Irunelevens

So?

ikaros23

simple, mustangs,camaros,corvettes and gtos are domestic and civics,nissans and bla bla bla are imports .

Irunelevens

...and?

DiscerningZ32

The Holden Commodore (original name for the 04-06 US GTO) was NOT made with the intention of EVER being sold stateside.
Development of the updated Holden Commodore was started by GM's Holden division in 1998 and was first sold in 2001.
It wasn't until it became so successful in Australia that they considered rebadging them and selling them in the US as GTOs and in England as Vauxhall Monaros.

liqidvenom

iTrader: (2)

X5, X6, Ml, Gl, camary, tundra- according to the government, domestic vehicles built here for the american market... also exported to the rest of the world.


Gto, camaro- according to the governement, imports built in a difference country exported to the rest of the world.


but honestly i fail to see why it matters where a car was made, or who made it. for a span of nearly 10yrs only japanese companies made affordable rwd sporty cars aside from the mustang. and those companies sell more of their rwd cars, and just cars in general in this country.and by them doing that it forces the home grown companies to compete and build better quality cars. ( ie the jump in overall quality from the 2002 4th gen to the 2010 5th gen) we all benefit from having not just a rich choice of various cars, but good competition to make us all better.

liqidvenom

iTrader: (2)

how is a camaro and gto domestic yet build in another country, yet the civic is built here in our boarders? maybe i am not understanding geography here. just because Gm has an office somewhere doesnt mean that we turn that land into mini america.

toslow5o

iTrader: (4)

The companies origin and where the profit goes is all that really matters.

These foreign and new make companies doesn't have 100yrs of lawsuits, retirement, greedy CEOs and unemployment under their belts that us hard workin Americans bleed out of the long standing domestic companies. So they can afford to bring business here and pay their worker just above minimum wage. While GM and the like can't hardly cut an assembly line worker's wages from 25+ dollars per hour down to $10/hr. (even if they are the ones doin the half *** job as a headliner glue man)

Companies and individuals that come to our great nation (legally or not) are free of taxation for a period of time. lending them a further advantage.

dsmfan95

The company I work for consists mostly of making car parts for the big 3, yet since it's a Japanese owned company, our profits don't stay in America.

toslow5o

iTrader: (4)

True! look at the best selling pony car....... it is FAR from the best car in its category throughout the majority of its production life.

toslow5o

iTrader: (4)

That's the company making the parts not selling the final product. Hardly anything is American made or owned anymore... so I guess no car companies are actually domestic?

toslow5o

iTrader: (4)

This is ignorant because there is always something faster than u.

00siandrew

I understand this argument and agree with you but I have a problem with this whole philosophy. In the companies that have their offices set up here but the cars made in another country, it's the rich getting richer and no one else gaining from anything. When Honda/Toyota/Subaru etc. build a plant here, (true they may not pay their employees what GM and Chrysler does, but really be honest, should you really make close to $30/hr for working on an assembly line?) but it's a job. Those Japanese companies are putting food on the table for many American families. That, in my opinion at least, is a hell of a lot better than GM/Chrysler telling us it's an "American made product" when the car is built by Canadians or Mexicans. Yeah the profit comes back here, but who does that help? The CEOs who are making millions already?

And really the government is much to blame. It has become so expensive to do business here so many American companies have packed up and shipped out. Then the Japanese/Korean compaines are getting tax breaks and being allowed to come here for much cheaper than to do business in their country. That's why I made the comment about being in a global market now a days. There is really no point in looking at what's imported and exported anymore. Because while people out there fighting and hating each other because they drive a "rice burner" and the rice burner driver defends him/herself, those "American" companies don't give a damn because they know some of their products are just as imported as the "rice".

liqidvenom

iTrader: (2)

I work for an auto company and i will have to say some of what you said is incorrect. I get paid a very very nice salary and I have compared my pay to that of my friends at Gm and i will say my pay and benefits are either on par or better then theirs.

Also the people who build out trucks down south make a very good living. the problem the domestic 3 had is the UAW which takes the base pay and adds other things on top which raise the cost per worker to the employer way higher then it needs to be. things such as not being able to fire someone, the job banks, insanely rich retirement packages. while those things are nice to have, they are not inline with todays economy and thats what has hurt the big three.

Also my company along with all of the import companies, bring jobs not only for the workers of the company but the surrounding area where they are. granted I wont be getting million dollar checks from the ceo's cut of the profits. my pay, benefits and bonus to me seem like a very fair compensation for my work. I am a fan of Gm and the big three, hence why i have a cts-v. But they need to pull in their blue collar work force costs and they will do fine going forward. ( that isnt me saying to pay the hard working blue collar guys less, but eliminate alot of those programs which cost the company money which are no longer usefull in this day and age. such as the job bank or not being able to fire people)

liqidvenom

iTrader: (2)

that is 100% true, but to say only x way it the right way to go fast is just as ignorant.

Well it isnt so much the government as the over head costs many companies face doing business here. For instance my company builds cars all over the world and their workers down south didnt see much of a down turn when the economy tanked because there wasnt much over head to hiring and keeping the workers. Most of the money paid out to them went directly to them. Many of the over seas companies that build cars here all do so union free due to the heavy cost involved with having them. Honda even closed a plant because the union wanted to come and the possible strikes and cost increases. So the overseas companies avoid paying a worker twice ( once to the union and once to the worker) and then manage to run a buisness that isnt going to eat away at profits.

meanwhile our own companies seem to be either fond of burning money or just dont care to fix it so they build cars overseas and in mexico/canada to help escape some of the blue collar fees they have to pay with the union labor here.


I also dont see how someone on a mass produced line can be making 30 bucks/hr. more power to you if you can get it, but that kinda pay isnt doing good things for the company.

toslow5o

iTrader: (4)

Well put.

I guess i didn say it as clearly but this was my point. I was sayin the workers makin so much really didn deserve that kind of pay. I feel bad for all the workers that lost their jobs (my mother included) but how can any auto manufacturer make profit with labor costs like that? Then ppl sue for having to stand in one position for a few hours at a time jus cause they don't wanna work for the money.

toslow5o

iTrader: (4)

I think we are all on the same page really.

The gov't also makes our businesses pay taxes twice. Once for their profits and again to match the workers tax payouts. For every penny u give up for taxes, soc sec, unemployment etc. the business matches.

kain01

Actually the the 1998 Holden Commodore is available in the US, and was pretty much a failure due to some electrical issues that were resolved in 2000. It was known stateside as the Cadillac Catera. Whether or not they intended to bring them to the US, they did. The spin off became the most successful car Cadillac has had in over 40 years, the CTS (Catera Touring Sedan)

toslow5o

iTrader: (4)

I agree. fast is fast

Tho i do hate seeing a fast car that is 10 different colors or has fake scoops and wings stuck all over the place. It makes me want to hand them a scrapper and a rattle can then tell them to get busy.

DiscerningZ32

I was referring to the two-door variant.

If you want to trace it all the way back, then the Opel Omega was the first to use that chassis in 1994.

Defined1983

iTrader: (20)

Civics are beyond gay to try to turn into a race car. It's an economy car. Nice kill.