trims with diablo ? maybe?
if you need or want to try new 02s, hit advance and use promo code A123 (or google techbargains / retailmenot for better discounts @ advance)
when you crank the car, even cold or warm, it will start in open loop and either use the OL table until warmed up or briefly if already warm, that slight richness upon startup is normal
if you need or want to try new 02s, hit advance and use promo code A123 (or google techbargains / retailmenot for better discounts @ advance)
when you crank the car, even cold or warm, it will start in open loop and either use the OL table until warmed up or briefly if already warm, that slight richness upon startup is normal
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Verdad Gallardo turn off the codes and see what you get. you should be able to reset fuel trims with diablo ? maybe?
My friend that tunes the car said that unplugging the computer for 6 hours should reset the changes the computer made for the code. He say's they will come back, but it would give us a good idea. Unfortunately, if my diablo is capable I can't use it for that purpose. Someone else plugged it in while I had a differne't tune in the car. I beleive upon doing so he may have saved that tune. Just incase I'm going to send it to them so that I can use it to modify timing for spray since the car was tuned with hp tuners.
if you need or want to try new 02s, hit advance and use promo code A123 (or google techbargains / retailmenot for better discounts @ advance)
Awesome buddy, thank you!
when you crank the car, even cold or warm, it will start in open loop and either use the OL table until warmed up or briefly if already warm, that slight richness upon startup is normal
Yeah, I'm not worried about it, my mustangs were always in the 13's until warm and this is just a tad richer. It is how the car liked it, as far as cold start idle.
My friend that tunes the car said that unplugging the computer for 6 hours should reset the changes the computer made for the code. He say's they will come back, but it would give us a good idea. Unfortunately, if my diablo is capable I can't use it for that purpose. Someone else plugged it in while I had a differne't tune in the car. I beleive upon doing so he may have saved that tune. Just incase I'm going to send it to them so that I can use it to modify timing for spray since the car was tuned with hp tuners.
if you need or want to try new 02s, hit advance and use promo code A123 (or google techbargains / retailmenot for better discounts @ advance)
Awesome buddy, thank you!
when you crank the car, even cold or warm, it will start in open loop and either use the OL table until warmed up or briefly if already warm, that slight richness upon startup is normal
Yeah, I'm not worried about it, my mustangs were always in the 13's until warm and this is just a tad richer. It is how the car liked it, as far as cold start idle.
Thanks guys!
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,932
Likes: 12
From: CT
any time you disconnect the battery or flash a new tune to the pcm, the relearned items such as idle, fuel trims, emissions readiness tests, trouble codes, etc all get reset... so yes, unplugging/disconnecting power from the pcm for 20-30 minutes will reset the fuel trims...
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06MonteSS / DiabLew Tune
2014 Camaro 2SS/RS - LS3, 6-speed manual, short-throw performance shifter, NPP dual-mode performance exhaust, 1LE front splitter, ZL1 rockers, Z28 Rear Spoiler, all paint-matched Red Rock Metallic, BMR strut tower brace, Cold Air Inductions cold air intake, Apex Motorsports, Inc. catch-can, Custom DiabLew Tune
www.diablewtune.com -- www.diablocustomtune.com -- www.diablocustomtunegm.com
06MonteSS / DiabLew Tune
2014 Camaro 2SS/RS - LS3, 6-speed manual, short-throw performance shifter, NPP dual-mode performance exhaust, 1LE front splitter, ZL1 rockers, Z28 Rear Spoiler, all paint-matched Red Rock Metallic, BMR strut tower brace, Cold Air Inductions cold air intake, Apex Motorsports, Inc. catch-can, Custom DiabLew Tune
www.diablewtune.com -- www.diablocustomtune.com -- www.diablocustomtunegm.com
any time you disconnect the battery or flash a new tune to the pcm, the relearned items such as idle, fuel trims, emissions readiness tests, trouble codes, etc all get reset... so yes, unplugging/disconnecting power from the pcm for 20-30 minutes will reset the fuel trims...
Still trying to do any and all trouble shooting before having my friend come down to check the car out. From what I read had it been 02's or the code being thrown because long tubes, shouldn't it have gone back to it's normal old, and correct idle afr #'s... even if just for a minute?
LMK if anyone thinks I should try a new 02 in bank 1 or even both. If not I may check fuel pressure next to be sure. I lost my guage to plug into the rail. Under the diagnostics in my diable it has options to log. Is fuel pressure somewhere in there?
Lastly, my wideband is in a great spot. It is an innovate. Part of me says it's the wideband because I've already replaced the only year old sensor before. Sometimes when it has a leaner idle I can feel the car cam hard as hell though. At 22.2 it doesn't feel as rough as I would have thought. Or at wot.
Replaced my bank 1 02 sensor. P1133 is now gone. p1153 never came back when I put the sensor back in it's original bank. P0135 came up again, so I wrapped all my sensors in heat wrap and all is well.
Now I recalibrated my wb. I have an innovate. Did the free air calibration. Fired it up this morning and all was well. When I shut the car off at work, 5 min later I fired it back up and same thing. Went to 22.2 lean for a second. Also did a wot pull on the way home and it went from 12.5 to 13.5 to 22.2 in the blink of an eye. Even when I let out and and got back on the gas to cruise it held 22.2 for a few. My cutout is close to the sensor, always closed and never been used, but it has me wondering.
Now I recalibrated my wb. I have an innovate. Did the free air calibration. Fired it up this morning and all was well. When I shut the car off at work, 5 min later I fired it back up and same thing. Went to 22.2 lean for a second. Also did a wot pull on the way home and it went from 12.5 to 13.5 to 22.2 in the blink of an eye. Even when I let out and and got back on the gas to cruise it held 22.2 for a few. My cutout is close to the sensor, always closed and never been used, but it has me wondering.
You have an exhaust leak. The engine can't make any power at WOT leaner than 16, it would lose all power.
I have had a few cars with real lean situations and they lost all power when AFR went over 16, felt like hitting the brakes.
The same exhaust leak is making the O2's dump more fuel.
I have had a few cars with real lean situations and they lost all power when AFR went over 16, felt like hitting the brakes.
The same exhaust leak is making the O2's dump more fuel.
You have an exhaust leak. The engine can't make any power at WOT leaner than 16, it would lose all power.
I have had a few cars with real lean situations and they lost all power when AFR went over 16, felt like hitting the brakes.
The same exhaust leak is making the O2's dump more fuel.
I have had a few cars with real lean situations and they lost all power when AFR went over 16, felt like hitting the brakes.
The same exhaust leak is making the O2's dump more fuel.
I let out when it went to 22.2 at wot, but it felt as good as ever. I figured 22.2 at wot would feel awful.
Took the plate off my cutout. It was def letting exhaust out. I cleaned it off and layed a bead of rtv on the outter edges. Once clamped down i put some on the outside maiting surfaces. It is a ft downstream from my wb sensor. Got the wb sensor hangin out of the car. Ganna do a free air calibration before i leave work and see if that changes anything.
I understand that, but there is no leaks near the 02 sensors. Also no more codes being thrown either. This leak is about 3 ft more or less from the 02s and less than a foot from my wb 02 sensor. Im trying to eliminate a wb 02 sensor reading improperly.
I see, i wonder what the wideband readings are when you run in open loop.
When the car was fully warmed up at wot it jumped to 22.2 steady. Driving and idle is 14.7 to 15.0 and barely ever sees 15.2. If i shut it off for a second and fire it back up it will read 22.2 for a second and idle a little bumpy. Use to allways do that but the wide band would be in the 12s then jump right up to 14.8.