Me vs Turbo Civic
#202
Staging Lane
#204
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This all reminds me of when I was looking for a used LS1 on craigslist. Saw one for sale and called on it. Asked the kid about it and he starts talking about how it comes with a header, and other parts that only a 4 banger would have. I go, "so is this a V8?" He laughs and says "Oh, your looking for the muscle car motor...I get a lot of guys that think this is it. This is a honda motor."
I said "Oh, well I wanted the real motor. Thanks anyways" and hung up. Never heard of a honda engine being referred to as an "LS1".
And Adamantium, I'm thinking you are now LS1tech's official honda nutswinger. Hooray!
I said "Oh, well I wanted the real motor. Thanks anyways" and hung up. Never heard of a honda engine being referred to as an "LS1".
And Adamantium, I'm thinking you are now LS1tech's official honda nutswinger. Hooray!
#206
Read that wrong. AMS's evo is not twin turbo by the way. Also comparing dyno numbers of an AWD car to a rwd is idiotic. 2ssderp has done it again.
We are not talking powerband here, like i said go back and read please.
But since i apparently need to dumb it down for you here.
Okay a turbo motor makes power when the turbo spools correct? Which motor on lets say for example on a 70mm journal bearing turbo will spool the turbo faster, an LS1 (5.7l) or a b16 (1.6l)? Ding ding ding the LS1, the power will come in faster (broader powerband) But lets put the correct size turbo that is dual ball bearing on a b16 that will spool VERY early, Now what do you have? A broad powerband aswell? See what im getting at? A turbo motor rely's solely on the turbo, like i previously stated. For example look at srt4s on stock turbo srt4s they will make 100+wtrq more than they will HP. They are only 2.4l Why? because they have a tiny turbo that spools fast.
On a turbo motor its all about the turbo and turbo setup, not the displacement.
Edit: This isn't the 90s we have technology to help with spool rate.
We are not talking powerband here, like i said go back and read please.
But since i apparently need to dumb it down for you here.
Okay a turbo motor makes power when the turbo spools correct? Which motor on lets say for example on a 70mm journal bearing turbo will spool the turbo faster, an LS1 (5.7l) or a b16 (1.6l)? Ding ding ding the LS1, the power will come in faster (broader powerband) But lets put the correct size turbo that is dual ball bearing on a b16 that will spool VERY early, Now what do you have? A broad powerband aswell? See what im getting at? A turbo motor rely's solely on the turbo, like i previously stated. For example look at srt4s on stock turbo srt4s they will make 100+wtrq more than they will HP. They are only 2.4l Why? because they have a tiny turbo that spools fast.
On a turbo motor its all about the turbo and turbo setup, not the displacement.
Edit: This isn't the 90s we have technology to help with spool rate.
Last edited by why87; 07-13-2012 at 03:26 PM.
#207
I must say...
I have a 06 C6 Z06 with an intake and tune, and have been searching for a forum that deals with mostly LS engines and internals, looking to find out more information in lamens terms about how I should go about improving the performance of my car. Found this forum, and the LS sections is..well.. a bit lackluster.
THEN, I find this subforum, and THIS thread... holy crap! There's a serious amount of retardation going, especially from the girls saying that a properly built honda isn't fast... lol.
I use my car for what it is "often", and have yet to see a properly built honda. I'm all for seeing what's what, and especially when a heavy *** camaro that weighs 1500 lbs more than a civic making just 60 whp more thinks he's faster. LOL
I have a 06 C6 Z06 with an intake and tune, and have been searching for a forum that deals with mostly LS engines and internals, looking to find out more information in lamens terms about how I should go about improving the performance of my car. Found this forum, and the LS sections is..well.. a bit lackluster.
THEN, I find this subforum, and THIS thread... holy crap! There's a serious amount of retardation going, especially from the girls saying that a properly built honda isn't fast... lol.
I use my car for what it is "often", and have yet to see a properly built honda. I'm all for seeing what's what, and especially when a heavy *** camaro that weighs 1500 lbs more than a civic making just 60 whp more thinks he's faster. LOL
#211
I must say...
I have a 06 C6 Z06 with an intake and tune, and have been searching for a forum that deals with mostly LS engines and internals, looking to find out more information in lamens terms about how I should go about improving the performance of my car. Found this forum, and the LS sections is..well.. a bit lackluster.
THEN, I find this subforum, and THIS thread... holy crap! There's a serious amount of retardation going, especially from the girls saying that a properly built honda isn't fast... lol.
I use my car for what it is "often", and have yet to see a properly built honda. I'm all for seeing what's what, and especially when a heavy *** camaro that weighs 1500 lbs more than a civic making just 60 whp more thinks he's faster. LOL
I have a 06 C6 Z06 with an intake and tune, and have been searching for a forum that deals with mostly LS engines and internals, looking to find out more information in lamens terms about how I should go about improving the performance of my car. Found this forum, and the LS sections is..well.. a bit lackluster.
THEN, I find this subforum, and THIS thread... holy crap! There's a serious amount of retardation going, especially from the girls saying that a properly built honda isn't fast... lol.
I use my car for what it is "often", and have yet to see a properly built honda. I'm all for seeing what's what, and especially when a heavy *** camaro that weighs 1500 lbs more than a civic making just 60 whp more thinks he's faster. LOL
#213
Weight is a serious factor, and can make up for a lot. Perfect example...
A Camaro making 100whp more than a turbo S2K.
Keep in mind dyno numbers are always relative, and they most likely have not been dyno'd on the same car at the same day, in the same timeframe. There are numerous videos of lightweight cars done RIGHT that can hang with the faster, higher hp, heavier cars out there. Bench racing is fun!
#214
Read that wrong. AMS's evo is not twin turbo by the way. Also comparing dyno numbers of an AWD car to a rwd is idiotic. 2ssderp has done it again.
We are not talking powerband here, like i said go back and read please.
But since i apparently need to dumb it down for you here.
Okay a turbo motor makes power when the turbo spools correct? Which motor on lets say for example on a 70mm journal bearing turbo will spool the turbo faster, an LS1 (5.7l) or a b16 (1.6l)? Ding ding ding the LS1, the power will come in faster (broader powerband) But lets put the correct size turbo that is dual ball bearing on a b16 that will spool VERY early, Now what do you have? A broad powerband aswell? See what im getting at? A turbo motor rely's solely on the turbo, like i previously stated. For example look at srt4s on stock turbo srt4s they will make 100+wtrq more than they will HP. They are only 2.4l Why? because they have a tiny turbo that spools fast.
On a turbo motor its all about the turbo and turbo setup, not the displacement.
Edit: This isn't the 90s we have technology to help with spool rate.
We are not talking powerband here, like i said go back and read please.
But since i apparently need to dumb it down for you here.
Okay a turbo motor makes power when the turbo spools correct? Which motor on lets say for example on a 70mm journal bearing turbo will spool the turbo faster, an LS1 (5.7l) or a b16 (1.6l)? Ding ding ding the LS1, the power will come in faster (broader powerband) But lets put the correct size turbo that is dual ball bearing on a b16 that will spool VERY early, Now what do you have? A broad powerband aswell? See what im getting at? A turbo motor rely's solely on the turbo, like i previously stated. For example look at srt4s on stock turbo srt4s they will make 100+wtrq more than they will HP. They are only 2.4l Why? because they have a tiny turbo that spools fast.
On a turbo motor its all about the turbo and turbo setup, not the displacement.
Edit: This isn't the 90s we have technology to help with spool rate.
And a bigger turbo wont always make more power at the same psi either. Like I said, remember that the engine is whats making the power. 10psi is still 10psi in a given displacement(say 5.7L) if the turbo is in its efficiency range(youll have to check out the compressor/turbine maps to determine). It doesnt matter if its coming from twin 67s or a single 94. Its still the same volume of air with more MASS. Turbos DO NOT increase flow, or CFM. Hence why compressor maps are read in "lbs/min". The ONLY time a bigger turbo will make more power at the same boost is if the current turbo is out of its efficiency range on the cold/hotside, ie its making too much backpressure or heating up the air too much on the cold side.
What you are basically saying is that turbos are a replacement for displacement, remember that saying? Turbos are not a replacement, and displacement definitely still matters. The accepted rule in ideal conditions is that 7.35psi = 50% gain in power, 14.7psi = 100% gain in power, and so on. So if you start out with a LS3 making 425hp, and a B18 at 200hp, with the proper turbo setup on each, the LS3 will always make more power at the same psi. Turbos DO NOT increase volumetric flow, only mass flow. So if you start with an engine that has a higher volumetric flow(given a proper heads/cam setup), do you think that it wont make more power than a smaller engine that flows less, if both are at the same boost? Because thats the way I took what youre saying.
And please, can we hold off on the insults/name calling? I realize thats too much to ask for in SR&K, but if you want to get technical keep it professional.
#215
TECH Fanatic
iTrader: (12)
Do you guys run back to your dollar genaral parking lots and grab all your friends "Doodz, people b dizrespectin on us Honda guys" and run back to your parents bsement to take the time and sign up on LS1 tech to jump into a conversation about engines smaller than a pop? Captain dipshit up above said Displacement dosnt matter. I asked a simple question and you took it like i was serious. THERE IS A REASON TOP FUEL DRAGSTERS ARE NOT 4cyls. If displacement didnt matter, they would run mountain dew bottles to save weight.
#216
Another video, same cars, 40 roll. Traction problems.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=6SdG3mMCIYk
Edit #3: Aannddd.. why weight is probably more important than horsepower. Had a little fun with a friends LS3 Cam + boltons FD RX7 weighing 2750 or so with driver vs my C6Z at 3300 w/ me. He made 420 on a dynapack, I made 448 on a low reading mustang dyno (500 on a dynojet with correction for an intake/tune C6Z). Other than the lurch I had from the start, we were dead even. Even with me making a benchmark guess of 357 whp on the mustang dyno (15-20% difference in dynos), he hung with me simply because he weighed nearly 600 pounds less.
I should be playing with a 460 whp RX7 sometime soon (if I can get in contact with him). If he's been tuned on a dynapack, I think he'll pull me, until I install the LS7R Texas Speed cam later this month. We'll see!
Last edited by icrashevos; 07-12-2012 at 11:49 PM. Reason: Forgot the video...
#217
I must say...
I have a 06 C6 Z06 with an intake and tune, and have been searching for a forum that deals with mostly LS engines and internals, looking to find out more information in lamens terms about how I should go about improving the performance of my car. Found this forum, and the LS sections is..well.. a bit lackluster.
THEN, I find this subforum, and THIS thread... holy crap! There's a serious amount of retardation going, especially from the girls saying that a properly built honda isn't fast... lol.
I use my car for what it is "often", and have yet to see a properly built honda. I'm all for seeing what's what, and especially when a heavy *** camaro that weighs 1500 lbs more than a civic making just 60 whp more thinks he's faster. LOL
I have a 06 C6 Z06 with an intake and tune, and have been searching for a forum that deals with mostly LS engines and internals, looking to find out more information in lamens terms about how I should go about improving the performance of my car. Found this forum, and the LS sections is..well.. a bit lackluster.
THEN, I find this subforum, and THIS thread... holy crap! There's a serious amount of retardation going, especially from the girls saying that a properly built honda isn't fast... lol.
I use my car for what it is "often", and have yet to see a properly built honda. I'm all for seeing what's what, and especially when a heavy *** camaro that weighs 1500 lbs more than a civic making just 60 whp more thinks he's faster. LOL
#218
Banned
iTrader: (3)
Displacement doesnt matter? The engine is what makes the power here, remember that. In an ideal environment, an engine that makes more power N/A will make more power on boost. And increasing psi will not always make more power. If the engines built to handle it, youll come to a point where the compressor or the hotside is out of the efficiency range. It will eventually just start blowing hot air or choking the exhaust.
And a bigger turbo wont always make more power at the same psi either. Like I said, remember that the engine is whats making the power. 10psi is still 10psi in a given displacement(say 5.7L) if the turbo is in its efficiency range(youll have to check out the compressor/turbine maps to determine). It doesnt matter if its coming from twin 67s or a single 94. Its still the same volume of air with more MASS. Turbos DO NOT increase flow, or CFM. Hence why compressor maps are read in "lbs/min". The ONLY time a bigger turbo will make more power at the same boost is if the current turbo is out of its efficiency range on the cold/hotside, ie its making too much backpressure or heating up the air too much on the cold side.
What you are basically saying is that turbos are a replacement for displacement, remember that saying? Turbos are not a replacement, and displacement definitely still matters. The accepted rule in ideal conditions is that 7.35psi = 50% gain in power, 14.7psi = 100% gain in power, and so on. So if you start out with a LS3 making 425hp, and a B18 at 200hp, with the proper turbo setup on each, the LS3 will always make more power at the same psi. Turbos DO NOT increase volumetric flow, only mass flow. So if you start with an engine that has a higher volumetric flow(given a proper heads/cam setup), do you think that it wont make more power than a smaller engine that flows less, if both are at the same boost? Because thats the way I took what youre saying.
And please, can we hold off on the insults/name calling? I realize thats too much to ask for in SR&K, but if you want to get technical keep it professional.
And please, can we hold off on the insults/name calling? I realize thats too much to ask for in SR&K, but if you want to get technical keep it professional.
For example my friends k20 on pump made 540 on 16psi that is 20.62500HP per PSI of boost OVER its stock amount of power. That is an efficient motor but how? its only a 2.0? Apparently displacement is everything.
Last edited by adamantium; 07-13-2012 at 01:43 AM.
#219
Staging Lane
I must say...
I have a 06 C6 Z06 with an intake and tune, and have been searching for a forum that deals with mostly LS engines and internals, looking to find out more information in lamens terms about how I should go about improving the performance of my car. Found this forum, and the LS sections is..well.. a bit lackluster.
THEN, I find this subforum, and THIS thread... holy crap! There's a serious amount of retardation going, especially from the girls saying that a properly built honda isn't fast... lol.
I use my car for what it is "often", and have yet to see a properly built honda. I'm all for seeing what's what, and especially when a heavy *** camaro that weighs 1500 lbs more than a civic making just 60 whp more thinks he's faster. LOL
I have a 06 C6 Z06 with an intake and tune, and have been searching for a forum that deals with mostly LS engines and internals, looking to find out more information in lamens terms about how I should go about improving the performance of my car. Found this forum, and the LS sections is..well.. a bit lackluster.
THEN, I find this subforum, and THIS thread... holy crap! There's a serious amount of retardation going, especially from the girls saying that a properly built honda isn't fast... lol.
I use my car for what it is "often", and have yet to see a properly built honda. I'm all for seeing what's what, and especially when a heavy *** camaro that weighs 1500 lbs more than a civic making just 60 whp more thinks he's faster. LOL
ps
xoxoxoxoxoxoxo
hondas r ******* hgay
small penissssssasassss
Last edited by 2SSARME; 07-13-2012 at 02:20 AM.