16SS vs gt500
The only thing that generates the anti squat is the force of the tires rotating forward there for anti squat or bite can be generated by irs. Most are just set up near neutral for best all round performance. Then just like on a lowered sra car a lowered irs car will become more prone to wheel hop typically.....of course there are things that can affect that.
Sra cars can wheel hope too you know.
Sra cars can wheel hope too you know.
I think this is where the confusion is coming from, (just as I did when I read your other post) I think ZNix is taking inertia from the drivetrain through the body into account. While you are talking rear end only... I've got to say, you've swayed me on the IRS vs SRA for drag racing, you make a valid point.
Just out of curiosity, does anyone know how much parasitic loss is associated with u-joints vs. a straight axle?
Just out of curiosity, does anyone know how much parasitic loss is associated with u-joints vs. a straight axle?
Probably very little these days with most having cv joints and not u joints for rear axles. Sure there is probably a small weight penalty but at least the weight is unsprung and in the back. It also seems most differential cases are aluminum these days reducing the weight penalty associated with irs.....actually many of the componets are aluminum even the uprights.
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,861
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From: Ringoes/Flemington, New Jersey
I took you off my ignore since I'm not on here that much anymore. 
You are correct in saying there are no forces on the drive wheels. That is caused by the bend in the u-joints of both half shafts. All that energy stops there. However by definition, antisquat is the action of the rear end wanting to point downward on the hit because the ring gear wants to nose over. Because all that energy is not transferred to the tires via a fixed non bending piece of metal, it pulls the body downward. So IRS cars have NO antisquat built in them. You have it backwards.
That is why IRS cars are more prone to wheel hop. There is no downward force being applied to the tires.
-Mark
You are correct in saying there are no forces on the drive wheels. That is caused by the bend in the u-joints of both half shafts. All that energy stops there. However by definition, antisquat is the action of the rear end wanting to point downward on the hit because the ring gear wants to nose over. Because all that energy is not transferred to the tires via a fixed non bending piece of metal, it pulls the body downward. So IRS cars have NO antisquat built in them. You have it backwards.
That is why IRS cars are more prone to wheel hop. There is no downward force being applied to the tires.
-Mark
11 Second Club
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 804
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From: Tampa, FL
The only thing that generates the anti squat is the force of the tires rotating forward there for anti squat or bite can be generated by irs. Most are just set up near neutral for best all round performance. Then just like on a lowered sra car a lowered irs car will become more prone to wheel hop typically.....of course there are things that can affect that.
Sra cars can wheel hope too you know.
Sra cars can wheel hope too you know.
wut? So antisquat is a force that is created from the tires going forward? I think you are getting confused. Antisquat is a result of how the suspension (i.e. the lever or how much leverage) there is with respect to the rear. Too long of a lever (long IC) and the car squats. Too short of a lever (short IC) and the rear of the car rises too quickly then unloads. When you say neutral...where would you put the IC to get the AS neutral? Trick question.
-Mark
Last edited by Bitemark46; Feb 19, 2016 at 05:49 PM.
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wut? So antisquat is a force that is created from the tires going forward? I think you are getting confused. Antisquat is a result of how the suspension (i.e. the lever or how much leverage) there is with respect to the rear. Too long of a lever (long IC) and the car squats. Too short of a lever (short IC) and the rear of the car then unloads. When you say neutral...where would you put the IC to get the AS neutral? Trick question.
-Mark
Wtf, Mac? 
wut? So antisquat is a force that is created from the tires going forward? I think you are getting confused. Antisquat is a result of how the suspension (i.e. the lever or how much leverage) there is with respect to the rear. Too long of a lever (long IC) and the car squats. Too short of a lever (short IC) and the rear of the car rises too quickly then unloads. When you say neutral...where would you put the IC to get the AS neutral? Trick question.
-Mark
Neutral would be the area that is best for acceleration and braking. Getting agreesive with either will detract from the other. This is also where irs shines because now it has one less force to deal with since the diff is hard mounted . Newer irs is usually multi link also which can better distribute these forces.
Times are changing......technology is changing. I just seen it coming before most. There will be a day when we look back at sra cars and be like what a diabolical pos that was.
11 Second Club
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 804
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From: Tampa, FL
Yes......but with no force applied it is all static. The tires apply this force and the suspension reacts to it.
Neutral would be the area that is best for acceleration and braking. Getting agreesive with either will detract from the other. This is also where irs shines because now it has one less force to deal with since the diff is hard mounted . Newer irs is usually multi link also which can better distribute these forces.
Times are changing......technology is changing. I just seen it coming before most. There will be a day when we look back at sra cars and be like what a diabolical pos that was.
Neutral would be the area that is best for acceleration and braking. Getting agreesive with either will detract from the other. This is also where irs shines because now it has one less force to deal with since the diff is hard mounted . Newer irs is usually multi link also which can better distribute these forces.
Times are changing......technology is changing. I just seen it coming before most. There will be a day when we look back at sra cars and be like what a diabolical pos that was.
Answer: Draw a line from where the rear tire meets the ground (the contact patch) to the top of the front tire. This is called your antisquat neutral line. Anything above this line means your AS is over 100%. Anything where the IC is below that line is obviously under 100% but also yields squatting.
Back to Yellowbullet I go.
-Mark
SRA FTW! You couldn't get a more vanilla answer if you tried. I figured you didn't know the answer even though the answer had the word "neutral" in it.
Answer: Draw a line from where the rear tire meets the ground (the contact patch) to the top of the front tire. This is called your antisquat neutral line. Anything above this line means your AS is over 100%. Anything where the IC is below that line is obviously under 100% but also yields squatting.
Back to Yellowbullet I go.
-Mark
Answer: Draw a line from where the rear tire meets the ground (the contact patch) to the top of the front tire. This is called your antisquat neutral line. Anything above this line means your AS is over 100%. Anything where the IC is below that line is obviously under 100% but also yields squatting.
Back to Yellowbullet I go.
-Mark
And again....because you fail to understand all these forces are not forces until the turning of the tire creates them.
Have fun at yb.....stay there
Last edited by HioSSilver; Feb 20, 2016 at 10:50 AM.
