MGorman

I would be happier if the laws weren’t arbitrary. What you suggest here is a far stiffer penalty than is currently applied to those convicted of DUI. If that’s what you want then you need to include any action while driving that is negligent and likely to cause great bodily harm.



Yea, don’t even get me started there…….they aren’t held accountable for anything they do (unless it’s a sex scandal then they just quietly disappear from the public eye). They’ll happily pass legislation that they’ll never have to face the consequences of.

96 mph in a 65 mph, should I lose my car for this?




True, but there are many more “cell phone” accidents resulting in many more deaths. Not long ago I witnessed an accident where a woman talking on a cell phone ran a red light at about 40 mph and struck an SUV that was just in front of me. We had just started to proceed through the intersection and were traveling about 10 mph. The SUV in front of my spun around and flipped over. The female driver of the SUV was ejected and died. The cell phone user received only traffic citations. How does this fit into your “scheme of things”? Is this really any better (or worse) that a street racing accident? Both are borne of gross negligence. All I’m saying is legislation should be applied equitably across the board.


Good point. It certainly is a slippery slope.



I totally agree. But I still have a problem with the confiscation of personal property

88GTA

[QUOTE=cwaldt]break checking is illegal, at least in california. also, many areas have laws about impeding traffic and also minimum speed laws for certain roads. these are almost never enforced.

Now about speeding.
'speeding' is relative. The speed limits in the united states are mostly arbitrary numbers, with the top speed of 75 (or there-abouts) being mandated by congress (well, it really isn't a national law so much as a guideline, but if a state tries to raise their maximum limit congrees stops giving them their federal funding for roads, ask Montana) . Don't believe me? Look up traffic statistics for the US vs Germany. They have far safer roads over there than we do here. Our speed limits (with the exception of residential zones) seem to be arbitrary for the most part. I'll see a two lane ( one in each direction ), not so well maintained road, no lane dividers, with a speed limit of 50 or 55 ( sometimes more), then it empties into a 4 or 6 lane monstrosity with center divider and controlled access and a posted speed limit of 30 to 45mph.

most people seem upset about the 'recklessness in traffic' aspect of these 'street racers'. I see cars zipping up 880 in excess of 90 or 100mph regularly through traffic. they aren't racing anybody. people in infinities, lexus, bmws, audis, often with a cell phone. flying up the road, weaving, they aren't racing anybody, they are just too important/cool to have to go the same speed as the rest of the traffic (at least in their minds) in spite of conditions. I even see them pass people on shoulders. They aren't street racing. they are just being reckless. recklessness is a crime, and should be punished. now, if people get involved in a street race and are reckless, then they should be punished, but I still think permanent confiscation of property is extreme and something I would expect to see in a police state not a democratic republic like we have here. But if they get involved in a race, and were obviously careful about it ( NOT reckless ), then they should only get charged for crimes they committed (most likely speeding, possibly marking the pavement). racing or 'speed contests' should not be illegal in and of themselves. we already have laws to cover the dangerous aspects that may arise when street racing, reckless driving and speeding. If someone gets hurt, charge them with something more serious and appropriate.

also, all these appeals to "what if you killed a mom and kid", "what if your girlfriend got killed by a 'streetracer'", etc, are spurious, emotional appeals meant to inflame people into not thinking rationally and instead instigate a knee-jerk reaction. If we are going to discuss this, let's do so rationally. ( yes, i know i have been a bit hyperbolic in some of my previous posts )

darrensls1

Then lets do just that. It'll make people think twice before doing something stupid. Except of course for the ****** that don't respect the law

This is true. But they do need to get reelected. It's a vast majority that speeds on a regular basis (5-15 over lets say). It's an extreme minority that street races and most are young which makes some not even regestered voters. Believe me when I say I feel they take all that into account.

Not for a first offense. Maybe not even for a second. But third strike and I say bye bye to license. Then if caught doing it on a suspended license I say yes, sell the damn car and give the proceeds to fixing city streets. Drunk drivers on multiple offenses sell the cars and give the proceeds to MADD. Street racers on multiple offenses sell the cars and use the money to build a local track

Well that makes sense. There are far more cell phone violators then street racers. I'm not saying to ignore them. Go ahead and give them a 3 strike program too. I am saying that you can't just say "let street racers get off easy because DUI's and Cell phones cause bigger body counts". All of them need to be dealt with. But don't lower the one. Raise the other two. Of course some places all ready have very stiff DUI penalties.

And that is your right to feel that way. I however feel that if it's a multiple offense and the person in question is basically saying FU to the judge/cops by continuing to break the same law then it's not going overboard to seize the car.

But then again I would also have no problem with the Judge saying even though it's your 3rd offense you can keep your muscle car but have fun in state for a year, don't bend over for the soap and have a nice day

BlackMagicC5

iTrader: (2)

Your the one using an unfair comparison. Cutting off a body part is torture/cruel and unusual punishment, and shouldn't even be brought up. A gun and a car are similar. You are legally allowed to own either one, but under certain circumstances, you can have it seized. If that happens, you can likely just purchase another. Theres no reason to get your car seized, and no excuse. It's 100% clear in the manual what those conditions are and its on the test to get your drivers license. Everyone is 100% aware of the rules. If you don't like it, don't race on the street. And I never have to worry about getting any of my vehicles seized because that won't happpen with a basic traffic violation. Theres a difference between speeding or reckless driving, and congregating in a parking lot with the intention of pre-arranged street racing.

BlackMagicC5

iTrader: (2)

Thats some of the dumbest **** I've ever heard. You sound like a 16 year old who just got their license. I bet you think your the greatest driver ever, and that you shouldn't have any laws to follow because of how good you are.

JBuenrostro

BlackMagicC5: I will agree on something that you've said. I just think that some people here don't agree on is getting a car auctioned off. I know here in CA if you're caught racing you will get your car impounded for 30 days but never auctioned off which I totally think it's an abuse of power. Not sure if you agree with me or not (to get the car auctioned off).
I don't know were there also getting there facts from. Most of those cars hit max like 130 then shut off. I know it's not safe speeds but cops are saying there are going 165+. That just shows the abuse of power. Basically what I'm getting at is street racing is illegal and those who get caught should know and accept the consequences no doubt about that but in this case it's more then just street racing it's obvious there's abuse of power going on.

BlackMagicC5

iTrader: (2)

First of all, I don't know what speeds they race to. I can admit to street racing up to at least 150 before shutting down when my C5 was procharged. It gets there pretty quickly. The problem is everyone is acting like the cops made a bust, then suddenly decided to seize the cars and auction them off. Thats not the case. The rules have been around plenty long and everyone is aware of them. No one complains about the rules until they are enforced. I don't see the point in testing things. Thats like reading a manual to a stove that says the surface gets hot when turned on, then turning it on, touching it, then complaining that it wasnt fair you got burned. Same damn thing. Everyone with a license knows the rules, read the driving manuals, took the tests, then street raced anyway. Now everyone is crying that its not fair. I don't understand. It sucks for them, but I don't see why everyone feels so sorry for them.

JBuenrostro

The only way I will agree with you on that if that it "set as a law" that if you get caught racing or doing speeds that are in the triple digets your car will be revoked and auctioned off only then I will agree with you 100% that they had to face that consequence but if they decided out of the blues that...hey we just busted some racers lets just auction there cars to be d*cks and there was no law that says the car will be auctioned off then I will have to say that is abuse of power.
As far as fines goes thats always been around since street racing began so that is a norm.

sprung_monkey

iTrader: (8)

**** happens......glad it wasnt me

BlackMagicC5

iTrader: (2)

I don't know how many times I have to say this but in NC if you get caught street racing your car can be seized and sold at a public auction. It's in the driving manuals in writing and its on the test to get your license. Everyone knows that rule since its so harsh.

sprung_monkey

iTrader: (8)

hell ca wasnt even that harsh

JBuenrostro

If it's the driving manual and it's set as a law like I said before I would agree with you then 100% what the consequences were.

Damn, NC has some pretty laws but hey you have to repect them or face the music. I still don't agree with the whole auctioning thing but if it's a law it's a law.

Shackleford

iTrader: (12)

All of those vehicle seizure laws are unconstitutional. They should definitely be challenged in court. Just because something is a law doesn't mean it's LOGICAL/RATIONAL/FAIR/ET CETERA.

If someone is speeding, they're speeding. Period.

cwaldt

iTrader: (4)

[QUOTE=88GTA]

break checking is illegal, at least in california. also, many areas have laws about impeding traffic and also minimum speed laws for certain roads. these are almost never enforced.
QUOTE]

Brake checking may be illegal in Cali. So if I ever go there and something or someone runs out in fron of me with a car behind me I guess I won't brake just so I won't get a brake check violation.

Please who cares why they braked the fact is the cop seen him go over a hundred and then he complains because he got busted. He's acting like the real *****. He knew the consequences before hand but chose to anyway.

Xtremes10

Which of the two things cause more deaths each year? I am willing to bet more people die at the wheel, then from a gun, so your saying a gun is less dangerous then? No, but that doesnt mean that driving a car is safe. The law is there for a reason, dont speed, why? It can kill. Why are there restrictions on guns? because they can KILL! Do you not grasp the concept of how dangerous the two are being that the more dangerous one is the one people use EVERY day.

darrensls1

Don't do the crime if ya can't do the time. Period.

JBuenrostro

[QUOTE=cwaldt]

JBuenrostro

Xtremes10

[QUOTE=LSGunZ28]Sadly, that IS where we differ, because trust me, the WHAT IF, as you state, is MORE than enough deterrent then some stupid ******* in some wigged out POS that thinks he is fast. does no one grip that no matter how fast you are, or how good of a drive you are, THERE IS ALWAYS SOMEONE WITH SOMTHING BETTER THAN YOU! So why should you have to prove it? If you have a truly fast vehicle, and you KNOW its fast, then why should you have to prove it. Its like your in high school, because you want to be the best out there. Its bull ****! I am a ***** because I dont take risks? Too bad, because no matter how good of a drive you THINK you are, you cant control what goes on around, because if your doing 100+ mph, and come around a turn, and there is some animal or a stopped vehicle, no matter what the hell you do, its over.
Im only 17, but your right, he acts as though he is the best driver, and is imperviable. Every kid that I knew once they got their liscense and had a fast vehicle (besides me... dont know what the hell is wrong with me that I didnt do somthing stupid and ruin my vehicle...) thought that they were impervious, invincable, it only happens to other people. Well guess what? three of my best friends died in a terrible crash because they wanted to street race. The driver was ONE HELL OF A DRIVER, but you cant control what else is going on. Two other friends on separate occasions rolled their vehicle to avoid crashing into another vehicle while racing. No matter what, its wrong, and its breaking the law. Like I stated before, i dont agree with the confiscation or even the whole ordeal, and dont mind the simple average race, but when your doing it around people, and dont know what could be coming.... use your commen sense. As LSGun stated, a safe driver, and a good driver have no connection.... sad... because a good driver, knows how to keep it safe. A good driver can control a car, but a SAFE driver knows the limits, and a GREAT driver knows both. I am sorry for being so close minded when people's lives are at risk, but life > 15 seconds of pride you get from destroying some 16yo kid in a honda.

Sparetire

Here in Phoenix we have both Speedworld and Firebird. Even in the very middle of town its not more than an hour to a track, and maybe 20 bucks to race. And Frankly I'll pay 20 bucks so that bullshit excuses about who gets the hit dont crop up. Its right there, on paper, quantitative who owns who. Frankly I think a lot of street racers are pussies. "Its hard to hook" "I dont want to deal with the wait" "Its too expensive"

Blah Blah Blah.
1)Learn to drive and dont build a half-assed setup.
2)Every night out on the streets for me was mostly sitting in a damn parking lot or out in the boonies waiting for some indeterminate something to happen. Like 30 seconds of purpose in one stretch from 10 to 2.
3)Getting tickets is expensive. 20 bucks and an overpriced crappy hotdog is chump change in this hobby. I dont even notice purchases under 100 bucks anymore and Im not anywhere in the realm of rich. Single without a mortgage yeah ( ) but not rich.

And if the drive to the track is so bad, WTF is the drive endlessly around freeways and stop and go traffic just fine for street racing?

Some people live like 2 hours from a track, and that sucks, but seriously, most close at midnight or one and a decent night out street racing does not end untill 2.