Originally Posted by darrensls1

BTW I'm not hating on the LT1. If you did get some free internal modding then that's a good thing. I'd much rather be faster then I thought then slower any day of the week.

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

I have had nothing else done to my car then what I have said. The car has had no other work done to it before I got it. I bought the car from a 28 year old girl who is now a pharmacist and the car was completely stock...It was a 1 owner.

The only thing I had to do at one time is replace the timing chain. (It broke) It ended up bending valves (not a lot) and I had to get all of that fixed and basically get the thing rebuilt...

I wish I would have thought of it at the time. I should have got a cam while he was replacing the timing chain...

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

I ran at the track a while ago when I still had the flowmaster. I ran an 8.4 in the 1/8 with a not so good 60'. I was thinking with a low 1.9 60', I could run an 8.3. With a 1.8 60' maybe even a little better...Although, I need to go back again because with this dynomax muffler the car seems to keep the topend a little more.

Originally Posted by darrensls1

I don't know if you watch the show House but me and my wife love it. One of the things Dr. House loves to say to his staff when they are diagnosing someones symptoms is "people lie".

A lot of people don't want to buy these kind of cars modded because they want to mod themselves and they figure it's been beaten on. A lot of people will remove any obvious bolt-ons before selling a car so they can say it's "stock". If the car had some head work or a mild cam (maybe both) that isn't so easy to remove and they might leave it in but still say the car is stock to attact more buyers.

The car might have been her boyfriends, brothers, fiances, husbands or whoever but just in her name. Point is that "people lie". Lets take the numbers from my pevious post here and go a step farther but only looking at ET numbers this time.

Stock LT1 A4's run 14.0 quarter miles. Many run 14.2-14.5 so 14.0 is giving your car the benifit of the doubt of being a stronger stock A4. Adding full exhaust will drop your ET by a solid 3 tenths. CAI will drop another tenth. Will even throw in one more tenth for the tune. That's half a second (which would be a very respectable gain for those mods).

Now you run 13.5 in the quarter mile. Where is your car at I wonder? Well you did say this:



8.4 in the eighth is about a 12.9 quarter mile. But with a low 1.9 you could hit a 8.3 you said. That would make your car at least a 12.8 (pushing 12.7 probably). Add the dynomax to this mix which you say gave you more top end over flowmaster and we can put you at a solid 12.7 capable.

Now if my math serves me correct then 13.5 - 12.7 = .8 So you want me (and everyone else) to believe that your car is almost a full second faster then any other comparible LT1 in the country and GM gave you those .8 tenths (or 80HP if you go with the 10 HP = .1 rule) as a "factory freak"?

I'm sorry but the numbers don't lie. "People do".

I would do the following things if I owned your car.

1). Get it on a dyno.

2). Get a 1/4 mile pass in with drag radials.

3). Find a LS1 who actually modded his car to race (oh wait you might wanna scratch that one).

4). GET A STALL!!!!! The absolute best mod any A4 F-body can do (LT1 or LS1). It's a whole new animal after that.

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

Your times are a little off...I can't believe you think my car was modded before I bought it. You think that with my exhaust I would get 3 tenths?..

Originally Posted by Zigroid

when I was completely stock I ran a 14.8 @ 94.
auto, 110k miles, 2.73 gears, street tires.
bolt-ons got me to 13.8 @ 102.

Originally Posted by Zigroid

Let me tell you something. I ran my car when it was completely stock and I got a 9.3. It was capable of a 9.2, (maybe better) but the 60' wasn't there and my tires weren't the best...After doing all the mods, I ran an 8.5xx. Then, I got the tune and ran an 8.4, but like I said I could have gotten an 8.3 with a good 60'..

Originally Posted by Zigroid

An 8.4 is not necessarily a 12.9. 8.4 x 1.55 = 13.02. (roughly) Lets say I did get an 8.3. It would be an 8.378 or something...Not an 8.300...8.378 x 1.55 = 12.98. That's about right...I have no idea where your coming up with 12.7's, lol.

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

Click Here

I hope you enjoy it. We didn't go any faster, because there wasn't a point. We ended up getting a higher roll, but didn't get it on tape...Same results...

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

LT's made a huge difference...Once I came out of the shop and floored it for the first time, the car got sideways and chirped second pretty good. I was so shocked because the car had never done that before...Believe it or not, but it's the truth and it makes perfect sense...The results I have seen are logical for an LT1...

Originally Posted by HardcoreRM125

My car, with just CAI, long tubes, ORY and Flowmaster cat back, sticks with LS1 F-Bodies ...

My friends LT4 Grand Sport with a cat back and JET chip though would put a solid 3 lengths on it through 1,2,&3rd gear. That thing is awesome.

Hope that gives you an idea of where you should be with those mods.

Originally Posted by ABA383

Hardcore, yes I'm very satisfied with the fit/finish/plug access/ground clearance and install of the Kooks and the Y-pipe. These are by far the best headers I've ever seen for our cars. I also went with the stepped headers because they should work very well with my combo. But they do come with a price. I wanted to go with what I feel is the best, and after a year of research I went with them. I dropped .2 and gained 2 mph on the dyno 1/4 mile run with them over my LPE big tube shorties...We'll see what the real track says in a few weeks...

--Alan

Originally Posted by 97 LT1formula

got my car on the dyno yesterday, it put down 271rwhp and 300tq. Mods are pacesetter longtube headers, magnaflow exhaust, CAI, air foil and TB Bypass. I was pretty happy with the result, what should i expect to gain with a cutout?

Originally Posted by darrensls1

1). Your car has more done to it that even you know about.

2). The WS6 has engine problems and is down on HP.

3). The WS6 driver was not very good (granny shifting, slow shifts, ect)

4). The race was fixed for our entertainment since there have been alot of LS1 vs LT1 threads lately.

Originally Posted by darrensls1

My times are right on the money. But lets look at some other LT1's shall we? Here is some sigs from a LT1 based site.


"1993 Trans Am A4 K&N CAI, SLP Airfoil,Hooker LTs, True Duals (H-pipe) w/ Sweet Thunders, MSD 6A, Blaster Coil, PCMFORLESS tune 13.5 @102 MPH "

Looks right to me.


http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2061718

Look at his domain page. He ran 13.4 @ 101.5 with about the same setup as you. Interesting.


"its easy to bring it down too... with my mods i run a 13.2
__________________
95 Trans Am~ K&N CAI, Holly Air Foil, 160* stat, Hooker Long Tubes, offroad Y-pipe (one magnaflow cat), Hooker Cat back exhaust, transgo shift kit, 3.73 gears, 17" Correvette C5 rims, Kumho 275/40/17s all around, and MadZ28 tune."

13.2 and he also has gears & shiftkit. Seems in order.




Now that's just blasphamy. LT1's all run mid 13's stock and high 12's with just exhaust and CAI! Someone tell this guy to drive his car off a cliff!



So Exhuast and CAI gained you .9 in the 1/8 along with LS1 top end pull? WOW. They must have been magic headers bought from the same guy who sold Jack his beanstalk beans.



Ok that's fair enough. Lemme explain. You said this in the opening post:



That implies that you can and do have more top end pull then a stock M6 LS1 who should trap around 105. Same story with the LS2 GTO thread. You have more top end. So I merely looked at one of my old time slips (since we both have autos, about the same weight and even same gears I think). Now with your LS1 eating top end the quarter should be comparible to mine. Here is a good run with a 8.3 1/8 for comparison.

60' 2.005
330 5.460
1/8 8.322
MPH 85.64
1000 10.796
1/4 12.886
MPH 108

But my 60' wasn't as good as your 1.9 and you were looking for a low 1.9 right? Lets see if I have a slip like that to compare.

60' 1.94 (closest I could find)
330 5.352
1/8 8.192
MPH 86.18
1000 10.654
12.737
108.21

Plus someone with a LT1 said they hit a 12.9 quarter with a 8.4 and you were quick to agree with him. So I think it's fair to say that you either have a 12.7-12.8 @ 107+ car or you want us all to "think" you do.



Yes LT's will make a huge difference. By themselves 25 rwhp is normal gains which equates to 2-3 tenths in the quarter mile.



So he "sticks" with LS1's? Shouldn't he be blowing them away like you do?




Only 2 tenths? shouldn't that be closer to 8? Although that was over shorties so I would say he picked up .3 (maybe .35) over stock.



271 rwhp? shouldn't he be 325+ like you must be? Actually he is a bit low. Many in that thread said (and I agree) a dyno tune would get him close to 300 rwhp.

I think I've made my point. Not that your car couldn't MAYBE do a little better then 13.5 with those mods. Maybe a real freak might pull a 13.2 but it would all be in the 60' and the top end would still not be there to pull LS2's and LS1's like they were nothing. But all your races are from a roll so it's all about gears and HP. There isn't 325 rwhp worth of mods in your car but you have the top end pull of one that has at least that.

How is that possible?



That's right, now I remember.

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

What is with this originally posted by zigroid deal? I posted like 2 of the quotes you have his name under......

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

Anyway, seriously you have a problem. I have no idea why your trying to prove me wrong and say my car has more done to it than it does...Comparing my car to other peoples on here means nothing. There cars may have 150,000 miles on them and might not be running good. Mine on the other hand was basically rebuilt because of the timing chain. It's not going to run like a 130,000+ LT1 motor, unless it was kept up. It's a healthy motor with those mods and a good tune...

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

These people who are trapping 101 with LT's, do they all have a real tune? Not pcmforless, a tune. Is there motor healthy? Apparently not if they trap about 2 MPH faster with all those mods...LT headers, matching Y, CAI...Come on, 2mph? Someone ran a 14.8 stock. I can't believe you posted that. That just goes to show you even more that you can't go by other peoples cars. His car is apparently pretty messed up...(trapping 94 or something, come on...) That's like the speed of a 3rd gen Iroc. Probably slower......

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

You can't compare your timeslips or your car to mine...You have an LS1.....

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

Are you just upset because you have more mods than me and are not that much faster? Who cares, relax...I'm sorry life isn't working out for you....

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

We all have f-body's and lets be happy with it. I'm not lieing about any mods and there is nothing else done to the car...Having the matching 3 inch Y-pipe really helps to...

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

Your times are off and I proved that to you last post. A quick way of calculating your 1/8 is X by 1.55. You have no argument there. Typically speaking, the quickest I should run is a 12.985...I don't want anyone to believe anything, I don't know what your talking about?..

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

I got into some races and I posted them. I don't mean to start an argument. I only raced this 2nd WS6 because people raised so many questions about the driver. So, I raced an auto. Still, we have you to keep running your mouth about nothing...I have what I have. I'm sorry if my car isn't exactly the same as everyone else... (in your mind)

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

Do I need to video tape my car and show you the motor. Maybe rev it a little so you can sleep at night? I told you my mods and I told you what I ran. Get over it. It's the truth, I have no reason to lie...

Originally Posted by darrensls1

I was going quick with copy and paste. But you know which you said and which I was quoting other people for saying.



Definately not. Running low 14's stock is "average". Running mid 13's with just exhaust and cai is "average". I could have shown you a guy with all bolt-ons and a cam running 12.9 but his car clearly has a few tuning issues.




Do you have a real tune? Dyno tune? What did it pull?

A4's don't trap that well stock healthy or not. That could have been an increase from say 98 to 101. 3 mph isn't a bad gain for exhuast and CAI. Not bad at all.




But we both have the same gears, tranny, weight and you gotta be trapping what I am so why not? It won't be exact but you don't actually have a quarter mile run so I'm doing the best I can to estimate what it might be.




Not at all. I am either considerably faster then you OR your more modded then you say. Either way

As for my life, well let me say this (and all is 100% true). I lost my job 2 years ago but within 2 weeks was offered another one for more money in Western New York. I have a beautiful wife, a daughter who is graduating HS tomarrow with honors (high honor roll student). I also have two boys who are 14 and 6 and also good students. Everyone is healthy and happy (and I thank god for that every day). I live 5 minutes from lake Ontario so naturally I bought a 20' Bayliner boat (loads of fun). I just received my ETP heads along with a cam, TNT wet kit, ls6 intake, lifters, injectors, UD pulley, bolts, rods, ect. I'll be looking for mid 10's with my new setup

My life is good. I can only hope you have or find the blessings in life that I have.



I never said you were "definately lieing". I only proposed that as one of the possible reasons for your extrordinary performance (meaning beyond the listed mods capabilities).



I don't think so. If you get the 60' down then the ET goes down too. You're talking about low 1.9's and with the 107+ trap speed you must have to pull LS2's and LS1 M6's on the highway I could easily see 12.7 as a best ET. Unless you're not trapping 107+ in which case I start to doubt the pulling well driven LS1's & LS2's on the highway.



Numbers don't lie. People do. Your car + your mods do not = 12.7-12.9 @ 107+.



But you do. There have been a slew of LT1 vs LS1 threads the last few weeks with the LT1 being painted in a not so pretty picture. So if some LT1 guy were to get all upset and want to start up some **** what could he do?

Lets say (just for an example) you have spray, a cam, heads or whatever. If you tell the truth then all kills makes perfect sense and you still get no reactions like "wow it only takes exhaust and CAI to destroy LS1's". But if you "fib" a little on mods then all of a sudden you get the big response you were looking for.

It's not that you beat stock LS1's in second gear that brought up my red flag. It's your claim to still pull them hard in third gear that did.

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

I wasn't claiming to pull them hard in third gear. I never pulled that auto LS1 "hard." I just kept pulling it...Do I care? No. Did it happen? Yes. I was just showing you the video and sharing the information.

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

I'll make a video of my car and let you listen to the motor. Then you'll know for a fact that i'm not lieing and this can be over...

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

Your right, my mods do not equal a 12.7 @ 107+. I never said they did. I don't know why you assume that...

An A4 WS6 doesn't trap 107. I bet that car would trap about 102-103...

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

"I have a beautiful wife, a daughter who is graduating HS tomarrow with honors (high honor roll student)."

Well, I can only hope that your daughter being a graduate, knows how to spell tomorrow...(obviously you don't)

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

Don't you think it's a little pathetic that you would come on this thread at your age and argue with me on a street race?

I'm not lieing about any mods, Especially to me, your making yourself look like a clown. *I* know the mods to my car and *I* know I'm not lieing. I told you the mods and that's it.

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

I can only hope that you will be as blessed as me to snap into reality and realize not everyone lies for attention. There are truthful people out there and guess what? **** happens that might not make sense to you...

Originally Posted by darrensls1

Actually that race ended pretty quick. Not much of any 3rd gear racing happening there from what I saw.



Don't even think it'll be that easy. Lemme set that record straight right here and right now so you don't waste your time. Your car is LOUD. As it should be and it sounds good to BTW. All a video would prove is that it doesn't have a "big cam". Many smaller cams with higher LSA's can give better performance but still sound and drive stock.



I trapped 103 with a 99 so that sounds about right other then I doubt 102 with a 02 model unless he is at considerable elevation. But that run was not why I said you would be trapping 107+. You ran down a M6 LS2 GTO on the highway remember? They trap 106-110. Get it now why I say you have to be 107+? And the WS6 M6 Vert will trap at least 105 so to pull him in 3rd gear (which you did say you had a highway run with the same results) would also take a considerable trap.





Thank you grammar police




No, I think it's pathetic that you're hiding something or in denial. And if you can give me a reasonable explanation for how your car pulls 105-109 trapping cars on the highway (the first two not the WS6 A4) then I would be very glad to read it.



Reality is not a subject you are doing well in right now

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

I video taped my car and it's not loud by the way. It was much louder with the flowmaster. The Dynomax is much more quiet. I got the same results with both the WS6's, I was just telling the truth....

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

I'm not pathetic at all. I'm not hiding anything...Your in denial...

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

"What should he do, take his motor apart? Sorry old man, he shouldn't waste his time. Go play with your wife and kids and do something with your life. Like work for example. 2 years off, what kind of **** is that? ******* loser... "

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

Just so you know, i didn't write what is quoted about the loser thing. My friend is here with me and he read all of our posts. That's what he had to say. I wouldn't be so mean...But seriously, I'm not being pathetic or lieing at all. My g/f knows about all my mods as well. I bought the car while I was dating her and I'm still with her now. Your pretty hard headed, so I don't think there is anyway for me to convince you.

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

What you need to realize is that it was a *street race.* It's different at the track. I don't know how or why I pulled those cars like i did. I'm sorry, I guess... It happened and I posted it. I'm not hiding anything. You really need to realize that.

Originally Posted by darrensls1

Wow then the Flowmaster must of been a beast. I think any LT1 with headers is loud. At least compared to a LS1.



Maybe you are and maybe you are not. I gave 5 possible explanations and only two of them envolved you "possibly" being untruthful.



I would definately take the motor apart.......To put in a heads/cam package

I am doing something with my life. Right now it's debating the potential of various vehicles and modifications with you.

I didn't say I took two years off. I said two years ago I lost my job and within two "weeks" I was offered a better paying job in the same field. So I have been at this "new job" for two years. Get it?



I wasn't offended anyway. I'm married remember? It takes a lot more then calling me a loser to offend me



I can understand perfectly well why you pulled them in second gear (approx 30-85). Your mods vs stock LS1's it does make sense and you have vids to prove it. I am however baffled about how you can run down a LS2 M6 GTO when I know those cars trap 106+ (I've seen a few trap 110 stock ) and a M6 LS1 (105 +-1) from the highway speeds when those cars should in fact be capable of reeling you in/pulling you (if in fact your heads are stock and no N20). That is what I am debating because it in fact doesn't make alot of sense (or any sense for that matter).

I enjoy debating. I probably should have been a lawyer but I guess I missed my calling

But I still don't buy your car being a 12 anything with just exhaust and cai. With a stall and drag radials I'd say all day long high 12's but stock stall and street tires? 290 estimated rwhp? stock weight? I just don't get how unless your at a sea level track with a 50 mph tailwind

Originally Posted by darrensls1

I just don't get how unless your at a sea level track with a 50 mph tailwind

Originally Posted by kyle91z28

lol my friend has a 99 ws6 A4 and he lost to a v6 truck because he is too retarded to drive...maybe that was the case with the ws6?

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

I'm not trying to make you buy anything...You said it yourself that an 8.4 is good for 12's. I told you that it wasn't...Your the one saying that my car is capable of 12's...

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

Bolt on LT1's can run low 13's high 12's. What is so hard to believe? Geez, come on people.

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

By the way, running an 8.4 in the 1/8 is not a mid 13 at best.

Why don't you ask some of the other bolt on LT1 people what they have ran? I know there is someone on here that has run a 12.9 with the same mods as me...So, obviously you don't pay attention to LT1's very much. It's pretty clear you have no idea what your talking about.

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

I ran at the track a while ago when I still had the flowmaster. I ran an 8.4 in the 1/8 with a not so good 60'. I was thinking with a low 1.9 60', I could run an 8.3. With a 1.8 60' maybe even a little better...Although, I need to go back again because with this dynomax muffler the car seems to keep the topend a little more.

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

All the GTO had was DR's and an experienced driver.

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

You shouldn't of been a lawyer. Your debating something on assumption and your wrong.

Originally Posted by Z 2 8

"But I still don't buy your car being a 12 anything with just exhaust and cai."

If you don't believe that my car ran an 8.4 and you believe that an 8.4 is good for 12's, how are you not calling me a liar?